Intelligent Design vs. Casino Universe

"155 years ago today, Charles Darwin's On the Origin of Species by Means of Natural Selection was published."

     Because there are obvious contradictions that are systematically neglected by the fans of the Big Bang, without even making an effort to hear them. Contradictions without the resolution of which the Big Bang can neither exist ... nor had ever happened.
     Question No.1: Where has the Big Bang taken all that energy from - to create the Universe with all of its kinetic, potential, atomic and subatomic energy ... and how much is that energy in the first place? How much is the 'net energy' of the Universe?
     Second: One cannot claim that it is the Big Bang and not God that has created out of nothing whatsoever, without solving the problem of the Creation itself - whether the Universe has always existed or it has been created at some point of time? If the Universe has always existed, what has exactly been created by the Big Bang?
     Third: Whether the 3D space is created (out of nothing or from dark energy or on the grounds of dark matter or from whatever) or it has been simply constrained from another 3D space ... and what about being constrained from another 11D space ... and why do you exclude the possibility for our hyperspace to be 4D, 5D, 6D ... and its hyperspace to be that 11D, for example.
     Forth: The problem of the missing information - how much of it is missing, and where? ... and how much of it is critically fatal to ever get knowing anything for sure? ... and how many people and organisations are actually looking for the truth? You know that in the early Universe there have been very few stars and you cannot even tell whether this is the set of the stars, the information about which has come to the radio telescope nowadays, and whether there have not been some other stars, the information about which is irretrievably lost by various reasons, both known & unknown - engulfing of stars by black holes, collision of galaxies, annihilation of matter & antimatter etc.
     You don't know anything about the above said aspects for sure, but you are absolutely certain that it is the Big Bang (the stochastic operation of the matter) and not God (the pre-designed processes by an intelligence) that has created the Universe. Then who/what has created the Chaos and/or the Intelligence?
     What about the time - how did it happen so that in the beginning there was nothing and time had not existed, and all of a sudden and out of nowhere enters Big Bang, runs the clock, and starts performing various measures ... like for example creating the Universe.

You're asking the same questions; the big bang theory has been explained, and the evidence provided. Your failure to understand the evidence is your problem; not the physicists who have explained it in layman's terms.

THERE IS NO GOD. YOU CAN'T PROVE YOUR GOD EXISTS. YOU CAN'T CREATE SOMETHING OUT OF NOTHING; WHO CREATED GOD?

Before you can give credit to a creator, you must first prove there is a creator.
You can't; it's that simple.

THE BIG BANG THEORY HAS BEEN EXPLAINED; IT'S THE EXPANSION OF THE UNIVERSE. It's been proven by measuring the distance of starts.

"Theories can't be proven, but they can be disproven." It's up to you to disprove what's known about the big bang theory.

Disprove that the universe is not expanding.

If you really wanted to know the answers to those questions, you could find them online very easily. Therefore, I surmise that they're rhetorical questions.

Which god are you claiming? The Abrahamic one? Your source is therefore the Bible?

The assertion, "THERE IS NO GOD"...

...is an absurdity that pales the absurdities being peddled by the theists here. (And the theists do seem to be peddling absurdities here.)

The assertion "THERE IS NO GOD" CANNOT be anything but a blind guess.

The assertion "there is a GOD" almost certainly is a blind guess, but at least it has the benefit of POSSIBLY being something known.

The assertion "THERE IS NO GOD" CANNOT be known...and cannot be obtained through reason.

The assertion "THERE IS NO GOD" can only be a blind guess.

In a reasonable, logical discussion, neither assertion should be made, but one would think that especially the people who argue that science should lead the way to knowledge...should be intelligent and reasonable enough not to make the absurd assertion, "THERE IS NO GOD."

Not sure if that's directed at me, but I'm pretty sure all I've said is that the arguments for a god presented so far in this thread are shoddy arguments that lack supporting, credible evidence, particularly when stacked up against the arguments for the scientific claims they reject.

Of course, the same reasonning applies to fairies, devils, angels and scores of other legends.

No, it was not, FBM.

I agree with you that the arguments for gods presented here (and quite honestly, elsewhere) are "shoddy" at best. Frankly, there seems to be NO decent arguments to support an assertion "there is a GOD."

My comment had to do with comments from some people who categorically assert, "THERE IS NO GOD."

Neither assertion ought to be made.

The assertion "THERE IS NO GOD" can only be a blind guess...and in a reasonable, logical discussion ought not to be made.

If you are saying that is incorrect, Olivier, say it...and we can discuss your reasons for saying it.

I am saying the same reasonning applies to fairies. To say that fairies don't exist can only be a blind guess... That doesn't have quite the same ring to it though...

I understand what you are saying, Olivier. But your response referred back to what I was saying, so I ask again:

.

It depends on what you call a 'blind guess' and a 'god'. If you can define those concepts precisely, i can try and see what the problem is about.

Do...or do not. There is no try.

You seem to be setting up hoops.

I am not interested.

The assertion "THERE IS NO GOD" can only be a blind guess...and in a reasonable, logical discussion ought not to be made.

If you disagree with that as stated...tell me your disagreement and we can discuss it. If you just want to set up hoops...get someone else to play with you.

All said respectfully as possible, of course.

As much as I would enjoy adding to the already humongous amount of misunderstanding that happens on a2k, i don't think it would be wise for me to lean on a question i don't yet understand.

An ambiguous statement such as yours ought not to be made in any reasonable discussion...

Good.

Anyway...if "the assertion "THERE IS NO GOD" can only be a blind guess" seems ambiguous to you...

...then the comment, "an ambiguous statement such as yours ought not to be made in any reasonable discussion" is as ambiguous...and ought not to be made in any reasonable discussion. (Assuming, of course, we both agree on the meaning of "such as" "ought not" and "reasonable discussion."

Said another way: All that defining crap is for people who want to disagree for no reason other than to disagree...but cannot back their disagreement up.

All said with nothing but the greatest of respect for you, Olivier.

You are one of my favorite foils.

Okay...you have the shovel in hand...so...let's see you dig.

You got used to getting away with a lot of crappy games here, Frank. I don't like your crappy games and I have no more patience for them. You dwell happily in ambiguity and vagueness; I don't. You have much time on your hands; I don't. So either you can ask a precise question, or you're welcome to **** off, you and your 'blind guesses'.

Wake up, Olivier.

You started this with a disagreement (of sorts) with all that nonsense about fairies, angels and crap like that.

If you do not have time for this...don't start it.

Although since you have time for so much digging, I have trouble supposing you are really too busy.



And ya really gotta make a better effort to keep your cool.

No disagreement, just saying the same argument can be made about fairies. To me, gods are like fairies; the concepts are very close: some hypothetical supernatural entity that interfere in our lives, generally in a good way. If you think that 'gods' are something else entirely, pray tell. I am not too sure what you mean by the word.