Do you think Zimmerman will be convicted of murder?

inadequates with a limited vocabulary, who harbour genocidal fantasies, and couldn't beat a headless chicken in a game of noughts and crosses.

You've demonstated your idiocy and racism time and time again Gungasnakkke. A 17 year old is a minor, but you couldn't be expected to know that because you can't count that high.

Are you forgetting that he was a child and they do not think like adults....

I wonder how you forgot that little fact.

Actually, the closest thing to a decent explanation for that one which I can come up with would be a sort of a Machiavellian motive which says that the guy recognized the case as a career-ender for any prosecutor stupid enough to try it and, wishing to avoid riots in the streets, handed the thing to a prosecutor whose career he figured was in major need of ending.

• An open threat of large numbers of brainwashed and ignorant people rioting and demanding a human sacrifice not to riot.

I'm always at a loss as to why the government coddles rioters.
Seems to me like the way forward is to just mow 'em down with machineguns (or maybe drive 70-ton tanks over them).
Instead everyone just wrings their hands and lets them burn everything.

Perhaps the most disturbing thing I see with this case is how many people are in favor of the state hauling us citizens in front of its courts on a whim so that they can try to sell a charge to a jury. This is too much like "kill them all and let God sort em out" for me.

• An open threat of large numbers of brainwashed and ignorant people rioting
  and demanding a human sacrifice not to riot.

I'm always at a loss as to why the government coddles rioters.

Seems to me like the way forward is to just mow 'em down with machineguns
(or maybe drive 70-ton tanks over them).

Instead everyone just wrings their hands and lets them burn everything.

hawkeye10 wrote:

Perhaps the most disturbing thing I see with this case is how many people are in favor of the state hauling us citizens in front of its courts on a whim so that they can try to sell a charge to a jury. This is too much like "kill them all and let God sort em out" for me.

Allowing people their day in court, and using juries, is kinda the opposite of "kill them all and let God sort them out."

Workers arrested at South Africa's Marikana mine have been charged in court with the murder of 34 of their colleagues shot by police.

The 270 workers would be tried under the "common purpose" doctrine because they were in the crowd which confronted police on 16 August, an official said.

Police opened fire, killing 34 miners and sparking a national outcry.

...

New George Zimmerman evidence: Details on Trayvon's DNA on Zimmerman and vice versa
September 19, 2012|
By Rene Stutzman and Jeff Weiner, Orlando Sentinel

State evidence released today in the George Zimmerman second-degree murder case shows new details from a state crime lab that found Zimmerman's DNA on Trayvon Martin, the teenager he shot to death, and Trayvon's DNA on him.

But the gun that Zimmerman used to kill Trayvon that night – a gun that Zimmerman told police the teenager had reached for - revealed no evidence that Trayvon touched it.

State scientists checked several parts of the 9 mm handgun: its grip, trigger, slide and holster. They found Zimmerman's DNA and that belonging to other unidentifiable people but none that matched Trayvon, records show.

The gun evidence is important because Zimmerman told Sanford police he opened fire only after the 17-year-old pinned him to the ground and reached for the gun he wore holstered on his waist.

In a re-enactment for Sanford police the next day, Zimmerman did not say or show that the two had struggled over the gun, only that Trayvon had extended his hand toward it.

The 28-year-old Zimmerman killed Trayvon, a Miami Gardens high school junior, Feb. 26 in Sanford.

Zimmerman says he acted in self-defense. Prosecutors say Zimmerman, a Neighborhood Watch volunteer, spotted the black teenager, profiled him, assumed he was about to commit a crime, began following him then murdered him.

Prosecutors today released to the public several hundred pages of evidence. It included no bombshells.

The DNA evidence was among the most compelling because it confirmed that Zimmerman and Trayvon had been in extremely close contact.

Several neighbors reported seeing one on top of the other in a fight that left one of them screaming, Zimmerman with a broken nose and small gashes to his head and Trayvon dead from a gunshot wound to the heart.

