Intelligent Design vs. Casino Universe

@Setanta,

But at least hes funny.

2 Replies

@Romeo Fabulini,

do you know how light receptors evolved?

Forget the Pringles bullshit, people out there aren't impressed by that crap.

1 Reply

@farmerman,

I hadn't noticed . . . unless you mean funny as in odd.

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@Frank Apisa,

Here's another--

Quote:

You shouldn't have bothered. It is nonsense.

It is hard to credit why an adult person would post that. As it is with Setanta's nothingness.

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@farmerman,

Quote:

But at least hes funny.

fm means that I'm not funny. He probably didn't see my Heidegger joke about getting Apisa out of bed.

fm has no sense of humour. It is impossible to have a sense of humour when one takes oneself as seriously as fm does. What purports to be a sense of humour, asserted of course, is deployed in the service of self flattery. Laughter as a form of snarling.

Apisa and Setanta are the same. Profound bores.

1 Reply

@farmerman,

An insect colony contains large numbers of individual insects but to an outside observer it displays a unity. Is it possible to say that there is no coordinating agent present, a sort of colony self, and if not what do you think the coordinating agent is which transcends the generations of insects.

1 Reply

@spendius,

Quote:

He probably didn't see my Heidegger joke about getting Apisa out of bed.

And its Ockham punch line.

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@spendius,

Yes I know scientists can examine,analyse and dissect things to find out all their chemical components and write thick textbooks about them, so why can't they actually MAKE one, such as a simple amoeba?.. Smile

AMOEBA- "The isolated plasma membrane of Acanthamoeba castellanii consists of approximately 27% lipid, 37% phosphoglycan, and 37% protein. About 60% of the protein migrates as a polypeptide of 15,000 daltons in sodium dodecyl sulfate-acrylamide gel electrophoresis. The phosphoglycan is resolved electrophoretically into two components which migrate ahead of the major polypeptide band. These three components are also detectable upon electrophoretic analysis of whole amoebae and they do not change in concentration when amoeba homogenates are incubated for 6 hours at 25o. These and other controls support the conclusion that the apparently simple macromolecular composition of the amoeba plasma membrane is not an artifact of the isolation procedure. In some preparations actin is associated with the plasma membranes as a nonmembranous component" - ( From Science website)
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http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g64/PoorOldSpike/swag80_zps72962e87.gif~original

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@Frank Apisa,

Frank Apisa wrote:

I would guess the probability of this happening are about the same as the probability of an "intelligence to make it happen" happening by chance.

1. The probability is not a matter of guessing ... it is calculated under certain assumptions. Viewing it as a guess means that your understanding of the things is too superficial and mediocre.
2. How did you come to know that the probability for the amino acids to emerge out of inorganic matter is 'about the same as' the probability for the amino acids to be a result of an intelligent design. How exactly do you calculate this 'about the same as'. Just don't tell me that you are such great expert in probability that you can assign probability values at rough estimate.
3. What does this " 'intelligence to make it happen' happening by chance" is supposed to mean?

Frank Apisa wrote:

I can never understand why anyone would suggest that this universe and existence of ours is too complicated to just happen ...

Because it really is. Can you tell me what is the probability for the big band to fix 'by chance' my operation system that has been immersed in viruses. What is the probability for the big bang to fix by chance an inflammation of the appendix for example ... and are you ready yo trust your health to the big bank theory? What is the probability for the big bang to reply to your post ... if I decide not to do so. The probability things are much more complex and complicated than they may look like. Much more complex.

Frank Apisa wrote:

Can you explain to me why YOU do that?

I am not doing anything special. This dispute about the intelligent design and the stupid probability happenings is going on for centuries. Nothing new under the sun ... perhaps it would be interesting to know what is the situation above it.

1 Reply

@farmerman,

farmerman wrote:

In order to have it the way that your "Intelligent designer" could fix the problem

Isn't it better to understand at first how did it happen. BTW 'my' 'Intelligent Designer' may not exist at present (if it was the ILF before us, they might have extinct million years ago).

