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How can we be sure that all religions are wrong?

 
 
cameronleon
 
  0  
Thu 5 Oct, 2017 11:54 am
@fresco,
Quote:
No its not 'as simple as that'!
One of the main functions of religion is societal control, and the concept of 'self' is acquired through socialization in particular groups.


In total disagreement with you.

Nobody forces you to be a religious person.

By consequence, your hypothesis of "social control" is simply absurd.

Following your perception of religion as social control, then Football is a sport with intention of social control, millions of people live pending on what is going on with their teams. They laugh, they cry, they follow every word of the coaches, they even fight fanatics against the others. They congregate in stadiums by thousands and thousands each time, and all of them eventually become "mental prisoners of their own parochial conditioning".

Another topic must be open in this forums: How can we be sure that all sports are wrong?

Lol.



cameronleon
 
  0  
Thu 5 Oct, 2017 12:00 pm
@Glennn,
Quote:
And then I asked you to produce the poll that supports your claim that lots of women believe that the death penalty is appropriate for the offence of adultery.


And I told you that at this moment, in this era, under the current degradation of moral in societies, when for many religion is not valid anymore, your proposal is ridiculous.

You should ask me to do such a poll when the law of God was also enforced by the government. This is thousands of years ago.

And, even when today the laws of God are not enforced, the principle stands, and I agree with it. If the dog bites people, the best to do is to kill the dog.

Quote:
And now you're asking me to validate your claim. Not how it works. Now . . . validate your claim.


I'm asking you nothing.

You are the one who is interested in to know about it, not me.

You do your poll.
cameronleon
 
  0  
Thu 5 Oct, 2017 12:06 pm
@Glennn,
Quote:
No they don't. I have yet to hear of a woman, Christian or otherwise, who decided to have herself killed for having sex with another man while married.


The most you push trying to look yourself smart, your answers become the most stupid arguments I have heard recently.
0 Replies
 
cameronleon
 
  0  
Thu 5 Oct, 2017 12:08 pm
@Glennn,
Quote:
Do you believe that any wife who breaks the covenant and cheats on the husband should be killed?


You must suffer of reading comprehension problem. I have answered that question already. Go, re-read the discussion.

And if you can't find the answer, think again and ask with the proper details, because as a general question your question sucks anyway.
0 Replies
 
cameronleon
 
  0  
Thu 5 Oct, 2017 12:12 pm
@fresco,
Quote:
...I merely point out that such 'adultary penalties' are part of male chuvinistic aspects of 'religious' control akin to justification for polygamy and harem owning. Its a human residue of 'alpha male' animal instincts. To talk about 'believing' in this stuff is to ignore that 'beliefs' and 'instincts' can be related.


Whatever.

The reality is that polygamists enjoy better than monogamists.
0 Replies
 
cameronleon
 
  0  
Thu 5 Oct, 2017 12:28 pm
@Glennn,
Quote:
I see his medieval-based reasoning concerning adultery as an expression. He is expressing his imagined right to act according to the leadings of an unevolved, insecure ego that feels vulnerable to abandonment. Therefore he believes that relationships must be enforced, even to the point of killing the offender.


Sure, for you in all marriages women are forced to sign in a contract, right?

0 Replies
 
cameronleon
 
  0  
Thu 5 Oct, 2017 12:32 pm
@Glennn,
Quote:
You're right. But I would really like to hear him say that it is appropriate to kill a woman for infidelity. And that's what he has to answer in order to continue with me. I don't believe he will admit to it because somewhere inside him he knows how that will reflect on his character. We'll see.


Quote:
... he has to answer

in order to continue with me...


Houston... we have a problem...
0 Replies
 
brianjakub
 
  1  
Thu 5 Oct, 2017 12:38 pm
@fresco,
Quote:
No its not 'as simple as that'!One of the main functions of religion is societal control, and the concept of 'self' is acquired through socialization in particular groups. So it is totally false to argue that 'freedom' is involved in following the so-called 'laws of God', when in fact those laws are differentially made and followed by different human groups to regulate thought and behavior. To ignore such rules is to risk group ostracism which is part of the 'freedom price of individuality', especially for impressionable and dependent children.


As poorly as cam states his point at times, I think he is pretty spot on here.

Quote:
When the government (Kingdom of Israel) also followed the biblical laws, then the penalty of death to the adulterous woman was enforced.

