Intelligent Design vs. Casino Universe

@Herald,

with the use of specific allles in a chickens mouth and the concept of "knock out genes" Science hs been able to recreate chicken embryos bering teeth of their reptilian ancestors.
Genetics didn't wait for you to catch up and deny.

1 Reply

@farmerman,

Its not just me and MJ, using these many "atavisms" of fossil ancestors is already a research proposal to recreate a dinosaur from a chicken (Its going the other way from what Herald was poo pooing)

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-1026340/Jurassic-Park-comes-true-How-scientists-bringing-dinosaurs-life-help-humble-chicken.html

1 Reply

@MontereyJack,

MontereyJack wrote:

You're the one who's disparaging knowledge, in particular the knowledge of evolution

      Said in that way it sounds really horrible. Are you talking about knowledge in general, or about the specific mechanics of the evolution theory - for there is some difference.
      Before the big talk about 'knowledge' you will have to prove at first that the 'theory' of evolution is knowledge at all ... and is not designed as political trump-card to trump over the Church at the time being.
By Def. knowledge is:
      1. Something acquired through personal experience - how many specified, distinguished, verified, validated & tested evolutionary processes do you have in your portfolio of personal experience. Just to mention it - reading and writing scientific ... and pseudoscientific articles, and any publications of any kind in connection with something is not personal experience.
      2. Personal range of acquired information - Do you know what are the key properties of information - plausibility, consistency and authenticity.Which one of the three do you have in mind with the 'theory' of evolution, for I cannot remember.
      3. Theoretical or practical understanding - The whole understanding of the evolution so far is reduced to hybridization of DNA sequences from various species and varieties in order to make for example a glowing silk (produced by GMO silk-worm) on the grounds of combining its genes with the genes of a glowing jelly fish. This is one of the best results achieved thus far - and BTW it is not by evolution, but rather by ID activities in the lab. Nothing about any evolution is proven with that case, except for the possibility of making hybridization of the species.
      4. Well informed, intelligent - If you are so well informed and highly intelligent evolutionary product, why don't you explain to us how has your personal intelligence appeared on the grounds of evolutionary stochastic pure-chemical processes, as FM claims. How are the genes formed by 'pure chemistry of polymers', and how do they start operating ... and executing tasks that have nothing to do with any chemical properties.

0 Replies

@farmerman,

farmerman wrote:

... to recreate a dinosaur from a chicken

Why is that for? If you want to prove that you understand something of evolution and biotechnology you don't need to make yourself a clown, for you may do a lot of other much more sensible things, like for example to develop methods for regeneration of tissues after pre-assigned DNA sequence.

1 Reply

@Herald,

"reassembly" of an ancestral form from its evolutionary progeny is certainly a shot across the bow of any "theory" that preaches otherwise.

They haven't done it yet, its merely a proposal that proposes to demonstrate how genetic development can be made to happen in reverse.

What'v the IIDers got to argue with? Irreducible complexity again?

Face it, theyre losing the debate big time.

1 Reply

@farmerman,

farmerman wrote:

"reassembly" of an ancestral form from its evolutionary progeny is certainly a shot across the bow of any "theory" that preaches otherwise.

     FM, you are not making investigation in evolution - you are making GMO experiments of the unexpected ... and this is another branch of science (Agriculture).
     If you are really interested in proving the evolution theory you should be able to prove its turning points and key features - the appearance of bacteria out of the amino-acid broth by means of a lightning. This is Act 1, Part 1 of the Evolution Saga: lights, camera - action: Enters Flash in search of amino-acids ... to which to breathe life
     The second milestone is information encoding: how is the information encoded ... and where has it come from before that (incl. the know-how of its encoding into the DNA sequences)
     The third question is: is the Earth designed and are we an ID product? The Earth is so unique in comparison to everything else around it that it is not entirely to be excluded.
     The next question is: what is the difference between Life and Death. There is a Buddhist saying that: Life and Death are one and the same thing - but this is at a highly spiritual level of contemplation. What are Life and Death at bio-level?
     The next question is: what is Intelligence? ... and how many instances of it are there in the Universe? Are the dolphins and the Elephants, for example intelligent? Is the Varan de Komodo intelligent on its way, after having 6 delay death bite poisons ('bioactive enzymes' as you call them)? Have the Dinosaurs been intelligent - if they have managed to survive on this very same planet for over 160 MN years and we haven't completed even half a million and are about to self-destroy us by exhausting to ground zero the resources and by destroying the environment in which we are living.
     The hybridization of reptilian teeth into a poor bird is your least problem. You may produce thousands of birds with various teeth and yet you may still not understand how the DNA - and the evolution (if exists) - work. This might be useful if you have decided to become a veterinary dentist.

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@Herald,

Those things have already been shown by nature and by human manipulation.

Where have you been all these years?

Bacteria such as flu change from year to year in trying to defeat the immunizations that humans develop.

That you even have to ask what the difference is between life and death, you need to go back to grade school level science and learn the basics of biology.

2 Replies

@cicerone imposter,

Quote:

Those things have already been shown by nature and by human manipulation.

Where have you been all these years?

Bacteria such as flu change from year to year in trying to defeat the immunizations that humans develop.

That you even have to ask what the difference is between life and death, you need to go back to grade school level science and learn the basics of biology.

