The State of Florida vs George Zimmerman: The Trial

@Frank Apisa,

Quote:

You do not know the mechanics of the encounter, Bill. Trayvon may have attacked Zimmerman...but only after Zimmerman first attacked him.

Once more for that to be true you would need to buy into a man ten years older then Trayvon could attacked him and leave not a damn mark of any kind on him while Trayvon could then knocked him to the ground and begin to pound his head onto the sidewalk.

Oh and you would also need to assume that Zimmerman knowing that the police that he had called could show up at any moment would started a fight anyway.

Not to mention text messages and such by Trayvon bragging what a great fighter he happen to be.

2 Replies

@OmSigDAVID,

OmSigDAVID wrote:

OmSigDAVID wrote:

cicerone imposter wrote:
The fact that Zimmerman continue to follow Trayvon after he called the police, Zimmerman is the pursuer and attacker by default. If he stayed in his car, nothing would have happened. Since Trayvon did not commit any crime, the police would have to release him to continue his walk home.

Frank Apisa wrote:
They simply cannot see anything past their need to defend a gun owner, ci. I realize the effort to reason with them is futile, but to just let them prevail without a fight is an insult to humanity.
U authoritarians insist upon ASSUMING
without proof, without any evidence, that there is something rong
with following someone in public. That is an insult to logic.
Following someone is a perfectly lawful, moral, decent and honorable thing to DO.
I invited u to follow me, before we go to dinner.

Frank Apisa wrote:
You insist without proof that I think
there is something wrong with following someone.
Thank u for correcting me; it aids understanding.

Frank Apisa wrote:

I am not talking about following someone...I am talking about stalking someone...
which is what Zimmerman was doing with Martin.
Please define the distinction that u r making between following n stawking.

All stalking involves following, however not all following is stalking.

Stalking involves a determination to pursue...to harass or otherwise intrude on privacy of the individual being pursued.

Quote:

Zimmy lamented on the 911 tape that: "these punks always get away"
and the 911 operator asked him for a more specific location.
He followed martin for a period of time, to help police find him.
That 's very helpful, civic-minded, naborly n decent.

You certainly have a right to think that, David...and I am pretty sure Zimmerman thought that way.

But because he has a reason for stalking Martin does not make the stalking any less stalking.

Quote:

He agreed to end his surveillance when the 911 operator suggested
that he do so. While he was looking for the location, trying to find
street signs, etc, martin jumped him n pounded him; sadist.
I take the inference that he wanted to brag to his MMA friends
of his beating the hell out of a white. (Remember the text qua
one of martin's victims failing to bleed sufficiently??)

C'mon, David. You have no idea of how the event played out other than what Zimmerman said occurred. And I needed point out that Zimmerman had plenty of reason to slant things the way he wanted. He had just shot a guy to death.

Quote:

Frank Apisa wrote:
Anyhow...their paths crossed because Zimmerman simply would not stay put...
He was being a nice guy; trying to find the location
for the police. Good credit to him!!!

You have a right to think that...and I have a right to have my skin crawl at the thought that you do.

The rest of your post is absurd, David...and so far beneath you it ought to make YOUR skin crawl.

1 Reply

@Frank Apisa,

BillRM wrote:

Quote:
ONCE HE CALLED THE POLICE, HIS RESPONSIBILITY AS A NEIGHBORHOOD WATCH ENDED. HE JUST NEEDED TO STAY IN HIS CAR. THAT'S NEIGHBORHOOD WATCH POLICY.

Neighbor watch policy have zero force of law and does not limit Zimmerman rights in any manner so who give a **** about such policies.

Zimmerman have as must rights to be on the public streets as Trayvon and he also have a hundred percent right to follow him on the public streets.

Trayvon have zero right to attack him for doing so.

Frank Apisa wrote:

You do not know the mechanics of the encounter, Bill. Trayvon may have attacked Zimmerman...but only after Zimmerman first attacked him.

WE DO NOT KNOW...and we only have Zimmerman's word for what happened. Martin also had the poor taste to die of the gunshot wound to his chest.

On the basis of THAT there never shud have been a trial.

Frank, I have remarked several times
that all martin had to do to remain alive, intact, in harmony
was be nice. I pointed out that last summer in NY,
I was confronted around 4 AM; I was in a soft, nostalgic, pleasant mood
and no one was in the slightest danger; no one 's head beaten
on the street, no one got shot. Will u comment on that
and compare it to martin's case??

0 Replies

@BillRM,

BillRM wrote:

Quote:
You do not know the mechanics of the encounter, Bill. Trayvon may have attacked Zimmerman...but only after Zimmerman first attacked him.

Once more for that to be true you would need to buy into a man ten years older then Trayvon could attacked him and leave not a damn mark of any kind on him while Trayvon could then knocked him to the ground and begin to pound his head onto the sidewalk.

Actually...if you opened your mind...you would not have to do any of those things. A confrontation occurred because Zimmerman was stalking Martin. It ended with the death of Martin. Who started what will always be a mystery.

