The State of Florida vs George Zimmerman: The Trial

@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

With people like you, making it personal seems appropriate - to show the world your racial bigotry.

Yes, we are talking about 2013, and what still happens to blacks in this country.
You don't notice, because you are a bigot. You defend the atrocious actions against blacks, and I try to advocate for those who still don't have equality.

You'll never figure that one out in a million years.

1. It is not appropriate to use name calling in debate, particularly when your debating opponent is being perfectly polite.
2. I am not and have never been a racial bigot. Believing that Zimmerman could have been defending his life doesn't automatically make one a bigot. I have never defended atrocious actions against members of any race and you can search my thousands of posts here without finding an example of that.
3. Believing that there is bigotry in every race, which is the sort of idea I expressed, doesn't make one a bigot.
4. You have now made a serious allegation about me personally, and an untrue one, and I would like to hear you present some evidence (not more name calling) to support it.

1 Reply

@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

With people like you, making it personal seems appropriate - to show the world your racial bigotry.

EVERYONE is rightfully entitled to his own opinions
about anything and everything, including race.

Your opinions are no more valid than Brandon 's.

David

1 Reply

@Brandon9000,

Sue me if you don't like my attacks.

Zimmerman did not defend himself. He followed an innocent 17 year old kid, determined that he was up to no good, then shot him dead.

If Zimmerman had followed a white kid in the same manner he did Trayvon, and shot him dead, you'll never hear the end of it from you whiteys.

But since Trayvon is black, it was okay to "stand his ground."

Self defense? Give me a break! Zimmerman had a gun. The kid had a box of candy.

If it was your 17 year old kid with a box of candy walking home from the store, and Zimmerman shot him dead, I'm sure you'll arrive at the same conclusion - that Zimmerman defended himself. What a dork!

3 Replies

@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

Sue me if you don't like my attacks.

Zimmerman did not defend himself. He followed an innocent 17 year old kid, determined that he was up to no good, then shot him dead.

If Zimmerman had followed a white kid in the same manner he did Trayvon, and shot him dead, you'll never hear the end of it from you whiteys.

But since Trayvon is black, it was okay to "stand his ground."

Self defense? Give me a break! Zimmerman had a gun. The kid had a box of candy.

You have publicly called me a bigot and I insist that you either provide evidence to support it or retract it. When asked to support your various opinions with evidence and logic, you invariably use insult instead, which is a pity.

As for suing you, you clearly feel anonymous here, which probably explains your behavior. I am not childish enough to sue you based on your untrue personal statements about me up to this point, but if I did ever feel that talking to a lawyer was warranted, I suspect that you personally could be held responsible for your posts.

2 Replies

@farmerman,

David has made it clear that the only moral imperative is "be the last one standing."

1 Reply

@Brandon9000,

It's "evidenced" from your posts. Nothing more needs to be shown.

You still haven't answered this statement.

Quote:

If it was your 17 year old kid with a box of candy walking home from the store, and Zimmerman shot him dead, I'm sure you'll arrive at the same conclusion - that Zimmerman defended himself.

Right or wrong, and explain why?

1 Reply

@DrewDad,

DrewDad wrote:

David has made it clear that the only moral imperative is "be the last one standing."

That is an interesting way to put it, DD; thank u.

I guess we know the penalty for failing to abide by that.

David

0 Replies

@cicerone imposter,

Quote:

He followed an innocent 17 year old kid, determined that he was up to no good, then shot him dead.

So Trayvon did not knocked Zimmerman on the ground breaking his nose in doing so and then got on top of him and kept hitting him and pounding his head on the sidewalk?

He just walked up to Trayvon and shot him?

You are of that opinion and the hell with the witnesses and the physical evidence otherwise?

1 Reply

@BillRM,

There never would have been anything if Zimmerman had stayed in his car as he was told, but he wanted to play wanna be cop.

If you're a witness to a crime, would you call 911 and let the police handle it, or will you intervene when they tell you to stay in your car, because the police is on their way?

This is what Thomas wrote a few pages back, and I agree with this.

Quote:

In Florida, black parents should teach their children to shoot so they can kill the racial profiler first and then claim self-defense. Sure, this may sound insane. But under Florida's current laws around standing your ground and defending yourself, that's the logical next step.

It was not necessary or for any reason for Zimmerman to leave his car. NONE.

2 Replies

@Brandon9000,

cicerone imposter wrote:

Sue me if you don't like my attacks.

Zimmerman did not defend himself. He followed an innocent 17 year old kid, determined that he was up to no good, then shot him dead.

If Zimmerman had followed a white kid in the same manner he did Trayvon, and shot him dead, you'll never hear the end of it from you whiteys.

But since Trayvon is black, it was okay to "stand his ground."

Self defense? Give me a break! Zimmerman had a gun. The kid had a box of candy.

Brandon9000 wrote:

You have publicly called me a bigot and I insist that you either provide evidence to support it or retract it.
When asked to support your various opinions with evidence and logic, you invariably use insult instead, which is a pity.

That is the most of which he is mentally capable, Brandon: mindless emotion.
Can u see from his posts that he cannot reason soundly??
It is error to expect better from him.

David

0 Replies

@cicerone imposter,

Quote:

There never would have been anything if Zimmerman had stayed in his car as he was told, but he wanted to play wanna be cop

An if he had also stay home that night or whatever however he did nothing to warden an attacked on him by Trayvan either legally or morally,

It was Trayvan actions in attacking Zimmerman that resulted in his own death.