Special Prosecutor Angela Corey released some DNA evidence May 17 but more details today. Records from the FDLE's Orlando lab show scientists there found a Trayvon-Zimmerman DNA mixture in a blood stain on Zimmerman's red-orange jacket.

Zimmerman's DNA was found in a stain on Trayvon's shirt. Scientists found on that same piece of clothing a Zimmerman-Trayvon mix of DNA, they reported.

The new evidence also reveals that the local president of the NAACP sent Sanford Police Chief Bill Lee an email three days after the shooting, asking to meet and discuss Trayvon's shooting.

It's unclear when or whether that meeting with Turner Clayton Jr. happened.

Lee and his agency's investigation into the shooting were harshly criticized

On March 8, the day Trayvon's father held an Orlando press conference, calling for his son's killer to be arrested, the case began drawing national media attention. Lee began receiving thousands of angry emails from across the country.

Many were abusive, accusing Lee of racism, incompetence or both. Numerous emailers in March and April asked Lee how he could sleep at night.

"Is george Zimmerman a personal friend?" asked one non-grammatical emailer. "I cant imagine why he hasn't been charged with 1st degree murder otherwise."

Another emailer, who identified himself as a Chicago resident, called the lack of an arrest "sickening beyond words."

Beginning on March 13, Lee received hundreds of copies of a Change.org petition asking him to "Prosecute the killer of 17-year-old Trayvon Martin." That night, he received an email from Orlando Police Department Chief Paul Rooney, who wrote, "if you need anything don't hesitate to call… take care my friend."

The emails show Rooney was just the first of several police chiefs to voice support. Lee also recieved positive messages from the heads of police departments in Lake Mary, Parker, Ponce Inlet and at the University of Central Florida.

The new evidence also includes diagrams drawn by some eye-witnesses.

Zimmerman was wearing a red jacket that night and told police that Trayvon, who was wearing a dark gray sweatshirt, pinned him to the ground and was hammering his head into the sidewalk.

One witness diagram shows two stick figures and the words "black shirt top" and "red shirt bottom," an apparent reference to Trayvon being on top and Zimmerman on the bottom.

The new evidence also includes a recorded statement by the 7-Eleven clerk who waited on Trayvon about an hour before Zimmerman fatally shot the teenager.

On March 29, a month later, FDLE agents showed the employee the store's security video of that night and asked him if he recognized Trayvon.

"Did you have any idea you were the 7-Eleven clerk that sold him the famous Skittles?" the agent asked.

"Nah," said the clerk, whose name was erased from the recording.

A written summary of that finding was released by prosecutors earlier.

The new records include more than 200 photos, but they revealed little new evidence. Most are of the Sanford townhouse community where the shooting took place but long after it had been cleared of evidence.

Eight photos were taken by a private investigator hired by Trayvon's family. They, also, show the scene of the shooting, well after the evidence had been cleared away but appear to be taken from the spots where individual witnesses say they were standing when they saw or heard the fight between Zimmerman and Trayvon.

Also released today are records that show that on March 6, the Seminole County Sheriff's Office was poised to release 911 calls made the night of the shooting to CBS news. They are dramatic. In one, Zimmerman describes Trayvon to a dispatcher as a suspicious black man whom he does not recognize and who is loitering in a neighborhood that's had a great many break-ins.

In another, a voice can be heard screaming for help then a gunshot.

The Sheriff's Office was on the verge of releasing that information but Sanford police on March 6 told the agency not to, saying they were still part of an active criminal investigation. Trayvon's family then sued the city of Sanford, demanding their release, and the city acquiesced, releasing them March 16.

Prosecutors today released time-stamped dispatch records, showing to the second when Zimmerman called police and when that gunshot was heard in the background of a 911 call by a neighbor.

