37
   

The politics of hoodie wearing

 
 
maxdancona
 
  2  
Reply Thu 5 Apr, 2012 07:01 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Quote:
For the Civil Rights Movement it was blacks embracing victimhood as the central definition of their identity.

What a tragedy that King died before his time, because I am sure that he never would have tolerated this corruption of his teachings.


Bullshit! It upsets me when white conservatives, the very people who so strongly opposed Dr. King when he was alive, are now trying to whitewash his message.

There are people alive today who worked with Dr. King. They were his partners in his movement and shared his values. They are the ones who not only understand what Dr. King stood for, but risked their lives to bring it about.

If you don't like Jesse Jackson and John Lewis, then you wouldn't have liked Martin Luther King.




Irishk
 
  2  
Reply Thu 5 Apr, 2012 07:07 pm
@djjd62,
djjd62 wrote:
and i don't care if they lie, i wouldn't believe them if they told the truth
Dailykos posted this satirical piece a couple of days ago and MSNBC, who apparently can't tell real news from fake, ran with it LOL!
snood
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Apr, 2012 07:56 pm
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:

Quote:
For the Civil Rights Movement it was blacks embracing victimhood as the central definition of their identity.

What a tragedy that King died before his time, because I am sure that he never would have tolerated this corruption of his teachings.


Bullshit! It upsets me when white conservatives, the very people who so strongly opposed Dr. King when he was alive, are now trying to whitewash his message.

There are people alive today who worked with Dr. King. They were his partners in his movement and shared his values. They are the ones who not only understand what Dr. King stood for, but risked their lives to bring it about.

If you don't like Jesse Jackson and John Lewis, then you wouldn't have liked Martin Luther King.







Word up, Irish. I cringe when rightwingers try to coopt Dr King's message and legacy now. In truth, they would have despised him as a wealth redistributing, communist appeasing, Anti-American Librul. Such utter bullshit.
snood
 
  0  
Reply Thu 5 Apr, 2012 08:37 pm
The Qu'ran- burning "pastor" is coming to Sanford to support the racist vigilante.

http://www.thegrio.com/specials/trayvon-martin/terry-jones-quran-burning-pastor-reportedly-headed-to-sanford.php
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Apr, 2012 08:49 pm
@maxdancona,
You are mistaken.
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  2  
Reply Thu 5 Apr, 2012 09:08 pm
@maxdancona,
Bullshit yourself Max!

And you know that I "strongly opposed" King when he was alive how?

He was and is someone for whom I have great admiration. You can search these threads for days and you will not find even a hint of animosity towards him in any of my posts.

He happens to be one of the few of my youthful, public heroes who remained untarnished when my thinking finally matured.

You know what upsets me? Liberals who think they own Martin Luther King.

Perhaps Jackson was a worthy accolyte of King in his early days but he is currently a disgraceful parody of a Civil Rights Movement leader.

The King I knew when he was alive would never try and incite anyone to pass judgment, prematurely or otherwise, on anyone...irrespective of their race, and he sure as hell would have condemned anyone putting a bounty on Zimmerman's head, or releasing his address to the world.

Whitewash his message?

What message was that?

Lash
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Apr, 2012 09:11 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Absolutely.
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Apr, 2012 09:27 pm
@snood,
Bullshit to you too snood.

This is why I don't hold your perspective as authoratative although you expect us all to do so because of the color of your skin.

Quote:
But there is something that I must say to my people who stand on the warm threshold which leads into the palace of justice. In the process of gaining our rightful place we must not be guilty of wrongful deeds. Let us not seek to satisfy our thirst for freedom by drinking from the cup of bitterness and hatred.

The marvelous new militancy which has engulfed the Negro community must not lead us to distrust of all white people, for many of our white brothers, as evidenced by their presence here today, have come to realize that their destiny is tied up with our destiny and their freedom is inextricably bound to our freedom. We cannot walk alone.

I have a dream that my four children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin but by the content of their character.

With this faith we will be able to transform the jangling discords of our nation into a beautiful symphony of brotherhood.


How is the assumption that all right-wingers are racist, predatory dogs that much different from the assumption that all African-Americans are shiftless, criminals?
0 Replies
 
maxdancona
 
  2  
Reply Thu 5 Apr, 2012 09:39 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Face it! Martin Luther King was a liberal.

Not only did he fight racial injustice. He led labor strikes. He supported affirmative action (before the term was invented). And he strongly opposed the Vietnam war.

I don't know what part of Martin Luther King's beliefs you respect. Maybe there a couple of lines taken out of context from his speeches that you didn't understand. You are right that Dr. King wouldn't be supporting a bounty, but neither do I or most liberals.

