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Is it oral? Or is it just used in the conversations of a book?

 
 
Reply Fri 11 May, 2012 07:39 am


"Strive and accomplish! If you are true to me, so will I be to you."

My grammar book tells me that the structure "so will I be to you" is only used in the dialogues of a book. It does not be used in daily conversations.

I wonder whether it is true.
 
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Joe Nation
  Selected Answer
 
  3  
Reply Fri 11 May, 2012 08:58 am
@oristarA,
Quote:
"Strive and accomplish! If you are true to me, so will I be to you."

I don't know if it's archaic or poetic, but it wouldn't be spoken that way in present day conversation.

"If you are true to me, I will be true to you."

or
"Be true to me, I will be true to you."

The real question I have is what does the "If you blah blah blah... ." have to do with
Quote:
"Strive and accomplish!
??

The whole thing sounds like two separate thoughts.

~~TRANSLATED INTO MODERN AMERICAN:

"Go for it! Stick with me, I'll stick with you!"

"Go for it. Be true to me, I'll be true to you."

Why does that sound like a song?

Because it is::::::

The Monkees

Quote:
But when I looked at you I knew that I was wrong
And that I really could belong to only one.
I'll be true to you, yes I will,
Every dream that you have, I'll fulfill,
I never promised this to anyone before,
But, I'll be true to you, yes I will.
I'll be true to you, yes I will,
Every dream that you have, I'll fulfill,
I never promised this to anyone before,
But, I'll be true to you, yes I will,
Yes, I will,
Yes, I will.



Joe(NOT one of their big hits)Nation


0 Replies
 
oristarA
 
  1  
Reply Fri 11 May, 2012 09:19 am
Excellent!
Thank you Joe.
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Sat 12 May, 2012 07:54 am
@oristarA,
Quote:
"Strive and accomplish! If you are true to me, so will I be to you."

My grammar book tells me that the structure "so will I be to you" is only used in the dialogues of a book. It [does] is not [be] used in daily conversations.

I wonder whether it is true.


It isn't true, Ori. It's just simply uncommon. But that doesn't mean that it doesn't happen in speech.There are a number of reasons for inversion/fronting, much too much to lay out here.

Do you have access to a large library, maybe a university library. There is an excellent discussion of this in The Longman Grammar of Spoken and Written English, Biber et al.
oristarA
 
  1  
Reply Sat 12 May, 2012 08:53 am
@JTT,
JTT wrote:

Quote:
"Strive and accomplish! If you are true to me, so will I be to you."

My grammar book tells me that the structure "so will I be to you" is only used in the dialogues of a book. It [does] is not [be] used in daily conversations.

I wonder whether it is true.


It isn't true, Ori. It's just simply uncommon. But that doesn't mean that it doesn't happen in speech.There are a number of reasons for inversion/fronting, much too much to lay out here.

Do you have access to a large library, maybe a university library. There is an excellent discussion of this in The Longman Grammar of Spoken and Written English, Biber et al.


Thank you JTT.

Online interlibrary loaning may work. I'd give it a try.
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Sat 12 May, 2012 09:08 am
@oristarA,
Quote:
Online interlibrary loaning may work. I'd give it a try.


Here, by using the tentative `d, aka would, you seem to be rebuffing my efforts to steer you towards an excellent resource, Ori. I`m not saying this because my feelings are hurt. I`m doing it to help you understand the uses of modal verbs.

If your intention is to check that source, then will is what you want here.

I`ll give it a try.

It starts around page 911.

oristarA
 
  1  
Reply Sat 12 May, 2012 07:28 pm
@JTT,
JTT wrote:

Quote:
Online interlibrary loaning may work. I'd give it a try.


Here, by using the tentative `d, aka would, you seem to be rebuffing my efforts to steer you towards an excellent resource, Ori. I`m not saying this because my feelings are hurt. I`m doing it to help you understand the uses of modal verbs.

If your intention is to check that source, then will is what you want here.

I`ll give it a try.

It starts around page 911.



Of course I've referred to "I will give it a try." The misuse points to the fact - how I've poorly understood the proper usages of "would." (In this case, I originally thought by using "would" I showed more respect and modesty to the reciever. What a misunderstanding!

The nuance matters.

JTT
 
  1  
Reply Sat 12 May, 2012 08:36 pm
@oristarA,
Quote:
Of course I've referred to "I will give it a try." The misuse points to the fact - how I've poorly understood the proper usages of "would." (In this case, I originally thought by using "would" I showed more respect and modesty to the reciever. What a misunderstanding!

The nuance matters.


Yes, it most surely does, Ori. The only way to get to a natural understanding of modal use is by using them in real situations.

I believe you understand but I'll review just to be sure.

In this case, because you seemed to be willing to accept my suggestion, in order to state that you use the modal choice that shows greater level of certainty. That, as you well know is 'will'.

As soon as you use 'would' you are talking in the realm of potentials. 'would' would certainly be appropriate if you wanted to explain any number of reasons why it was unlikely to impossible for you to access the book.

Some examples:

I'd love to read that book, but I'm afraid I can't get to a library that would have it.

I would like to read that material, if I could get to a library that would have it.

=====

If you have any other questions, other scenarios that you want to inquire about, please feel free to ask.
roger
 
  1  
Reply Sat 12 May, 2012 09:07 pm
@oristarA,
Back to the original question; the phrase really sounds like something someone might have as a tattoo.
oristarA
 
  1  
Reply Sat 12 May, 2012 11:07 pm
@JTT,
JTT wrote:

Quote:
Of course I've referred to "I will give it a try." The misuse points to the fact - how I've poorly understood the proper usages of "would." (In this case, I originally thought by using "would" I showed more respect and modesty to the reciever. What a misunderstanding!

The nuance matters.


Yes, it most surely does, Ori. The only way to get to a natural understanding of modal use is by using them in real situations.

I believe you understand but I'll review just to be sure.

In this case, because you seemed to be willing to accept my suggestion, in order to state that you use the modal choice that shows greater level of certainty. That, as you well know is 'will'.

As soon as you use 'would' you are talking in the realm of potentials. 'would' would certainly be appropriate if you wanted to explain any number of reasons why it was unlikely to impossible for you to access the book.

Some examples:

I'd love to read that book, but I'm afraid I can't get to a library that would have it.

I would like to read that material, if I could get to a library that would have it.

=====

If you have any other questions, other scenarios that you want to inquire about, please feel free to ask.



I've access to the book. It seems the library just has had a crappy copy of it, because the letters in it are not clear enough and enlarging them would make parts of pages disappear.
0 Replies
 
oristarA
 
  1  
Reply Sat 12 May, 2012 11:08 pm
@roger,
roger wrote:

Back to the original question; the phrase really sounds like something someone might have as a tattoo.


Failed to understand "have as a tattoo"...
roger
 
  1  
Reply Sat 12 May, 2012 11:11 pm
@oristarA,
Some people have their bodies inscribed with mottos or legends they believe to be significant. For their sake, I hope they don't change their minds. The ink is injected into the skin and is usually permanent.
0 Replies
 
 

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