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Farmerman said:

Quote:

@RF- Forget the Pringles bullshit, people out there aren't impressed by that crap

Yes mate, between you and me I'm not too keen on BBQ and Sour Cream flavours myself, I should have posted 'Original flavour" pictures, they're my favourites because they're free of that phoney flavouring additive shite.
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@spendius,

spendius wrote:

Is it possible to say that there is no coordinating agent present

There is 'coordinating agent' present and it is called pheromone, and the question is: How did the big bang 'guessed to design' the pheromone and to provide it at a disposal of the ants and the insects?

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@Herald,

Herald wrote:

Frank Apisa wrote:
I would guess the probability of this happening are about the same as the probability of an "intelligence to make it happen" happening by chance.

1. The probability is not a matter of guessing ... it is calculated under certain assumptions. Viewing it as a guess means that your understanding of the things is too superficial and mediocre.

Yeah…but I suggest neither you nor I have enough facts to make that kind of calculation. So all we can do is to guess.

My guess is the chance of everything happening by chance are equal to the chance of this “intelligence” of yours happening by chance.

Quote:

2. How did you come to know that the probability for the amino acids to emerge out of inorganic matter is 'about the same as' the probability of an intelligent design of the amino acids. How exactly do you calculate this 'about the same as'. Just don't tell me that you are such great expert in probability that you can assign probability values on vague estimate.

Learn to read, Herald. I did not say I “know.” I said I guessed.

Jeez! And stay calm. This is not nearly as serious as you are taking it.

Quote:

3. What does this " 'intelligence to make it happen' happening by chance" is supposed to mean?

Just what it says.

Quote:

Frank Apisa wrote:
I can never understand why anyone would suggest that this universe and existence of ours is too complicated to just happen ...

Because it really is.

Ummm…and so you are going to imagine something much more complicated...and suggest that it just happened…in order to start what you are saying is too complicated itself????

C’mon.

Quote:

Can you tell me what is the probability for the big band to fix 'by chance' my operation system that has been immersed in viruses. What is the probability for the big bang to fix by chance an inflammation of the appendix for example ... and are you ready yo trust your health to the big bank theory? What is the probability for the big bang to reply to your post ... if I decide not to do so. The probability things are much more complex and complicated than they may look like. Much more complex.

No…or Yes…depending upon what you were attempting to say with this gibberish. I really cannot tell.

Quote:

Frank Apisa wrote:
Can you explain to me why YOU do that?

I am not doing anything special. This dispute about the intelligent design and the stupid probability happenings is going on for centuries. Nothing new under the sun ... perhaps it would be interesting to know what is the situation above it.

Ahhh…so you do it because it is not anything special.

Well…"not doing it" also is not anything special…so why don’t you do that?

1 Reply

Setanta said:

Quote:

[RF is] funny as in odd

Thanks mate. Incidentally I googled the word 'Setanta' and see he's an Irish bloke who goes around killing dogs with a sword.
Good for you, there's a hyper yappy little Jack Russell in my street that could do with killing next time you're in Plymouth, i've videod it pissing up peoples doors and might put it on youtube
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1 Reply

@Frank Apisa,

Frank Apisa wrote:

Yeah…but I suggest neither you nor I have enough facts to make that kind of calculation.

It is not that complex. Suppose you believe in the abiogenesis and you have at your disposal five plausible hypothesis as its cause: 1) lightning, 2) UV radiation, 3) metabolism first approach, 4) heterogeneous and 5) extra-terrestrial origin of life.
Suppose you believe in them all ... equally. So you have:
- probability for lightning (to be the cause of the abiogenesis) - 20%
- probability for UV radiation - 20%
- metabolism first approach - 20%
- heterogeneous - 20%, and
- extra-terrestrial origin - 20%
Now suppose you believe in these cases on a priority list. You believe that some of the causes could be more probable than some others.
1. (top priority) - UV radiation
2. metabolism first approach
3. lightning
4. extra-terrestrial origin
5. heterogenesis
Now you put some weight factors to express your belief:
1. probability for UV radiation - 30%
2. metabolism first approach - 25%
3. lightning - 20%
4. extra-terrestrial origin - 15%
5. heterogenesis - 10%
Actually the values don't matter - the most important is to distinguish them in order to reflect your beliefs that they are arranged in a priority list.
Now suppose that the probability for the abiogenesis to be the cause of life is 10^-2. We have then 0.2 x 10^-2 = 2.10^-3 For probabilities less than 10^-3 the number is insignificant ... and you announce only the order: the probability is ten to the power of minus three (in this case.)
So it is not so much difficult to assign and to calculate probability values ... as you are trying to present it.