Today, for example, the US government is not following and enforcing the laws of God. Then, there is not such a death penalty imposed in adulterous women.


The bible is a story telling us about a process that is taking millions and maybe even billions of years to unfold. The process goes like this.

1. God existed alone with his thoughts (Jesus the Living Word) and His feelings (the Holy Spirit) as a perfect being.

2. He decided he wanted to share these thoughts and feelings with someone so he created the universe so that someone would have a place to live.

3. Then he created somebody in his image with thoughts and feelings (man).

4. He gave the universe to them with only one rule, do whatever you want just don't ruin the perfection. The way you keep from ruining my perfection and learn my purpose is to bring everything you do and make to me for my approval.

5. Abel brought his handy work for approval. Cain listened to Satan and said, "You get what I bring you take it or leave it".

6. God like Abel better because he was humble and willing to learn so, Cain got jealous and killed Abel.

7. The whole universe has been paying for that one murder ever since, but God entered the universe when the Word became flesh and was born of a young Jewish woman and was given the name Jesus Christ.

Now all those rules the Jewish people had to follow were given to them so that they would survive as a society long enough for that woman to be born so she could give birth to the Christ. That day is over and the need for those laws has been fulfilled. Now we just have laws to promote good and punish evil. (That is if you believe in good and evil.) So, I think cameronleon is correct.



cameronleon
 
  0  
Thu 5 Oct, 2017 12:55 pm
@brianjakub,
Quote:
1. God existed alone with his thoughts (Jesus the Living Word) and His feelings (the Holy Spirit) as a perfect being.

2. He decided he wanted to share these thoughts and feelings with someone so he created the universe so that someone would have a place to live.

3. Then he created somebody in his image with thoughts and feelings (man).

4. He gave the universe to them with only one rule, do whatever you want just don't ruin the perfection. The way you keep from ruining my perfection and learn my purpose is to bring everything you do and make to me for my approval.


The Holy Spirit is "a feeling"? Uh?

He created someone with "his thoughts and feelings"? Really? Do you think like God?

Did he give "the universe" to them?

Wow, I own galaxy GN-z11 and 57% of constellation Circinus. But I mostly used them for religious meetings.

Can I rent you galaxy 3C 273 for this weekend? I have a party...



Glennn
 
  1  
Thu 5 Oct, 2017 02:32 pm
@cameronleon,
Quote:
You should ask me to do such a poll when the law of God was also enforced by the government

Earlier I asked you how you can presume to speak for this being that you call God. Rather than answering, you said that there are lots of women who don't think the same as I do, and then you asked how I presume to speak for them? You were referring to the idea that a lot of women agree that they should be killed for infidelity. Then I asked you to produce the poll that supports that claim.

To make a long story short, you are not only speaking for this being you believe in, but also for the women you say are in agreement with you concerning the death penalty for infidelity. Show me something to substantiate your claim besides your unfounded opinion.
fresco
 
  1  
Thu 5 Oct, 2017 02:36 pm
@cameronleon,
Quote:
your hypothesis of "social control" is simply absurd.

Laughing
Oh really ? You have my sympathies, (and those of Henry VIII) !
0 Replies
 
brianjakub
 
  1  
Thu 5 Oct, 2017 03:10 pm
@cameronleon,
Quote:

The Holy Spirit is "a feeling"? Uh?
Its the interpreter. It manifests itself as a feeling.
Quote:

He created someone with "his thoughts and feelings"? Really? Do you think like God?
How many different ways are there to think?
1. You come up with an idea.
2. You picture the idea in your mind and turn it into words.
3. You tell someone about it or build it yourself.
4. If they understand your idea the way you want them to it feels good, if they don't interpret the idea the way you intended, it feels bad.
Quote:
Did he give "the universe" to them?
I use the universe every day free of charge. Don't you?
Quote:

Wow, I own galaxy GN-z11 and 57% of constellation Circinus. But I mostly used them for religious meetings.

