44
   

Why should rich people pay a greater share of their wealth to taxes?

 
 
BillRM
 
  0  
Reply Mon 19 Sep, 2011 08:20 am
@OmSigDAVID,
Some how David the coast guard never needed to had protected my yacht from being seize on the high seas.

Or threaten a foreign government because my banana plantation of a millions acres was taken and given to the peasants I had working on it for me. Drunk

0 Replies
 
parados
 
  1  
Reply Mon 19 Sep, 2011 07:40 pm
@OmSigDAVID,

Quote:
Government addresses larcenous conduct equally (with exceptions for petty larceny).

Really? So restitution is always the same dollar amount?
0 Replies
 
Fido
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Sep, 2011 08:27 am
@OmSigDAVID,
OmSigDAVID wrote:

The IDEOLOGY shoud be simply playing it straight
according to the scheme that derives from the social n political contract: the US Constitution,
with no deviation therefrom.





David
If it were simply a matter of playing it straight, you could say it is human nature for people to want to carve their livings out of the commonwealth... But when one can take so much more than they need, and keep it for all time to be enjoyed by generations to come; then they are doing absolute injury to the commonwealth... It is fine to take it, but to keep it as people do through manipulations of the law seems in accord with their ideology, but it kills society... Think of how long we have had our present economy and how fast the situation has devolved into mutual hatred between citizens and distrust of the government... Feudalism in its many forms has existed for thousands of years in some places, and easily five hundred years in Europe... Yet; while one many might be a king, and another a peasant, neither could claim ownership of the land, and it could not be alienated... The alienation of laborers from the product of their labor has led to the alienation of this whole nation from its common property, and from the government that was to protect the commonwealth... It cannot stand if it cannot tax, and even if it could stand, having enough of taxes, it could not long survive if opportunity to have a piece of the commonwealth were denied to so many so that a few could own most of it and control the rest of it... Consider, that while free citizens of Rome crouded the cities and were a spur to violence and tyranny, just six men owned the whole of Muretania... We know Rome by the greatness of its artifacts and not because it is present in the world today... Its inequality of wealth destroyed it along with many of its people... We want our commonwealth to endure, and the only way is to keep that wealth common where it can entice education, invention and ingenuity...Why American students do so poorly compared to others is obvious and has nothing to do with the want of teachers... The rewards of education shown even in the wages of teachers are gone... When the wages of hard work and education are the same as sloth and ignorance; that is: mere survival in the land of plenty, then why should anyone work hard for a misery that seems to be their fate???
0 Replies
 
Fido
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Sep, 2011 08:34 am
@parados,
parados wrote:

It seems you are ignoring the fact that income taxes were constitutional in certain forms prior the the 16th amendment. The 16th just made it possible to collect income tax on profits from rents.

You didn't address the issue of profits of more than $1 million are protected by the government so people that make more than $1 million ARE getting government protection not available to those making less than $1 million.
I any event; the peasant farmers and working class that made the tax constitutional only considered that 11 to 13% of the population would have to pay... They never considered that taxes on wages might be leveled upon everyone, and be used to force harder and cheaper work out of everyone, relieve property of the burden of taxation, and hasten the impoverishment of the whole people.. The income tax was aimed at financiers, and has been used to break the nation, and to build fortunes beyond the wildest dreams of avarice... The income tax was a tool to bring justice and equity to our society, but it has been turned into a weapon against the laboring class...
0 Replies
 
Fido
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Sep, 2011 08:35 am
@OmSigDAVID,
OmSigDAVID wrote:

parados wrote:
It seems you are ignoring the fact that income taxes were constitutional in certain forms prior the the 16th amendment. The 16th just made it possible to collect income tax on profits from rents.

You didn't address the issue of profits of more than $1 million are protected by the government so people that make more than $1 million ARE getting government protection not available to those making less than $1 million.
There is no reason to SINGLE OUT
millionaires. Government owes everyone protection equally.





David
Equality is a myth... Where economic inequality is the rule, political equality is a lie...
0 Replies
 
Fido
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Sep, 2011 08:47 am
@OmSigDAVID,
OmSigDAVID wrote:

parados wrote:
equally?
So the government should only protect your first $1000 since that is all it will protect of other people?

But the government does protect MY LIFE if I take your $1 millionth dollar?

Your "equality" is not very equal it seems David. Either that or you think $1 million is equal to $1000.
Government addresses larcenous conduct equally (with exceptions for petty larceny).
The Navy and Air Force defend us all equally.
The Weather Bureau serves us all equally.





