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What does the French mean?

 
 
Reply Sun 9 Oct, 2011 06:36 pm
Bactériologie-Hygiène Pitié Salpétrière Hospital, Assistance Publique–Hopitaux de Paris (AP–HP), UPMC Université de Paris, Paris, France
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Type: Question • Score: 0 • Views: 4,169 • Replies: 21
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Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Oct, 2011 03:34 am
@oristarA,
oristarA wrote:
Bactériologie-Hygiène Pitié Salpétrière Hôpital, Assistance Publique–Hopitaux de Paris (AP–HP), UPMC Université de Paris, Paris, France


Bacteriological Hygiene (or Hygienic Bacteriology, take your pick)

Pitié Salpétrière Hôpital is just the name of the hospital--i've taken the liberty of correcting your text, there is no such word as "hospital" in French. Hôtel Dieu and Pitié are common names for hospitals which were established by religious orders. The Salpétrière (which means the saltpeter mine, saltpeter being potassium nitrate) was first a castle, then a prison in Paris, which was torn down when Napoleon III made major renovations in Paris in the early 1850s. It was founded as a hospital, and retained the name which had been used by the prison formerly.

Public Assistance--Hospitals of Paris

I have no idea what the acronyms mean, and, of course, Université de Paris means University of Paris.
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Oct, 2011 03:54 am
Here's a little digression for you. In the late 17th century, the French language was reformed. Among the changes was the use of the circonflex (circumflex in English)--^--which indicated that there was once an "s" after the vowel which now had the circumflex over it. The "s" was no longer pronounced, so the diacritical mark, the circumflex, was used to indicate that it had once been there. So, hospital became hôpital, forest became forêt, mast became mât. English added those words before the change, so in English we have hospital, forest and mast. There are survivals of it in French--forêt is a forest, but forestier is a forester. I believe the French are abandoning the use of the circumflex.

Hôpital is singular, hôpitaux is plural.
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oristarA
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Oct, 2011 09:04 am
@Setanta,
Thank you Set.

Would you like to give me the transliteration of Pitié Salpétrière in English?
Setanta
 
  2  
Reply Mon 10 Oct, 2011 01:38 pm
@oristarA,
Geeze . . . First, i told you it's just the name of the hospital, and i've already explained that Pitié is simply a name commonly used when a religious order establishes a hospital. The word means pity, or mercy, but it would require a complicated religious explanation to tell you why that name in particular is used.

I've already translated salpétrière--it means a saltpeter mine. I also explained that it has that name because there used to be a prison there by that name, and although the prison is gone, the name has been retained.

Do i really need to bother to type careful responses, if they're not going to be read?
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  2  
Reply Mon 10 Oct, 2011 01:59 pm
Oh god . . . i just realized something you don't understand. Proper nouns--names--are not translated between European languages. So, if i saw this sentence in French:

Ils l'ont rendu a l'hôpital Pitié Salpétrière.

. . . i would translate that into English as:

They took him to the Pitié Salpétrière hospital.

Similarly, if i were to translate into French this sentence:

I read it in the New York Times.

. . . i would write:

Je l'ai lu au journal New York Times.

DO NOT translate proper names.

oristarA
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Oct, 2011 05:27 pm
@Setanta,
Setanta wrote:

Oh god . . . i just realized something you don't understand. Proper nouns--names--are not translated between European languages. So, if i saw this sentence in French:

Ils l'ont rendu a l'hôpital Pitié Salpétrière.

. . . i would translate that into English as:

They took him to the Pitié Salpétrière hospital.

Similarly, if i were to translate into French this sentence:

I read it in the New York Times.

. . . i would write:

Je l'ai lu au journal New York Times.

DO NOT translate proper names.




Cool.

The "l" is not pronounced in Salpétrière?








contrex
 
  1  
Reply Tue 11 Oct, 2011 12:12 am
@oristarA,
oristarA wrote:
The "l" is not pronounced in Salpétrière?


The l is pronounced. Why do you ask?
oristarA
 
  1  
Reply Tue 11 Oct, 2011 08:11 am
@contrex,
contrex wrote:

oristarA wrote:
The "l" is not pronounced in Salpétrière?


