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Is Roger Ebert Out of Line

 
 
Reply Wed 22 Jun, 2011 04:20 pm
For putting on Twitter "Friends don't let jackasses drink and drive" after a JackASS movie star died crashing his Porche at over 130 MPH while drunk at over twice the legal limit?

He has gotten some major grief for being insensitive, my take is that he said something factually true and useful. I dont think that he should have apologized, I am so sick of people saying sorry for speaking truth that other dont want to hear.
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Type: Discussion • Score: 6 • Views: 2,747 • Replies: 35
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OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Wed 22 Jun, 2011 04:30 pm
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:
For putting on Twitter "Friends don't let jackasses drink and drive" after a JackASS movie star died crashing his Porche at over 130 MPH while drunk at over twice the legal limit?

He has gotten some major grief for being insensitive, my take is that he said something factually true and useful. I dont think that he should have apologized, I am so sick of people saying sorry for speaking truth that other dont want to hear.
I heard that he is in very bad health.

Folks who r near death can speak very freely,
caring little of censure.
djjd62
 
  1  
Reply Wed 22 Jun, 2011 04:31 pm
@hawkeye10,
i don't get it either, comedian tracy morgan is on a national apology tour after making a joke about homosexuality at one of his shows

comedian rich vos was on opie and anthony last week, and he related a comment his wife made about people being offended at shows, she suggests you research the comedian you're going to see, she said "you wouldn't just sit down at a concert and say, i hope it's jazz"
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Wed 22 Jun, 2011 04:36 pm
@djjd62,
Quote:
i don't get it either, comedian tracy morgan is on a national apology tour after making a joke about homosexuality at one of his shows
That pisses me off as well. My thesis that we cant speak openly and truthfully in America anymore has been getting a lot of support over the last few years, as well as has my thesis that we have become a nation of victims.
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Wed 22 Jun, 2011 04:37 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
Quote:
Folks who r near death can speak very freely,
you seem to have missed the part where Ebert apologized....
Ragman
 
  1  
Reply Wed 22 Jun, 2011 05:14 pm
@hawkeye10,
In this case, IMHO, timing is everything. Let this guy's body get cold at least.

This really is not about someone (Ebert) not having the freedom to express his outrage or scorn - this is about his timing as to when he offered this critical scorn so soon. I see this as much more of a minor issue (the timing) - not the truth or relevance. Yes, Ebert apologized appropriately and contritely.

FWIW, Roger Ebert's health has currently stabilized after jaw and throat surgery to remove a malignant growth. He is voiceless but simulates 'speech' with a computerized voice synthesizer. At the moment, at least publicly, it's stated that he is cancer-free.

One can hope for timing where this victim's family at least have a funeral and a period of mourning before the media loaded up with people saying what a jackass their family member was.

Those other scenarios have little relevance to this case as they're not involved with a horrific death and grieving family members.

0 Replies
 
Butrflynet
 
  2  
Reply Wed 22 Jun, 2011 05:52 pm
Is Westboro Baptist Church also not out of line because they are speaking their version of truth?

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2011/06/21/westboro-baptists-church-to-picket-funeral-of-jackass-star-ryan-dunn/

Westboro Baptists Church to picket funeral of ‘Jackass’ star Ryan Dunn

The Westboro Baptists Church has announced plans to picket the funeral of Jackass star Ryan Dunn.

The Westboro Baptist Church has gained infamy for picketing the funerals of military families with offensive signs such as "Thank God for Dead Soldiers" and "God Hates America."

The church believes that God is punishing the United States because of America's acceptance of homosexuality.

Ryan Dunn and his passenger died in a car crash Monday in Pennsylvania. His 2007 Porsche 911 GT3 was going about 130 mph when it struck a guardrail, flew into a wooded valley and burst into flames, West Goshen Police Chief Michael Carroll told Radar Online.

Dunn tweeted a picture of himself drinking at a bar just hours before the accident, but toxicology reports will not come back until at least four weeks.

On their website, the Westboro Baptists announced they would picket any public memorial for the "proud sinner" Dunn, calling him a "drab pervert who hawked porn-level filth to get rich from a perverse generation."

They also declared that Pennsylvania was "one of the most evil states to ever exist."
rosborne979
 
  1  
Reply Wed 22 Jun, 2011 06:16 pm
@hawkeye10,
At least Ebert was tried in the court of "public opinion" rather than by the actual law. What bothers me more about such things is when someone tries to make an actual law which governs a behavior.

I think our society is just now relearning that the opinions of the society and people who surround you can be a more effective control over behavior than "laws" are.