But you don't have to speculate what Dr. King would have said. He said it.

Quote:
Negroes have experienced grossly unjust treatment in the courts. There have been more unsolved bombings of Negro homes and churches in Birmingham than in any other city in the nation. These are the hard, brutal facts of the case. On the basis of these conditions, Negro leaders sought to negotiate with the city fathers. But the latter consistently refused to engage in good faith negotiation.


http://www.africa.upenn.edu/Articles_Gen/Letter_Birmingham.html

I don't know how much you have actually read the actual words and actions of Martin Luther King. I doubt you have read very much.

The white-washed, happy-go-lucky conservative vision of Martin Luther King as a Negro who wanted a society blind to racial injustice is nothing but a cruel myth.

The record is all there if you want to go read it.
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Apr, 2012 09:48 pm
@maxdancona,
Martin Luther King’s Conservative Principles

Quote:
Martin Luther King Day has arrived once again, and like clockwork, liberals are invoking King’s name to support their causes.
In an e-mail to activists, Obama’s former “green czar,” Van Jones, calls King the “original Occupier.” He urges activists to use MLK day meet-ups to energize left-wing campaigning for 2012.
Despite these efforts, conservatives should not surrender King’s legacy to the left.
Conservatives, of course, have reservations about certain aspects of King’s legacy. For one, he became too close, later in his career, to the welfare state. He was enamored of the theology of the Social Gospel, the movement that undermined much of mainstream Protestantism in the 20th century. Later in life, he was a vocal opponent of American involvement in the Vietnam. And we now know that in his scholarship and personal life King was far from perfect.
Nevertheless, there are three ways in which King’s message is profoundly conservative and relevant.
First, of course, concerns the question of race. King dreamed of a nation for his children where they would be judged not by the color of their skin but by the content of their character. He dreamed of a color-blind society based on the equality of all Americans and their sharing of equal unalienable rights.
The American dream, King said at Lincoln University in 1961, “says that each individual has certain basic rights that are neither conferred by nor derived from the state. To discover where they came from it is necessary to move back behind the dim mist of eternity, for they are God-given.… The American dream reminds us that every man is heir to the legacy of worthiness.”
An agenda that advocates quotas, counting by race and set-asides, takes us away from King’s vision.
Second, King believed in the critical importance of faith and moral character. He spoke of self-improvement and self-help in both moral and practical terms. He believed in work ethic and thrift and spoke against crime and disorderly conduct. In stark contrast to modern liberalism’s militant secularism, King explicitly ground his efforts in the Christian tradition. King believed that churches and other faith-based associations were necessary for a grassroots revival of American culture.
He also stressed the importance of the family. Indeed, King’s fears about black family breakdown led him to become one of the few civil-rights leaders not to reject Daniel Patrick Moynihan’s controversial 1965 report that warned of rising illegitimacy rates among blacks.
This forgotten aspect of King’s thought is told expertly in an article entitled “Where Dr. King Went Wrong.” Joel Schwartz suggests that King turned to the welfare state when he became disheartened by the emergence of the black underclass.
Third, King firmly embraced the core principles of America’s founding. Unlike so many modern liberals beset with nihilistic multiculturalism, King did not talk about remaking America. His dream was one “deeply rooted in the American dream,” as he said, and one that hearkened back to America’s founding principles
“When these disinherited children of God sat down at lunch counters,” King wrote in his “Letter From a Birmingham Jail,” “they were in reality standing up for what is best in the American dream and for the most sacred values in our Judaeo-Christian heritage, thereby bringing our nation back to those great wells of democracy which were dug deep by the founding fathers in their formulation of the Constitution and the Declaration of Independence.”
Martin Luther King, Jr.’s understanding of these things—equality, the importance of faith and morality, and America’s founding principles—has great implications for our politics and policies today. While all Americans recall his ringing words, honest liberals and discerning conservatives ought to remind us of King’s real legacy.

http://blog.heritage.org/2012/01/15/martin-luther-king%E2%80%99s-conservative-principles/
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Apr, 2012 10:02 pm
@hawkeye10,
This is a lie Hawkeye, and not all surprising from the Heritage Foundation.

Martin Luther King never called for a "Color-Blind Society". He said that he wanted his children "to not be judged by the color of their skin". At the same time he was calling for mild reparations for slavery.

King himself called for quotas, from the beginning.

Again I would point out that the people with Dr. King through his career, who marched with Dr. King and laid down their lives with Dr. King, include people like Jesse Jackson and John Lewis.

None of them are with the Heritage Foundation.