1 Reply

@Romeo Fabulini,

He didn't use a sword, he drove a hurly ball down the throat of Culain's watch dog. You can't get anything right, can you?

1 Reply

@Herald,

Herald wrote:

Frank Apisa wrote:
Yeah…but I suggest neither you nor I have enough facts to make that kind of calculation.

It is not that complex. Suppose you believe in the abiogenesis and you have at your disposal five plausible hypothesis as its cause: 1) lightning, 2) UV radiation, 3) metabolism first approach, 4) heterogeneous and 5) extra-terrestrial origin of life.
Suppose you believe in them all ... equally. So you have:
- probability for lightning (to be the cause of the abiogenesis) - 20%
- probability for UV radiation - 20%
- metabolism first approach - 20%
- heterogeneous - 20%, and
- extra-terrestrial origin - 20%
Now suppose you believe in these cases on a priority list. You believe that some of the causes could be more probable than some others.
1. (top priority) - UV radiation
2. metabolism first approach
3. lightning
4. extra-terrestrial origin
5. heterogenesis
Now you put some weight factors to express your belief:
1. probability for UV radiation - 30%
2. metabolism first approach - 25%
3. lightning - 20%
4. extra-terrestrial origin - 15%
5. heterogenesis - 10%
Actually the values don't matter - the most important is to distinguish them in order to reflect your beliefs that they are arranged in a priority list.
Now suppose that the probability for the abiogenesis to be the cause of life is 10^-2. We have then 0.2 x 10^-2 = 2.10^-3 For probabilities less than 10^-3 the number is insignificant ... and you announce only the order: the probability is ten to the power of minus three (in this case.)
So it is not so much difficult to assign and to calculate probability values ... as you are trying to present it.

Do it! It is not that hard...so do it.

You might want to look up the work of Ican who used to be here. He did it for years...calculating and calculating.

So...what are the odds?

1 Reply

@Setanta,

Quote:

He didn't use a sword, he drove a hurly ball down the throat of Culain's watch dog. You can't get anything right, can you?

I think Romeo would be just as grateful for a hurly ball to off the yappy dog.

PS--Another kid killed by a dog the other day.

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The only dog I tried to kill was the Alsatian next door to me 25 years ago, they used to let it out into their back yard to **** gone midnight and it barked like a banshee. So I bought a bottle of aspirins, mixed them in a tin of dog food and slung the mess over the fence, but it had no effect on the dog.
I checked the bottle and found i'd bought low-strength "Childrens Aspirins" by mistake, that'd account for their pretty pink colour.
I thought of having another crack at the dog and began toying with the idea of buying a speargun from the local sub-aqua shop, but i was fed up living there anyway so moved house before then.
I've got a souvenir to remember the dog by, namely tinnitus in my left ear caused by being jolted awake by its infernal yapping!
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@Frank Apisa,

Frank Apisa wrote:

So...what are the odds?

Honestly speaking I don't understand your question. What are you asking: How much is the probability in this case (this is only an example – it is not a case) or how much is the probability is some case that you have not specified yet?

If you want to ask 'What is the probability for this & this event happening?' you should make the assumptions first:
we have zero-D space (sterile gravitational singularity)
we have no chemical elements (not even electrons and protons)
we don't know yet whether we have the Higg's boson appeared on the stage or not ... etc.

Q.: What is the probability for the amino acids to emerge under these assumptions: 13 BN years ago - 10 BN years ago - 1 BN years ago - ... etc.?

If you want for the people to chat with you, they should be able to understand you first.

2 Replies

Intelligent Design vs. Casino Universe

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