The l is pronounced. Why do you ask?



With google translator:
http://translate.google.cn/?hl=en#

In the English of the word , "l" is pronounced. But in French, seems no (or so light it cannot be traced).
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Tue 11 Oct, 2011 08:53 am
When Contrex tells you something about French, be assured that he knows what he's talking about.
oristarA
 
  1  
Reply Tue 11 Oct, 2011 09:51 am
@Setanta,
Setanta wrote:

When Contrex tells you something about French, be assured that he knows what he's talking about.


Thank you.

But you too are good at French. You've told me so, Set.
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Tue 11 Oct, 2011 10:11 am
@oristarA,
I doubt that i ever told you i was good at French. I can read French with a certain amount of facility, but i don't claim to be expert.
Rockhead
 
  1  
Reply Tue 11 Oct, 2011 10:14 am
@Setanta,
do you like cheese?
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Tue 11 Oct, 2011 10:23 am
@Rockhead,
Some kinds . . . but i never surrender to monkeys . . .
0 Replies
 
contrex
 
  2  
Reply Tue 11 Oct, 2011 10:53 am
The l is clearly audible here, pronounced by a human French native speaker

http://www.forvo.com/word/salp%C3%AAtri%C3%A8re/
0 Replies
 
oristarA
 
  1  
Reply Tue 11 Oct, 2011 09:35 pm
@Setanta,
Setanta wrote:


I have no idea what the acronyms mean, and, of course, Université de Paris means University of Paris.


I'd make another thread to address this.
Setanta
 
  2  
Reply Wed 12 Oct, 2011 02:35 am
@oristarA,
Knock yourself out--but keep in mind that if i encounter an acronym for English words with which i am unfamiliar, it is highly unlikely that i'll be able to decipher it. How much less likely is it that someone who is not a resident of Paris, working in an academic or medical field, is to know what the acronyms mean? Starting a new thread is not going to solve that problem.
contrex
 
  1  
Reply Wed 12 Oct, 2011 11:29 am
@Setanta,
Setanta wrote:
How much less likely is it that someone who is not a resident of Paris, working in an academic or medical field, is to know what the acronyms mean?


Surely one could take a guess from looking at "Assistance Publique–Hopitaux de Paris (AP–HP)", what "AP-HP" might mean?

1. Go to Google

2. Type in Hôpitaux de Paris (AP-HP). The circonflexe and the parentheses can be omitted.

3. Study the hits.

4. Surmise from the summaries that AP may stand for Assistance Publique.

5. Notice likewise that HP may stand for Hôpitaux de Paris.

6. Further notice that there is listed, not very far fromthe top, a Wikipedia entry in English for "Assistance Publique – Hôpitaux de Paris".

7. Read the summary at the top of the entry which says:

"The Assistance publique – Hôpitaux de Paris (AP-HP) is the public hospital system (établissement public de santé) of the city of Paris and its suburbs. Its headquarters are in the 4th arrondissement of Paris.

It is the largest hospital system in Europe and one of the largest in the world, it provides health care, teaching, research, prevention, education and emergency medical service in 52 branches of medicine. It employs more than 90,000 people (including 15,800 physicians) in 44 hospitals and receives more than 5.8 million annual patient visits.

The AP-HP is linked with the University of Paris and its seven colleges of medicine, two of odontology and two of pharmacy."

8. Possibly read the rest of the entry.

9. Repeat for UPMC Paris and discover what Université de Paris Pierre et Marie Curie is.

ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Wed 12 Oct, 2011 12:36 pm
@contrex,
That is great advice for the original poster. Hopefully it is followed.
contrex
 
  1  
Reply Wed 12 Oct, 2011 12:54 pm
@ehBeth,
ehBeth wrote:

That is great advice for the original poster. Hopefully it is followed.


I am pretty sure it will not be.
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