Meaning????

basics of biology? what if they are deeply flawed?
biologist etc don't even know how the human body realy works!

They have not even a clue!

0 Replies

@Herald,

Quote:

FM, you are not making investigation in evolution - you are making GMO experiments of the unexpected ... and this is another branch of science (Agriculture).

You are quite simple minded do you know that?

Quote:

the appearance of bacteria out of the amino-acid broth by means of a lightning. This is Act 1, Part 1 of the Evolution Saga: lights, camera - action: Enters Flash in search of amino-acids ... to which to breathe life

Yep, quite simple minded. The fundamentalists have got you by your tail.

PS, why don't you takethese areas of inquiry up, since they seem more aligned with your pre conceived world view.

Quote:

The hybridization of reptilian teeth into a poor bird is your least problem. You may produce thousands of birds with various teeth and yet you may still not understand how the DNA - and the evolution

This experiment is all about working only if DNA and its function is understood. Using a chickens own DNA and "Turning functional groups off and on" and looking at the results does satisfy much of our understanding of the pathway of evolution. If you are a bit too obtuse to understand, well, that's a problem with your education, not mine.

2 Replies

@farmerman,

Quote:

If you are a bit too obtuse to understand, well, that's a problem with your education, not mine.

lol, that is an idiotic one, and what it really means is:

"if you don't understand because it is flawed and I can't explain it any better, then it is all your fault."

1 Reply

@Quehoniaomath,

Ill be sure to include you in the list of living breathing morons here on A2K. It means exactly what I said. I need no idot like you to try to change it.

1 Reply

@farmerman,

Quote:

Ill be sure to include you in the list of living breathing morons here on A2K. It means exactly what I said. I need no idot like you to try to change it.

well, well, well. I didn't have to wait for his Ad Hominems!! Thank you for making my case, again!

However, I know you don't want to understand it but if you write
"It means exactly what I said" then that is exactly the problem farmerlittleboy.

Get it? I know I know.

In the meantime you have given NO EVIDENCE for evolution AND you never explained why you choose that particular religion called evolution.
Do you have time now to explain?

1 Reply

@Quehoniaomath,

Hey don't thank me, I need only respond to your worldviews in a truthful fashion. You supply the entertainment.
When you read Behes new book lets debate it. OK Einstein?

1 Reply

@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

Those things have already been shown by nature and by human manipulation.

No, they have not. Nobody has succeeded so far to produce life out of amino-acids by a lightning.

cicerone imposter wrote:

Where have you been all these years?

In the past 200 million years I personally have not been born - I don't know about you.

cicerone imposter wrote:

Bacteria such as flu change from year to year in trying to defeat the immunizations that humans develop.

... and that is why they have no species ... and beautiful taxonomy. If all the species are evolving like the viruses there will be no species at all - do you understand that. All of us will be one biosphere continuum (as your fellow big-banists are fond of saying).

cicerone imposter wrote:

That you even have to ask what the difference is between life and death, you need to go back to grade school level science and learn the basics of biology.

How can you explain that the cells of the lungs continue to live several months after the clinical death of the body ... and what does that mean?

1 Reply

@farmerman,

farmerman wrote:

This experiment is all about working only if DNA and its function is understood. Using a chickens own DNA and "Turning functional groups off and on" and looking at the results does satisfy much of our understanding of the pathway of evolution.

Why I have the suspicion that you don't have even a clue of what you are doing. You don't need 'to prove' the evolution - you have to discover it. By turning on and off the engines of an airplane you will never prove that it (the airplane) has evolved from reptiles ... into a bird. By suggestolizing a priori the inferences you are actually f'cking up all the opportunities to ever discover the truth.

1 Reply

@farmerman,

Quote:

Hey don't thank me, I need only respond to your worldviews in a truthful fashion. You supply the entertainment.
When you read Behes new book lets debate it. OK Einstein?

Why, You are simply not able too!
If I see your postings you are making mistake after mistake
and then you build on those mistakes other mistakes!
heel, you can't even see it yourself.

And what is your obsession with the Emperor's Clothes? lol

1 Reply

@Herald,

are you taking some heavy medications? Your arguments are losing huge handholds onto whatever reality you are trying to cling. Youre not making any sense at all.

I actually believe you are afraid of the truth and whatever would be discovered.

2 Replies

@Quehoniaomath,

That's merely a copout saying that you are afraid to engage in spirited debate based upon facts and evidence. Reqd Behe's latest book. YOU WILL BE SURPRISED WHERE IT LEADS YOU. It opens and introduces the "limits of evolution" nd negates your entire POV's.
How can you try to apply a text to underpin your points , when it clearly does not. Behe may be fucked up but hes not an idiot .

1 Reply

@farmerman,

They are afraid; their lifelong belief system would crumble before their eyes if they admit to understanding the facts presented to them about scientific facts about evolution. They have devoted most of their lives in their belief of their god, and they can't take that extra step to accept what's in front of them.

How does one admit they were wrong their entire life?

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@cicerone imposter,

Quahog is posting Behes book as if he read it. ll the while Behe's own opinions are based upon a "Theistic evolution" base. Quahog must disappear up his asshole each evening .
Herals has no idea of what hes even talking about

1 Reply

Intelligent Design vs. Casino Universe

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