I am a Buddhist and if anyone wants to question my beliefs then they are welcome to do so...

If one ties seven knots in a rope one cannot undo the first one without untying the other six first.

you criticise others for taking guesses

I defy you to find any post of mine that criticizes anyone for making any kind of guess.

You will never find one...so do not even bother to look.

I do criticize the practice of making guesses...and calling them "beliefs"...or making guesses...and pretending they are knowledge.

There are somethings I will not guess about, because I realize I do not have enough information upon which to base a meaningful guess.

-Peoples feelings are a part of reality
-you don't know the true nature of reality
-therefore you don't know the true nature of peoples feelings
-you do not make guesses about the true nature of reality
-therefore you cannot make guesses about peoples feelings

...but that is what you've done

-A persons intent is part of reality
-you don't know the true nature of reality
-therefore you don't know the true nature of a persons intent
-therefore when another person says 'what JLN means to say is X, Y & A' you can't call it nonsense, because you do not know, and are not willing to take guesses on reality

...but this is what you've done

vikorr wrote:

you criticise others for taking guesses

Frank Apisa wrote:

I defy you to find any post of mine that criticizes anyone for making any kind of guess.

You will never find one...so do not even bother to look.

I do criticize the practice of making guesses...and calling them "beliefs"...or making guesses...and pretending they are knowledge.

Uh...the contradiction !

In any event - Just as I've been criticising you for doing, when you :
- make statements about other peoples feelings (which you obviously believe, and which you present as fact, and which is a guess on your part)
- and because you obviously believe what you are saying when you call other peoples interpretation of a persons intent 'nonsense'

Frank Apisa wrote:

There are somethings I will not guess about, because I realize I do not have enough information upon which to base a meaningful guess.

Wait...meaningful guesses are aloud now? Educated guesses are aloud? Why, not once did you bring this up when talking to IGM & JL about budhism. You could simply have asked 'what makes it an educated guess' or 'what makes it a meaningful guess'...but No, you wanted them to admit that it was a flat out guess, no shades, none....

...hence part of the reasoning for my statement that your views were extreme.

Hence, why I find your stance, and your taking guesses about reality (rather minor parts of reality), to be hypocritical.

vikorr...obviously you have some kind of need to consider me to be hypocritical.

I have no idea of what all those comments are at the beginning of your post, but this effort of yours was one of your worst.

Quote:

vikorr...obviously you have some kind of need to consider me to be hypocritical.

Another guess at the reality of others Frank (you do say you don't guess at reality)

Whatever Frank...keep demanding of others what you don't demand of yourself.

You have a seriously flawed view of yourself in this aspect.

I do not know the true nature of the REALITY of existence.

If you do...share what you know and let's discuss it. If you want to discuss me instead...we can do that.

I do not demand anything of others that I do not demand of myself. Your view of me...and of the issue...is so flawed that you ought really not to be judging others on the issue.

What exactly is "enlightenment" anyway?

Enlightenment just means your mind is fully closed.

After all, once you are completely in tune with the truth, why do you need to consider anything else. People find this to be a comforting and empowering feeling.

Quote:

I do not know the true nature of the REALITY of existence.

If you do...share what you know and let's discuss it. If you want to discuss me instead...we can do that.

Frank, this thread is not about the true nature of reality...that's a hijack of this thread.

Nor do I have any interest in such. I've already stated this several times.

Quote:

I do not demand anything of others that I do not demand of myself. Your view of me...and of the issue...is so flawed that you ought really not to be judging others on the issue.

Absolutely you demand of others what you don't yourself abide by...that's seen throughout the latter part of this thread.

In regards to 'judging' :
- it's not humanly possible not to judge - it's hardwired into us. Many people simply don't admit it.
- how do you judge who you like and don't like?
- how do you judge if someone is a good friend?
- how do you judge if an action is good for you?
- etc.
- we humans judge most every second of every day...our mind is subjective (otherwise we would have objective minds that viewed reality correctly)

What I believe in (rather than a concept of 'not judging') is understanding, empathy, compassion, firmness, self-responsibility, awareness, etc.

IGM said- "..enlightenment is beyond elaboration but in words it is said to be unconditioned happiness. This means that it is an experience that persists even when in physical pain.."
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Bit like Christianity then-
"I know what it is to be in need, and I know what it is to have plenty. I have learned the secret of being content in any and every situation, whether well fed or hungry, whether living in plenty or in want"- (Bible: Philippians 4:12)
except that Christians don't set themselves on fire or run through the streets in protest at the government..