9
   

Nothing can be destroyed or created

 
 
dalehileman
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 May, 2012 10:51 am
@Krumple,
Quote:
I disagree completely. Although the genetic code does have a lot of variations and possible arrangements it is not unlimited. It does have a limit but the number is very big.
Possibly there’s some sort of semantic block amongst us. Certainly not all outcomes are possible but of each possible state there should occur an infinite number, at times simultaneously

My suspicion is, and remember I’m only playing the Prince of Darkness’ pleader, that the intuitional objection to all the repetition might be evidence of
a flaw in one or more assumptions as (1)-(4) in the OP of

http://able2know.org/topic/185652-1


Krumple
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 May, 2012 07:26 pm
@dalehileman,
dalehileman wrote:
Possibly there’s some sort of semantic block amongst us. Certainly not all outcomes are possible but of each possible state there should occur an infinite number, at times simultaneously


No, there is a limit to how the protiens can be arranged. This would mean the resulting gene would also have limits. Ignoring the fact that environment and successful breeding weeds out certain changes. There is still a limited number of possible outcomes. Although the number of combinations is large, it is far from infinite.
dalehileman
 
  1  
Reply Mon 21 May, 2012 10:12 am
@Krumple,
Although the number of combinations is large, it is far from infinite.

Sorry Krump if I wasn’t clear but you misunderstand. I maintain as the Devil’s Advocate given an infinite Megillah forever in which anything that can happen, will, even with a limited number of combos there would still be an infinite number each of identical galaxy in which every possible combination is represented

Fil help me out here, I evidently don’t get across very effectively

Krumple
 
  1  
Reply Wed 23 May, 2012 11:20 pm
@dalehileman,
dalehileman wrote:

Although the number of combinations is large, it is far from infinite.

Sorry Krump if I wasn’t clear but you misunderstand. I maintain as the Devil’s Advocate given an infinite Megillah forever in which anything that can happen, will, even with a limited number of combos there would still be an infinite number each of identical galaxy in which every possible combination is represented

Fil help me out here, I evidently don’t get across very effectively


This is just a theoretical concept, but in practice I doubt it actually plays out this way. Here is an example.

Flying pink elephants.

Now according to your theory, eventually at some point flying pink elephants could exist. However; in actual practice, why would elephants become pink let alone develope wings and the ability to fly? I doubt elephants would progress down this road because their niche isn't that demanding on them for their survival.
dalehileman
 
  1  
Reply Thu 24 May, 2012 10:12 am
@Krumple,
Quote:
Now according to your theory, eventually at some point flying pink elephants could exist.
Only if for some reason they're possible

Quote:
However; in actual practice, why would elephants become pink let alone develop wings and the ability to fly?
In another world such qualities might prove evolutionarily advantageous

Quote:
I doubt elephants would progress down this road
So do I, at least a creature that heavy in an atmosphere as thin as ours

Quote:
because their niche isn't that demanding on them for their survival.
Exactly
0 Replies
 
Fil Albuquerque
 
  1  
Reply Thu 24 May, 2012 05:47 pm
@Krumple,
I suppose a Flying Pink Elephant is not an Elephant with wings in your book but something else that at best may resemble an elephant...now if such a creature is possible at all in different conditions in a different atmosphere in a different planet, well...why not ? and how can you assert that it is not ? It certainly is far more plausible then the Flying Spaghetti Monster...the Universe is a big place.
dalehileman
 
  1  
Reply Thu 24 May, 2012 09:56 pm
@Fil Albuquerque,
Quote:
in a different atmosphere in a different planet, well...why not ?
Sure why not

Quote:
and how can you assert that it is not ?
I’d have to know the circumstances whereupon I’d guess one way or t'other
0 Replies
 
zt09
 
  1  
Reply Wed 30 May, 2012 03:06 pm
@Alexandergreat3,
In this case we (and everything in this universe) will exist forever in some form of another. We will become an atom, a planet, a galaxy, an every possible combination of particles (an even ... singularity?) hence sometimes a living thing again, and we'll be born and die, be born and die forever in the bodies of all possible living creatutes in all possible words. I will become him, he will become me. And there is no way out.

But only if nothing cannot be destroyed completely (Theoretically we could destroy a quantum system by creating it's full negated copy or by isolating it completely from the rest of the world). What about the virtual photons that are created and destroyed all the time? What if we will become one of them?
dalehileman
 
  0  
Reply Thu 31 May, 2012 12:34 pm
@zt09,
Quote:
But only if nothing cannot be destroyed completely
Interesting Zt that you should so assert. If the Magillah goes on forever, interrupted by moments of nothingness, then isn’t it occasionally destroyed

But what if that moment has a duration of zero
Rickoshay75
 
  1  
Reply Fri 1 Jun, 2012 12:26 pm
@Fil Albuquerque,
Fil Albuquerque wrote:

I suppose a Flying Pink Elephant is not an Elephant with wings in your book but something else that at best may resemble an elephant...now if such a creature is possible at all in different conditions in a different atmosphere in a different planet, well...why not ? and how can you assert that it is not ? It certainly is far more plausible then the Flying Spaghetti Monster...the Universe is a big place.