David
Nonsense on top of bullshit... These armies of ours threaten the people, but they fight for "American Interests" abroad... They are like the Mohawks in days of old: The collectors of the ransom... An Iraq veteran told me the other day that the reason we went to Iraq is that Saddam stiffed a bunch of oil companies on drilling and pumping equipment so that Mr. Bush could destroy trillions of dollars in property, countless lives, and waste trillions in the process of collecting on a billion dollar debt... Who knows but that he is in part correct... When you can get the defense of this nation turned toward the protection of private interests as it so often has been, and get the very people who fight and die, or risk their lives to pay the taxes that support such adventures then fortunes will be made and more war will be forthcoming... The people cannot say no, and the government will not say no to the rich, and so the people must pay for what no nation can afford, at the risk of all they cannot afford to be without... I am telling you; that when we ship American dollars abroad to buy the affections of strangers then they will buy university educations for their children who will never leave us, who we cannot afford to be without since our own children must suffer ignorance as the price of world conquest... It is madness, but then, so is it madness to be governed by ideologies..
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Sep, 2011 08:54 am
@Fido,
Your delusions do not merit an answer; hopeless foolishness.
mismi
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Sep, 2011 04:06 pm
@Linkat,
Thank you Linkat Smile
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Sep, 2011 05:05 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
One question that had been coming into my mind is how long will it be before we decide to lower the cost of our military by offering citizenship to foreigns for military service on a large scale?

The benefits that so far had cause us to be able to field the current forces are already being talk about either being greatly reduce or done away with.

Technology and others factors made going back to the draft highly unlikely so setting up recruiting centers in Mexico and South America seem to be a possible solution.

It was good enough for Rome after all.
Fido
 
  1  
Reply Wed 21 Sep, 2011 05:56 am
@OmSigDAVID,
OmSigDAVID wrote:

Your delusions do not merit an answer; hopeless foolishness.
You do not have the answer... You have the question posing as the answer...
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Wed 21 Sep, 2011 06:32 am
@BillRM,
BillRM wrote:
One question that had been coming into my mind is how long will it be before we decide to lower the cost of our military by offering citizenship to foreigns for military service on a large scale?

The benefits that so far had cause us to be able to field the current forces are already being talk about either being greatly reduce or done away with.

Technology and others factors made going back to the draft highly unlikely so setting up recruiting centers in Mexico and South America seem to be a possible solution.




It was good enough for Rome after all.
WHAT happened to the Roman Empire????
parados
 
  1  
Reply Wed 21 Sep, 2011 07:04 am
@OmSigDAVID,
OmSigDAVID wrote:




WHAT happened to the Roman Empire????

They went downhill after they made Christianity their official religion.
Setanta
 
  2  
Reply Wed 21 Sep, 2011 07:07 am
We already offer the opportunity to take out citizenship to foreign nationals who enlist in our military, and have done for donkey's years.
H2O MAN
 
  -1  
Reply Wed 21 Sep, 2011 07:09 am


The so-called rich have been paying more than their fair share of taxes for many years.

Obama's class war fare campaign tactic is nothing but lies
parados
 
  2  
Reply Wed 21 Sep, 2011 07:10 am
@Setanta,
Next you'll be telling us that gays have been serving in the military.

OMG.. this isn't the America that Conservatives believe in.
parados
 
  3  
Reply Wed 21 Sep, 2011 07:10 am
@H2O MAN,
Quote:

The so-called rich have been paying more than their fair share of taxes for many years.

But the ACTUAL rich haven't been.
Setanta
 
  2  
Reply Wed 21 Sep, 2011 07:29 am
@parados,
I won't mention Alexander the Great, Iulius Ceasar and Richard Lionheart . . . them boys was too gay . . .
0 Replies
 
H2O MAN
 
  -2  
Reply Wed 21 Sep, 2011 08:07 am
@parados,

Proof that backs-up your feeble assertion is non existent.
0 Replies
 
Linkat
 
  1  
Reply Wed 21 Sep, 2011 08:37 am
Not sure if anyone has read this particular article, but according to the hard numbers - the rich (those making over $1 million) actually pay a higher tax rate than middle income. Again, according to the article and actual numbers of federal taxes paid, there is a small percentage (1%) of the "rich" that pay lower percentage taxes.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/breaking/chi-data-the-rich-actually-do-pay-more-taxes-20110920,0,3645513.story
Setanta
 
  3  
Reply Wed 21 Sep, 2011 08:53 am
@Linkat,
The article ignores something Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner points out at the very end of the article, and that is the source of income. For anyone who gets the majority of their income from capital gains, the highest nominal rate that they will pay is 15%. The entire article is disingenuous, because it's only talking about earned income, and capital gains are not treated as earned income.
 

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