Social Media interactions are giving new life to the age old tradition of public pillory (in a verbal sense). Whether a person is really right or wrong matters less than how the society that supports us perceives our actions.
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Wed 22 Jun, 2011 06:40 pm
@hawkeye10,

Quote:
Folks who r near death can speak very freely,
hawkeye10 wrote:
you seem to have missed the part where Ebert apologized....
I did. People can do that, if thay wanna.





David
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Wed 22 Jun, 2011 06:47 pm
@rosborne979,
Quote:
I think our society is just now relearning that the opinions of the society and people who surround you can be a more effective control over behavior than "laws" are.
the power brokers are not the peons in the mob, they are the folks with the money, they ones signing contracts and paychecks. Increasingly it is the corporate class which actively works to silence all deviations from the approved opinions. He with the gold makes the rules.....while I have not heard such yet you know that Ebert got a message from they who pay him demanding that he do the "right" thing,


EDIT: what this does of course is radicalize the people, because since there is no way to work with the current power system to make our voices heard we are confined to the shadows, as we gather strength for the revolution to overthrow the malignant American ruling class.
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Wed 22 Jun, 2011 06:51 pm
@Butrflynet,
Quote:
but toxicology reports will not come back until at least four weeks
so where does the report that he had BAC .196 come from??

http://news-briefs.ew.com/2011/06/22/ryan-dunn-drunk-driving-death/
Butrflynet
 
  1  
Reply Wed 22 Jun, 2011 06:58 pm
@hawkeye10,
http://www.courierpostonline.com/article/BL/20110622/NEWS/110622031/Toxicology-report-Jackass-star-Ryan-Dunn-drunk-time-fatal-crash?odyssey=nav|head

A toxicology report shows that "Jackass" star Ryan Dunn had a blood-alcohol content that was more than twice the legal limit for drivers in Pennsylvania when he and a passenger died in a fiery one-car crash this week.

Dunn's Porsche may have been traveling as fast as 140 mph in a 55 mph zone when it jumped a guardrail, flew into a wooded ravine, struck a tree and burst into flames, police said.

His blood-alcohol level was 0.196 at the time of the Monday morning crash, according to the toxicology report released today by West Goshen Township Police. The legal limit for drivers is .08.

0 Replies
 
rosborne979
 
  1  
Reply Wed 22 Jun, 2011 07:25 pm
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:
while I have not heard such yet you know that Ebert got a message from they who pay him demanding that he do the "right" thing,

Such a message would be redundant since he had already heard directly from the people who make him valuable in the first place, his audience.
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Wed 22 Jun, 2011 07:32 pm
@rosborne979,
rosborne979 wrote:

hawkeye10 wrote:
while I have not heard such yet you know that Ebert got a message from they who pay him demanding that he do the "right" thing,

Such a message would be redundant since he had already heard directly from the people who make him valuable in the first place, his audience.
My understanding is the the public comments were about evenly split between support of his comments and non support, there was no consensus from the mob that Ebert was wrong, though I never saw the facebook page before it was pulled by facebook (a bunch that I have no use for these days, with their militant censorship). In any case we do not know that Ebert is interested in the mobs opinion, though we can assume that he is interested in continuing his life's work, which he can be deprived of at any time.
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Wed 22 Jun, 2011 08:16 pm
@Butrflynet,
Quote:
They also declared that Pennsylvania was "one of the most evil states to ever exist."
ONE OF??? Hell, we can out evil any three states. You never find our victims, Dunns only **** up was to take this really spiffy car with him. He could do 130 in his tricked out pickem up truck.
Drunks need to choose how they are to stay off the roads, he chose----- poorly.
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Wed 22 Jun, 2011 08:16 pm
@hawkeye10,
last comments on Eberts Blog, a mix of support and none support

Quote:
974 Comments
Sam | June 21, 2011 10:31 AM
I think the lesson for this pundit is to be less arrogant about how many Yes-men you can glean on your Facebook and Twitter pages. After all, they might just turn out to be jackasses.

Screw you! | June 21, 2011 10:31 AM
Not cool. Glad your Facebook page is gone!...just like your career.

Daniel Bentley | June 21, 2011 10:32 AM
Roger, you were a bit of a jackass yourself.

People don't need truth bombs when they're grieving.