0 Replies
 
snood
 
  2  
Reply Thu 5 Apr, 2012 10:05 pm
This thread started about the differences in perceptions when a black person wears a hoodie, and how that may or may not have affected what occured on the night of Feb 26th in Sanford, Florida.

Boomerang shared a video showing Geraldo putting forth the opinion that Trayvon's apparel choice that night was as much to blame for his death as anything.

I just thought I'd recap - since the thread had devolved at the hands of Lash, Finn, Omsick and Birdseye into a lamentation about how much conservatives love Dr King, and how racist blacks with victimhood mindsets and deceptive liberals are subverting the pursuit of justice.

I mean, really. But, have at it.

It sure ain't intellectually stimulating or spiritually uplifting, but I guess it's mildly amusing what kinds of crap some folks are selling here. And the behaviorist in me finds it kind of interesting that they seem to actually believe the horseshit they're peddling. I'd love to try to dissect a couple of 'em. Figuratively, of course.



ossobuco
 
  2  
Reply Thu 5 Apr, 2012 10:18 pm
@snood,
I'm still interested re who gets to wear what and be ok at some time in some place, with points for skin color or lack of it.
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Apr, 2012 10:18 pm
@maxdancona,
You are an unshakeable ideologue.

This post of yours in no way supports your previous outlandish claim.

Only you care whether or not King was a liberal.

I don't.

News flash: He didn't have to be right about everything (i.e. unions) to be a voice of wisdom on human relations.

BTW: I strongly opposed the Vietnam War too. Apparently that fundamentally links me to you and King (assuming you were even alive then)! How is the narrow minded partisan to explain this contradiction?

As for your quotation from his speech, when was that speech given?

Are you suggesting that our society, as respects racial issues, is unchanged since King made his speech?

Are you suggesting that he would have stood beside Jackson and Sharpton at the podium and joined in with their attempt to fan the flames?

Apparently so, because you reject the notion that we have to speculate about what a man now dead for some 40+ years might think, and once someone enters the liberal pantheon (ie Jackson) they can forever do no wrong. I suppose the "Hymietown" comments were deliberately misintepreted by those evil conservatives.

Can you imagine King casting aspersions about Jews?

How fortunate for you lefties that life is so certain.


Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Apr, 2012 10:20 pm
@snood,
Your affectation of disinterest falls well short of the mark.

snood
 
  2  
Reply Thu 5 Apr, 2012 10:22 pm
@ossobuco,
ossobuco wrote:

I'm still interested re who gets to wear what and be ok at some time in some place, with points for skin color or lack of it.


Yeh, me too. And I'm still thinking that what Geraldo said was similar to when guys say that a woman with a miniskirt has rape or sexual assault "coming to her".
snood
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Apr, 2012 10:24 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Finn dAbuzz wrote:

Your affectation of disinterest falls well short of the mark.




Pay attention, stinky. I said you and your nonsense interest me. You just ain't no fun, that's all.
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Thu 5 Apr, 2012 10:34 pm
@snood,
Quote:
Yeh, me too. And I'm still thinking that what Geraldo said was similar to when guys say that a woman with a miniskirt has rape or sexual assault "coming to her".


The way one dresses has a great influence on the kind of attention they get.....if one does not like the kind of attention that they are getting then they should do something about it. I was never one to say that there should be a free pass for dressing like a slut, and I dont believe that there should be one for dressing like a hoodlum either...
0 Replies
 
FreeDuck
 
  2  
Reply Thu 5 Apr, 2012 10:38 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
As enumerated in the post you responded to, that Zimmerman created the situation, was the adult of the two, was armed, and had several opportunities to change the outcome.
maxdancona
 
  2  
Reply Thu 5 Apr, 2012 10:40 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Quote:
For the Civil Rights Movement it was blacks embracing victimhood as the central definition of their identity.

What a tragedy that King died before his time, because I am sure that he never would have tolerated this corruption of his teachings.


This is the ridiculous quote of yours that started this whole Martin Luther King thing.

From the beginning (and I can give you references if you want), King was talking about economic injustice. The March On Washington (which you will probably know for the "I have a Dream Speech") in addition to calling for an end to segregation was also calling for a raised minimum wage, government action on jobs and a guarantee of housing. At that time, there are letters were Dr. King was discussing the benefits of government spending to guarantee income.

He also spoke quite a bit about how racial injustice affected law enforcement-- the very topic of this thread.

It doesn't seem like you have spent very much time learning about the real Martin Luther King (rather than the white conservative mythological image) .

I recommend you start by reading "Letter from a Birmingham Jail".



 

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