They differ slightly from a timeline prepared by Sanford police and released several months ago. For example, the county dispatch records show that Zimmerman reported that Trayvon was running at 19:11:59, a minute 20 seconds before Sanford police indicated he reported that.

But the two sources differ by only 13 seconds on when the gunshot can be heard: Sanford police say it was at 19:17:20 vs. 19:17:07 for the county.

All of today's records were released last month to defense attorneys.

Prosecutors gave Zimmerman's defense 217 photos from the Florida Department of Law Enforcement, eight photos taken by a private investigator, Zimmerman's school records from Manassas, Va., eight dispatch reports from the radio dispatch center at the Seminole County Sheriff's Office, which handles calls for the city of Sanford; several crime scene drawings made by witnesses and the cell phone records of 17-year-old Trayvon Martin, who Zimmerman shot Feb. 26.

Some of those pieces of evidence were not released, including the cell phone records and Zimmerman's school records.
http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2012-09-19/news/os-george-zimmerman-evidence-new-20120919_1_george-zimmerman-trayvon-martin-cell-phone-records

Giving people their day in court, having trial by jury, those things limit the power of the government

George Zimmerman's friend's book offers starkly different account of Trayvon Martin's death
September 21, 2012
By Frances Robles — The Miami Herald

MIAMI — Trayvon Martin grabbed his killer’s gun just moments before he died and uttered a profanity-laced threat. In a desperate life-or-death struggle, George Zimmerman clutched Trayvon’s wrist, broke his grip on the semi-automatic firearm and shot him once in the chest.

That account appears in a new book written by Zimmerman’s best friend and confidante.

There’s just one problem: Zimmerman never said that to the police.

Now the book, Defending Our Friend: The Most Hated Man in America, and author Mark Osterman’s two television interviews have landed on the prosecution evidence list, as more versions of Zimmerman’s story emerge. A man who wrote a book calling Zimmerman “the kindest and most sincere” person will wind up in court — for the prosecution, experts agree.

“It was emotionally draining for George as he relived that awful moment when he managed to control the gun, then fired out of fear for his life,” Osterman wrote.

Osterman, U.S. air marshal who lives in a Central Florida, was among the first people Zimmerman’s wife called on Feb. 26 when she learned her husband had just shot someone. Osterman rushed to the scene that night, and accompanied his best friend every step of the way through the investigation, including his first three interrogations by Sanford police.

Osterman acknowledges that former Sanford Police Chief Bill Lee was his one-time lieutenant in the Seminole County Sheriff’s Department whom he held up as a father figure. Osterman says he was quickly recognized by cops on the scene, but insists he never coached his friend on what to tell them after the death of Trayvon, an unarmed Miami Gardens teenager.

Afraid for the Zimmermans’ safety, Osterman took the couple in from the very first night of the shooting. His 172-page book describes how Zimmerman told the story of the killing over and over again until he was physically drained. When he told it to police, Osterman said, Zimmerman threw up.

But Osterman’s account is a sharp deviation from the versions Zimmerman gave, which experts say will undoubtedly be used to try to impeach the defendant’s credibility and cast doubt on his claim of self-defense if each telling changed or was embellished.

“I desperately got both of my hands around the guy’s one wrist and took his hand off my mouth long enough for me to shout again for help,” Osterman quotes Zimmerman as saying.

“For a brief moment I had control of the wrist, but I knew when he felt the sidearm at my waist with his leg. He took his hand that was covering my nose and went for the gun, saying, “You’re gonna die now, motherf-----.’ Somehow, I broke his grip on the gun where the guy grabbed it between the rear sight and the hammer. I got the gun in my hand, raised it toward the guy’s chest and pulled the trigger.”

DNA reports released Wednesday showed there was no DNA from Trayvon on the gun.

Even as Zimmerman himself offered slight variations of where Trayvon first appeared or from what direction, none of his written or recorded interviews with police suggested a battle over the firearm. He told police that when he wriggled off the concrete onto the grass, his gun was exposed, and Trayvon reached for it.