Joachim Moncoq | June 21, 2011 10:34 AM
Dear Roger,
you are right and you used the right words!
I lost 4 people, because their life have been taken away by drunk drivers! My fathers brother died because of this when I was very young, but I still remember. One friend riding a bike was hit by a car, because of a drunk driver lost his lane and 2 other friends (a couple) were killed because of a drunken truck driver.
There's no excuse for driving drunk! Thank You for making that clear and don't let yourself get touched by all those mindless jerks, who attack you.
It's not too early to say something like that and you, Roger, used the right words at exactly the right time! Maybe somebody sees this at the reason, to change some risky behavior! Maybe lives will be saved because of this.
Thank you again and Greetings from Germany, Joachim

IRAP | June 21, 2011 10:37 AM
It is disgraceful that you would vilified for speaking the truth. Whether he was a drunk driver, an extreme speeder or both together, he was a stupid man for drinking, getting in the car and driving. What if he had killed a family with kids? Drunk drivers go to hell! He could have called a cab or the police or call a friend or family. Why is everyone on Mr. Ebert's case? He was being honest and truthful. It doesn't matter that the guy just died and took another life with him. He was either drunk or speeding or drunk and speeding because he thought he was immortal. I hope you idiots protesting against Mr. Ebert never know what it's like to lose a loved one to a drunk driver or an irresponsible speeder! My full support for Roger Ebert.

Zac | June 21, 2011 10:37 AM
It's sad, really sad.

d pestle | June 21, 2011 10:37 AM
I support you Roger. I think Ryan would have found your tweet appropriate and true in timing, subject and syntax. Keep writing I will always be reading!

akell | June 21, 2011 10:38 AM
As far as I'm concerned, drinking and driving is wrong, I'm sure most people would agree, but it is also wrong to unnecessarily bring up the negatives about a person who has just died. You need to be more sensitive to the fact that Ryan Dunn was someones best friend, son, brother, and so much more... The tweets you posted were insensitive, and no one needed to be reminded of how he may have died, that's not what needs to happen right now, what needs to happen is grieving and mourning, not focusing on the negative. If you lost a loved one, you'd be outraged too, if the first remarks you saw, or heard, were about how their friends were wrong for letting them drink and drive. ESPECIALLY, where you don't even know if alcohol was a factor... everyone's tolerance is different. I still think you were wrong, regardless of your apologies.

Rebekah | June 21, 2011 10:38 AM
You aren't wrong. Perhaps ill-timed but it's a message that needs to be out there. Drunk driving kills people. And some of those killed are completely innocent. Unfortunately, all too often the message doesn't register with those who need it most.

Nobody is indestructible. Not even jackasses.

Renna | June 21, 2011 10:39 AM
You shouldn't have to apologize (or have you fan page removed) for what you said, it was the truth. If people took that the wrong way, it's their own problem. Friends shouldn't let friends drink and drive and people should be aware of that.

Adam Willis | June 21, 2011 10:39 AM
I don't think you did anything wrong. It was was most people were thinking anyway. I don't think people realize how horrible drunk driving really is until it kills them. This whole ridiculous episode will bring drunk driving into the spotlight for a little while, and that is a very good thing.


http://blogs.suntimes.com/ebert/2011/06/_bam_margera_i_just_lost.html#trackbacks

and it turns out that he did not exactly apologize

Quote:
"I offer my sympathy to Ryan Dunn's family and friends, and to those of Zachary Hartwell, who also died in the crash," Ebert, 69, posted on his blog Tuesday. "I mean that sincerely. It is tragic to lose a loved one. I also regret that my tweet about the event was considered cruel. It was not intended as cruel. It was intended as true."


farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Wed 22 Jun, 2011 08:18 pm
@hawkeye10,
Like us, people who read Facebook ****, have too much free time and not enough real lives
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Wed 22 Jun, 2011 10:20 pm
Who really cares?

Vile calumny would be Ebert contending that
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Wed 22 Jun, 2011 10:27 pm
Who really cares?

A Jackass member died in a car crash...

Who doesn't believe alcohol was a factor?

Maybe it had nothing to do with the accident, but it's hardly a huge leap to suggest it did.

Does a Jackass member really have a personal image that can be diminished by the contention that he died because he was drunk?

Besides, Ebert looks like a freaking puppet...how can you take his opinions seriously?
rosborne979
 
  1  
Reply Thu 23 Jun, 2011 04:50 am
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:

rosborne979 wrote:

hawkeye10 wrote:
while I have not heard such yet you know that Ebert got a message from they who pay him demanding that he do the "right" thing,

Such a message would be redundant since he had already heard directly from the people who make him valuable in the first place, his audience.
My understanding is the the public comments were about evenly split between support of his comments and non support, there was no consensus from the mob that Ebert was wrong, though I never saw the facebook page before it was pulled by facebook (a bunch that I have no use for these days, with their militant censorship). In any case we do not know that Ebert is interested in the mobs opinion, though we can assume that he is interested in continuing his life's work, which he can be deprived of at any time.

All I'm saying is that anyone who makes their living by selling their "image" to a portion of the public needs to be careful how they manage that image. And to some degree or another, we all market our own image to whatever group of society that we surround ourselves with. Our A2K "images" included.

I suspect that Ebert's retraction was just Ebert himself managing image control.
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