Quote:

Oh and you would also need to assume that Zimmerman knowing that the police that he had called could show up at any moment would started a fight anyway.

And you think Zimmerman's conduct recently shows he would NOT do that???

Are you actually thinking before you post?

Quote:

Not to mention text messages and such by Trayvon bragging what a great fighter he happen to be.

Oh my god...a teenage boy bragging that is his tough.

What is this world coming to.

Wake up, Bill!

3 Replies

@Frank Apisa,

Quote:

Stalking involves a determination to pursue...to harass or otherwise intrude on privacy of the individual being pursued

I would assume that anyone who was scoping out an area for future robberies would consider that Zimmerman was harassing him...LOL

Strange when I was going around for the 2010 census and was question by people in the neighborhood I did not feel harass in any way or in any manner.

If they had instead follow me and called in the police to question me I would also had have no problem with that either.

1 Reply

@Frank Apisa,

Quote:

Actually...if you opened your mind...you would not have to do any of those things. A confrontation occurred because Zimmerman was stalking Martin. It ended with the death of Martin. Who started what will always be a mystery.

Strange as if I had been follow by Zimmerman that night I would not had feel stalk and more then likely would had call out to him in a friendly manner.

I would not have knocked him down or pull my own gun on him or any other silliness.

Trayvon is responsible for his own death no one else is.

1 Reply

@Frank Apisa,

Quote:

Oh my god...a teenage boy bragging that is his tough.

Strange I do not remember bragging about beating others up as a late teenager.

Physical conflicts of such a nature in my circle ended at the end of grade school.

I surely at the age of 17 would never dream of attacking an adult on the public streets due to him annoying me.

My parents would had ream me for doing any such thing just to start with.

2 Replies

@BillRM,

But, like Zimmerman, you carry your gun - just in case you want to become a vigilante - like him. You don't have anger issues at all, but you carry a gun - because you're a chicken little - and you may have to 'defend' yourself.

You prefer killing somebody rather than having a scuffle.

1 Reply

@BillRM,

BillRM wrote:

Quote:
Stalking involves a determination to pursue...to harass or otherwise intrude on privacy of the individual being pursued

I would assume that anyone who was scoping out an area for future robberies would consider that Zimmerman was harassing him...LOL

Strange when I was going around for the 2010 census and was question by people in the neighborhood I did not feel harass in any way or in any manner.

If they had instead follow me and called in the police to question me I would also had have no problem with that either.

Your problem is of a different nature, Bill.

0 Replies

@BillRM,

BillRM wrote:

Quote:
Actually...if you opened your mind...you would not have to do any of those things. A confrontation occurred because Zimmerman was stalking Martin. It ended with the death of Martin. Who started what will always be a mystery.

Strange as if I had been follow by Zimmerman that night I would not had feel stalk and more then likely would had call out to him in a friendly manner.

I would not have knocked him down or pull my own gun on him or any other silliness.

Trayvon is responsible for his own death no one else is.

What pride you show in such a bunch of disgusting thoughts, Bill.

1 Reply

@BillRM,

BillRM wrote:

Quote:
Oh my god...a teenage boy bragging that is his tough.

Strange I do not remember bragging about beating others up as a late teenager.

Physical conflicts of such a nature in my circle ended at the end of grade school.

I surely at the age of 17 would never dream of attacking an adult on the public streets due to him annoying me.

My parents would had ream me for doing any such thing just to start with.
[/quote]

Well some people are not as lucky as you, Bill. A bit of empathy might reintroduce you to the human race.

1 Reply

@Frank Apisa,

BillRM, the moron, still insists that this homicide occurred on "public streets" --this occurred on private property, within a private gated community, where a guest in that community had every right to walk home without being stalked or menaced by a wacko wannabe cop, who was disregarding the rules of the neighborhood watch, both by following the teen and by being armed while doing so.

And the same lousy judgment the hot-headed Zimmerman showed that night in February 2012, he demonstrated again this September, when he impulsively showed up at his former home, in a state of anger, and provoked an altercation with his father-in-law, and made menacing gestures indicating he might pull out a gun, causing the Police Chief in that area to call him a "ticking time bomb" and "Another Aurora or Sandy Hook waiting to happen."

And it's the same lousy judgment he showed, that led to his arrest last month, when, instead of leaving her home, he threw his girlfriend out of her own home and barricaded himself inside it, with his stockpile of guns, refusing to open the door for the police.

Thank goodness, that as a condition of his current bail, he's prohibited from going near guns.

Trayvon Martin had no history of problems managing anger, nor did he have any history of provoking or instigating confrontations, or of attacking, or assaulting, or threatening anyone. The same cannot be said of Zimmerman, who has such a history both before and after he killed Martin.

That makes Zimmerman's story of "an attack" less then credible, and suggests that he provoked the frightened teen into punching him once in self-defense before they struggled over his gun. And Zimmerman instigated the entire situation, and caused an unnecessary and avoidable death, by stalking the teen in the dark, rather than just remaining in his car, or driving away.