2 Replies

@BillRM,

Don't get too stupid; he was the one who confronted Trayvon - with a gun in his possession.

0 Replies

@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

It's "evidenced" from your posts. Nothing more needs to be shown...

You have made a specific and serious allegation about me. How is it "evidenced from my posts?" Or is this yet another case in which you are unable to support any of your ideas with argument?

1 Reply

@BillRM,

Quote:

There never would have been anything if Zimmerman had stayed in his car as he was told, but he wanted to play wanna be cop

BillRM wrote:

An if he had also stay home that night or whatever however he did nothing to warden an attacked on him by Trayvan either legally or morally,

It was Trayvan actions in attacking Zimmerman that resulted in his own death.

Yes; that is an accurate summary
of this whole misadventure:
A black attempted murderer was killed during his felonious act
by his victim, who had the presence of mind to implement his 2nd Amendment rights. Good shooting!

This shud inspire all citizens of Florida (and elsewhere)
to use their 2nd Amendment rights, wherever thay go.

Its better to HAVE a gun and not need it
than it is to NEED a gun and NOT have it.

David

0 Replies

@Brandon9000,

How many times will I have to repost this question before you answer it?

Quote:

You still haven't answered this statement.

If it was your 17 year old kid with a box of candy walking home from the store, and Zimmerman shot him dead, I'm sure you'll arrive at the same conclusion - that Zimmerman defended himself.

True or false, and why?

2 Replies

@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

How many times will I have to repost this question before you answer it?

Quote:
You still haven't answered this statement.

If it was your 17 year old kid with a box of candy walking home from the store, and Zimmerman shot him dead,
I'm sure you'll arrive at the same conclusion - that Zimmerman defended himself.

True or false, and why?

I 'll take the question:
it DEPENDS on Zimmy 's REASON for defending himself.
For instance, if my 17 year old son were the first to become violent
and if he had smacked Zimmy in the face, knocking him over backward,
and then pounded his head on the ambient cement, then I 'd apologize to Zimmy
for that abuse by which my son had disgraced his family.
In that circumstance, I 'd offer to pay Zimmy 's medical bills.

David

0 Replies

@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

How many times will I have to repost this question before you answer it?

Quote:
You still haven't answered this statement.

If it was your 17 year old kid with a box of candy walking home from the store, and Zimmerman shot him dead, I'm sure you'll arrive at the same conclusion - that Zimmerman defended himself.

True or false, and why?

If it were my kid, I would probably have some idea about his character and whether Zimmerman's story might be true or not. I would almost certainly have some emotional attachment to him. However, the question isn't what my emotional state would be if my kid were shot. It's whether it could be shown in court beyond a reasonable doubt that Zimmerman did not fire his gun with a reasonable idea that he was acting in self defense. I don't know what happened between the two of them, but in the trial, Zimmerman was not legally guilty unless the state could make this case.

1 Reply

@firefly,

firefly wrote:

If Trayvon had been white, and Zimmerman black, do you think Zimmerman would have not been arrested the night of the shooting?

I don't know. I do know that Zimmerman would have been arrested here in New Jersey, even if white. That's because under New Jersey law, he would have had a duty to retreat from a guy he thought "was up to no good", "maybe on drugs or something", and apparently checking out houses for a future burglary. After calling 911, he would have had a legal duty to stand back and give the cops a chance to do their jobs.

So, call me naive if you want, but the Zimmerman case isn't primarily about race for me. It's about the stand-your-ground mentality and the crazy consequences it has on the way states apply the law around self-defense.

1 Reply

@Brandon9000,

You wrote,

Quote:

If it were my kid, I would probably have some idea about his character and whether Zimmerman's story might be true or not. I would almost certainly have some emotional attachment to him. However, the question isn't what my emotional state would be if my kid were shot. It's whether it could be shown in court beyond a reasonable doubt that Zimmerman did not fire his gun with a reasonable idea that he was acting in self defense. I don't know what happened between the two of them, but in the trial, Zimmerman was not legally guilty unless the state could make this case.

I agree with your conclusion. That's what I've been saying about this trial; the prosecution did not prove their case, and the defense did an excellent job to show the prosecution could not prove "beyond a reasonable doubt," and I agreed with the jury's decision.

Over and beyond that, the real question for all of us are 1. did Trayvon Martin get a fair trial, 2. did the prosecution do a good job, and 3) do you agree with "stand your ground?"

Those who cannot see that this was injustice by the laws of Florida can't possibly see the inequality for this young man who hasn't even lived yet. That he happened to be black was the elephant in the room that could not be brought up by the prosecution per the judge's instructions.

This case was definitely racial profiling at its worst. Zimmerman said (on the record) "those assholes get away all the time."

After he called the police, he had no business following Trayvon. The police dispatcher told him to stay in his car because the police are on their way.

Finally, we know Zimmerman lied. That's also on the record. It's the failure of the prosecution to have proved their case.

2 Replies

@cicerone imposter,

Quote:

After he called the police, he had no business following Trayvon. The police dispatcher told him to stay in his car because the police are on their way.

WRONG WRONG WRONG the dispatcher said you do not have to do that as far as following him is concern. There was nothing about staying in his car or anywhere else for that matter.

1 Reply

The State of Florida vs George Zimmerman: The Trial

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