Can I rent you galaxy 3C 273 for this weekend? I have a party..
Galaxy GN-z11 and 57% of constellation Circinus are in the public domain like the open seas. No rent. Must follow maritime law though. You can have any kind of meeting you want as long as you are in a nation that has a constitution that guarantees freedom of religion like ours.(Don't try it in Iraq, North Korea, Syria. . .) The captain of your spaceship can even perform a legal marriage, or bury you at sea if you consider those a religious meeting. I bet you could even legally build a casino there.
cameronleon
 
  0  
Thu 5 Oct, 2017 03:29 pm
@Glennn,
Quote:
Earlier I asked you how you can presume to speak for this being that you call God. Rather than answering, you said that there are lots of women who don't think the same as I do, and then you asked how I presume to speak for them? You were referring to the idea that a lot of women agree that they should be killed for infidelity. Then I asked you to produce the poll that supports that claim.

To make a long story short, you are not only speaking for this being you believe in, but also for the women you say are in agreement with you concerning the death penalty for infidelity. Show me something to substantiate your claim besides your unfounded opinion.


Look, I can even reply your nonsense with poetry

You are twisting my words

oh, fermenting bowl of sourkrout.

You really don't know

what are you talking about.

cameronleon
 
  0  
Thu 5 Oct, 2017 03:34 pm
@brianjakub,
Quote:
Galaxy GN-z11 and 57% of constellation Circinus are in the public domain like the open seas. No rent. Must follow maritime law though. You can have any kind of meeting you want as long as you are in a nation that has a constitution that guarantees freedom of religion like ours.(Don't try it in Iraq, North Korea, Syria. . .) The captain of your spaceship can even perform a legal marriage, or bury you at sea if you consider those a religious meeting. I bet you could even legally build a casino there.


If the constitution guarantees freedom of religion, then... what the heck are doing several dudes here attacking God, the bible, praying,...

Are these dudes out of their mind?!
brianjakub
 
  1  
Thu 5 Oct, 2017 04:19 pm
@cameronleon,
That's another right guaranteed by the constitution "freedom of speech". Isn't it wonderful. Like Thomas Jefferson said in the Declaration of independence:
Quote:
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.

That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.
We seem to run into trouble though, when the governed forget that they received these rights from God, and they forget to ask Him how He would like us to best use them.
Glennn
 
  1  
Thu 5 Oct, 2017 04:33 pm
@cameronleon,
So, to sum up, you believe that women who are guilty of infidelity should be killed. You are also somewhat disgruntled because society has evolved to a point where the cruel and unusual punishment involved in biblical law is prohibited. You also have this idea that lots of women agree with you that they should be killed for infidelity, though you cannot substantiate it with anything other than your opinion.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Thu 5 Oct, 2017 04:36 pm
@brianjakub,
God doesn't exist. God is a figment of man's imagination. However, man is free to worship any god they wish in our country and many others. Christianity seems to be the most popular in this world followed by Islam.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_religious_populations

What I don't understand about Christianity is the fact that the Christian religion was created only 2,000 years ago while man has occupied this planet for 200,000 years. Also the fact that scientists have determined that humans evolved from primates.

I'm not surprised how important religion is to people. Even my own siblings are all Christians. I'm the only atheist amongst my family and friends.

I also do not believe in heaven or hell. When we die, we are gone forever. Each life is but a spec in the whole scheme of things called life. A very small percentage of our species will be remembered through the media.
Glennn
 
  1  
Thu 5 Oct, 2017 04:40 pm
@cameronleon,
Quote:
If the constitution guarantees freedom of religion, then... what the heck are doing several dudes here attacking God, the bible, praying,...

Are these dudes out of their mind?!

And now you've sunken to interpreting someone's disapproval of killing people for infidelity as attacking your god and the book from which you drew such a deplorable description of this allegedly intelligent and loving being.
0 Replies
 
cameronleon
 
  0  
Thu 5 Oct, 2017 06:20 pm
@brianjakub,
Quote:
We seem to run into trouble though, when the governed forget that they received these rights from God, and they forget to ask Him how He would like us to best use them.


I think the problem happens when the governed actually don't know much about God.

On the other hand, those men who were the pioneers of this great nation, didn't forget of having Him in their minds, in their heart, and recognize Him as the Creator and inspiration for the foundation of a nation model for the rest of the world.
reasoning logic
 
  0  
Thu 5 Oct, 2017 06:26 pm
@cameronleon,
Quote:
those men who were the pioneers of this great nation, didn't forget of having Him in their minds


Theistic psychosis is not something someone can get out of their own mind.

 

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