And Zimmerman hasn't stopped menacing, and instigating, and threatening people since that night...

And there is no one to blame for Zimmerman's current arrest, and legal woes, except Zimmerman himself.

0 Replies

Quote:

And if Zimmerman (whose previous aggressive behavior was not disclosed to the jury) was trying to convince the world he is simply a gentle, law-abiding person who felt threatened and shot a dangerous teenager, he's blown that strategy. Since the acquittal, Zimmerman has posed for pictures at a gun manufacturer, been arrested for speeding (seeming stunned when the officer didn't recognize him) and gotten into a domestic dispute with his estranged wife. And recently, Zimmerman was at it again, charged with pointing a gun at his girlfriend, breaking a glass table, forcing her out of her home and barricading himself in the house.
.
.
.
But the event certainly indicates a pattern, one in which Zimmerman uses guns to get his way

http://www.usnews.com/opinion/blogs/susan-milligan/2013/12/02/george-zimmerman-marissa-alexander-and-the-murkiness-of-gun-laws

lets break this down

Quote:

Zimmerman has posed for pictures at a gun manufacturer,

no gun used to get his way

Quote:

been arrested for speeding

no gun used to get his way

Quote:

gotten into a domestic dispute with his estranged wife.

no gun used to get his way

Quote:

pointing a gun at his girlfriend, breaking a glass table, forcing her out of her home and barricading himself in the house.

accused by one person with massive credibility problems that he tried to use a gun to get his way.

the alleged evidence does not support the charge.

1 Reply

@hawkeye10,

You,

Quote:

accused by one person with massive credibility problems that he tried to use a gun to get his way.

Talking about yourself, heh? Makes sense; you've never responded to any of my challenges; not one! Talk about credibility problems, you're at the top of the class. LOL Mr. Green

1 Reply

@cicerone imposter,

Quote:

But, like Zimmerman, you carry your gun - just in case you want to become a vigilante

Just in case some hoodlum or hoodlums wish to rob me after beating the **** out of me.

Have a friend that I had a picture of her face somewhere that showed the results of her being robbed in the back parking lot of her restaurant where a armed security guard was looking out for her customers in the front parking lot.

After that beating she never went to her car without having her hands on her gun.

1 Reply

@Frank Apisa,

Quote:

What pride you show in such a bunch of disgusting thoughts, Bill.

LOL Zimmerman should had allowed himself to be either killed or cripple by Trayvon I assume.

1 Reply

@Frank Apisa,

Quote:

Well some people are not as lucky as you, Bill. A bit of empathy might reintroduce you to the human race.

I have a lot of empathy for Zimmerman and his family and friends not for a predator just trying his wings and being unlucky enough to run into someone who could defense himself.

1 Reply

@cicerone imposter,

The police didn't think the girlfriend "has massive credibility problems" they believed her, not Zimmerman, and they arrested him rather quickly.

And they could see for themselves that he had thrown her out of her own house and barricaded himself inside--he wouldn't let them in either.

And a judge found probable cause for the charges-meaning there is evidence to support them.

And she was just the latest person to claim Zimmerman used a gun, or gave indications he might use one, to threaten and control others, when he's angry at them.

But, you have to remember, Hawkeye and BillRM think all women have "massive credibility problems"--they really don't trust women. Laughing

And I think Hawk has forgotten that, in the past, he's acknowledged Zimmerman has credibility problems.

1 Reply

@BillRM,

http://www.soccerblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/head-up-ass-thumb-500x307-2682.jpg

0 Replies

@OmSigDAVID,

OmSigDAVID wrote:

oralloy wrote:
I've said this before, but if you have to defend yourself, and if circumstances allow, it is likely better to just make sure that your assailants are dead and then slip away, letting the police chalk it all up to "gang activity".

This is likely true even if you have a solid case that it was legitimate self defense.

Those considerations might influence your choice of defensive ordnance
between a pistol or a revolver.

Perhaps. But there are a variety of conflicting factors, and no type of gun is best in every category.

If matching expended brass to the gun is a concern, then likely so is rifling marks on bullets. Buckshot often has no contact with a shotgun barrel at all (and the barrel has no rifling regardless).

So a double barrel shotgun offers two powerful shots with minimal residual evidence from either expended shells or projectiles. If it does not send the shells flying during reloading, it possibly offers more than two shots without leaving much evidence.

However, modern cities might have networks of sensors that immediately detect the precise location of gunshots and send police rushing towards that location. A silenced handgun with slow heavy bullets (no supersonic shockwave) might prove superior even if it leaves forensic evidence behind.

In the end though, probably best to not worry about it too much. If someone can slip away undetected and the police chalk everything up to gang activity, it is unlikely that their gun will ever be checked to see if it matches that shooting. And if they can't slip away undetected, they can still justify the shooting as self-defense.

0 Replies

The State of Florida vs George Zimmerman: The Trial

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