If it doesn't fit in with the natural nature of things, no matter where or on which planet, or the latest concepts of infinity, then it's a fantasy, but that's all right too. I love good sci fi, always have.
Fil Albuquerque
 
  1  
Reply Fri 1 Jun, 2012 06:02 pm
@Rickoshay75,
Who said it doesn't fit in with the natural nature of things ? That was the point...imagine a thicker atmosphere a lighter mass with less gravity and some skin protein which is pink and there you have a Pink Flying elephant with wings wondering around...obviously was never my intention to fault logic but only to make a point on the vastness of Cosmos and its potential solutions for life...
0 Replies
 
dalehileman
 
  1  
Reply Sat 2 Jun, 2012 10:00 am
@Rickoshay75,
Quote:
the natural nature of things………... or the latest concepts of infinity,
Fil we might take a pause here: since some haven’t kept up, can you explain some of those later concepts

Quote:
the vastness of Cosmos and its potential solutions for life...
In other words that anything that can happen, will happen. However the mechanics behind a universe that seems “tuned” to create a humanoid remains one of the most baffling aspects of the Entire Megillah
Fil Albuquerque
 
  1  
Reply Sat 2 Jun, 2012 10:11 am
@dalehileman,
What ? its been said already infinity's may be confined self enclosed...I think Cantor was the one showing there are Infinity's with different sizes...that is, there are smaller and bigger infinity's...on the other hand Infinite diversity is quite a different matter and people often associate Infinity with Infinite diversity...from where I stand Infinite diversity it is not possible...say for instance a continuum space is not logical...how much length would one need to walk a meter if a meter was in fact infinitely divisible in a continuum space frame ? We would have to walk infinitely each time we go forward...any Infinity is grounded on a fixed referent...
Fil Albuquerque
 
  1  
Reply Sat 2 Jun, 2012 10:13 am
@dalehileman,
Not at all there are quite good number of takes upon the fine tuning problem being Multiverse the most common accepted explanation...no big deal.
Fil Albuquerque
 
  1  
Reply Sat 2 Jun, 2012 10:31 am
@Fil Albuquerque,
Say in integral or whole numbers for instance the number two is just by definition the sum of two ones and so on...the ground of infinity is not infinite variety meant as open ended in all possible senses but on the contrary based on infinite amounts of the same thing as its building ground...there the word diversity gets say tricky...while one may assert X,X is not X on the other hand informatively X,X doesn't had much to what essentially X is...is just a coordinate of extension of X...X1.X2,X3...
0 Replies
 
dalehileman
 
  1  
Reply Sat 2 Jun, 2012 11:20 am
@Fil Albuquerque,
Quote:
...that is, there are smaller and bigger infinity's...
Indeed and I’m wondering if this might explain away the idea of identical galaxies in an infinite Universe forever

Quote:
...how much length would one need to walk a meter if a meter was in fact infinitely divisible in a continuum space frame ?
Interesting though you might have to simplify the language to reach the Average Clod (me). But I wonder if there isn’t suggestion here somehow that time proceeds in quantum steps
0 Replies
 
dalehileman
 
  1  
Reply Sat 2 Jun, 2012 11:26 am
@Fil Albuquerque,
Quote:
Multiverse the most common accepted
I presume you mean that of the humanoid and by Multiverse that of multi Universes, suggesting that if anything that can happen, will, then by necessity some Universes would have humanoids and others not

But it’s doubtful according to the general rule that the simpler theory is usually the one proving out

Quote:
Say in integral or whole numbers for instance the number two is just by definition the sum of two ones…..
That’s as much as the Typical Bonehead (me) understood of this posting
0 Replies
 
zt09
 
  1  
Reply Sun 3 Jun, 2012 12:35 am
@dalehileman,
Quote:
If the Magillah goes on forever, interrupted by moments of nothingness, then isn’t it occasionally destroyed

But what if that moment has a duration of zero


There are scientific theories that suggest there is a minimal (but non zero) moment of time like the theory of Loop quantum gravity. Unfortunately as far as I know none of them have been confirmed yet.
dalehileman
 
  1  
Reply Sun 3 Jun, 2012 09:38 am
@zt09,
Quote:
a minimal (but non zero) moment of time
Does sound more likely doesn’t it

The idea of an infinitely heavy spec disappearing altogether does stretch the Intuition
0 Replies
 
Rickoshay75
 
  0  
Reply Thu 7 Jun, 2012 12:10 pm
@zt09,
zt09 wrote:

Quote:
If the Magillah goes on forever, interrupted by moments of nothingness, then isn’t it occasionally destroyed

But what if that moment has a duration of zero


There are scientific theories that suggest there is a minimal (but non zero) moment of time like the theory of Loop quantum gravity. Unfortunately as far as I know none of them have been confirmed yet.


The only way a moment in time can be captured is with a photo, but even that is an illusion because time moves on after it is taken.
 

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