In the version Zimmerman’s brother Robert told CNN, Trayvon said something like, “You have a piece? You die tonight.”

Osterman has declined to comment. In his book, he blames The Miami Herald for revealing his identity and compromising his position with the U.S. Department of Homeland Security. He also acknowledged that shortly after The Herald revealed his name in July, he wrote the book and went on national TV.

Defense attorney Mark O’Mara said he had never heard about a struggle for the gun. He said he read a draft of the book before it was published, but felt asking Osterman to change details would amount to witness tampering.

“He’s a friend of George’s trying to explain George to be different than the way he was perceived to be. Great — that’s a story that’s not been told,” O’Mara said. “I don’t like him talking about things George spoke to him about in confidence. I didn’t like yet another statement of George’s out there for review. It’s more of a headache.”

Although he questioned whether Osterman’s memory is accurate, O’Mara admitted that between Zimmerman’s various interviews to police, his father and brother’s accounts to the press and now Osterman’s, there are several versions of what happened that night, but he characterized the discrepancies as a surmountable obstacle. If everyone’s story was exactly the same, O’Mara said, then it would smack of a lie.

O’Mara said it took him 10 days to respond to the book draft after he received it, but when he got around to asking Osterman to scrap the book, the publishing contract had already been signed. O’Mara chalked it up to miscommunication, adding that Zimmerman has taken a court’s “no contact with witnesses” order to heart, and has not spoken to any state witnesses except his parents since he left jail on bond while he awaits trial on a charge of second-degree murder.

“We will be able to respond to the six, seven, eight different renditions of the story, how and why there are different statements,” O’Mara said. “The jury is going to believe what the jury is going to believe.”

Although Zimmerman has said Trayvon jumped him from out of nowhere, the book says he told Osterman that Trayvon first approached Zimmerman from a distance of at least 15 feet and asked him if he had a problem. In a TV interview, Osterman also claimed Zimmerman had a concussion, something that was never noted in medical records or claimed in the statements.

To explain why Zimmerman got out of his car while on the phone with police, he quotes a conversation between his friend and the dispatcher that never took place: “If you can’t see him do you still need us to send an officer? We need you to get to a place where you can see him,” he quotes the dispatcher in an exchange that is not contained on copies of the police call or transcripts widely posted on the Internet.

Trayvon’s supporters believe Osterman’s book proves that Zimmerman can’t keep his story straight because none of it is true.

“He has done George no favors by writing this book,” said attorney Natalie Jackson, who represented Trayvon’s parents in their mission to get police to make an arrest. “This book is huge. It hurts George a lot.”

Although second-hand quotes are generally inadmissible in court, Jackson said this is a type of citation that would be exempt from the hearsay rule.

“The state would be precluded from directly using any excerpts from the book, as the words on the pages are hearsay, but the Ostermans could be subpoenaed to testify against him to his detriment if Zimmerman embellished, added or changed facts in the version he gave to them,” said Miami Beach criminal-defense attorney Michael Grieco, who has been following the case. “Any inconsistencies amongst the numerous statements Zimmerman has given will be used against him and his credibility.

“Zimmerman’s credibility is the key to his affirmative defense.”

http://www.tri-cityherald.com/2012/09/21/2108821/george-zimmermans-friends-book.html#storylink=cpy#storylink=cpy

In her two-page order Monday, Circuit Court Judge Debra Nelson wrote that she found no "overriding pattern of prejudicial commentary" and noted that a dozen media companies that had opposed the order were right when they argued that the state had failed to demonstrate prejudice.
Assistant State Attorney Bernie de la Rionda had argued that Zimmerman’s lawyer, Mark O’Mara, has used a website set up to assist Zimmerman and social media sites such as Facebook and Twitter to publicly discuss the case, potentially tainting jurors.
O’Mara denied the prosecutor's claims, saying Zimmerman has faced a “tidal wave” of inaccurate information.