Can we do anything of our own free will?

wayne wrote:

kennethamy wrote:

The answer is yes, and the argument is:

1. To do something of one's own free will is to do it without being compelled to do it.
2. We sometimes do things, we are not compelled to do.

Therefore, 3. we sometime do things of our own free will.

Is there some objection to this argument?

How can I be certain that you were not compelled to write the post by some force of which we are unaware?
After all, mankind remained unaware of the oxygen molecules racing through our blood stream for the greater portion of human existence.

I can give you examples. I was not compelled to write this post, but I did it. So writing this post is something I did without being compelled to do it.
My objection is that #2 is not entirely true.
It assumes that what we believe to be true is knowledge.

The knowledge we have, however, tells us that we sometimes do things which we believe we are not compelled to do.

I see no evidence whatsover, provided by your argument, to tell me that belief is either true or false.

Can you show me that #2 is anything other than opinion, or belief?

wayne wrote:

kennethamy wrote:

The answer is yes, and the argument is:

1. To do something of one's own free will is to do it without being compelled to do it.
2. We sometimes do things, we are not compelled to do.

Therefore, 3. we sometime do things of our own free will.

Is there some objection to this argument?

I can give you examples. I was not compelled to write this post, but I did it. So writing this post is something I did without being compelled to do it.
My objection is that #2 is not entirely true.
It assumes that what we believe to be true is knowledge.

The knowledge we have, however, tells us that we sometimes do things which we believe we are not compelled to do.

I see no evidence whatsover, provided by your argument, to tell me that belief is either true or false.

Can you show me that #2 is anything other than opinion, or belief?

Hey Joe, I have a question.

Do you think we can assume that kennethamy is ignoring us, at this point? I'd like to know for future reference.

Hey Joe, I have a question.

Do you think we can assume that kennethamy is ignoring us, at this point? I'd like to know for future reference.

kennethamy wrote:

wayne wrote:

kennethamy wrote:

The answer is yes, and the argument is:

1. To do something of one's own free will is to do it without being compelled to do it.
2. We sometimes do things, we are not compelled to do.

Therefore, 3. we sometime do things of our own free will.

Is there some objection to this argument?

I can give you examples. I was not compelled to write this post, but I did it. So writing this post is something I did without being compelled to do it.
My objection is that #2 is not entirely true.
It assumes that what we believe to be true is knowledge.

The knowledge we have, however, tells us that we sometimes do things which we believe we are not compelled to do.

I see no evidence whatsover, provided by your argument, to tell me that belief is either true or false.

Can you show me that #2 is anything other than opinion, or belief?

Do you think I was lying when I said I was not compelled to write this post? Believe me, I did write the post because I wanted to. No one forced me to do it. I know that no one forced me to do it. Why would you think I do not?

wayne wrote:

kennethamy wrote:

The answer is yes, and the argument is:

1. To do something of one's own free will is to do it without being compelled to do it.
2. We sometimes do things, we are not compelled to do.

Therefore, 3. we sometime do things of our own free will.

Is there some objection to this argument?

I can give you examples. I was not compelled to write this post, but I did it. So writing this post is something I did without being compelled to do it.
My objection is that #2 is not entirely true.
It assumes that what we believe to be true is knowledge.

The knowledge we have, however, tells us that we sometimes do things which we believe we are not compelled to do.

I see no evidence whatsover, provided by your argument, to tell me that belief is either true or false.

Can you show me that #2 is anything other than opinion, or belief?

kennethamy wrote:

kennethamy wrote:

wayne wrote:

What confuses me is why you think compulsion has anything to do with the existence of freewill.

Because when I ask a person whether he did something of his own free will, as for instance, whether he married his wife of his own free will, and he says he did, then I would understand him as denying that he was compelled to marry his wife. What would you understand him as saying?

wayne wrote:

kennethamy wrote:

kennethamy wrote:

wayne wrote:

What confuses me is why you think compulsion has anything to do with the existence of freewill.

Because when I ask a person whether he did something of his own free will, as for instance, whether he married his wife of his own free will, and he says he did, then I would understand him as denying that he was compelled to marry his wife. What would you understand him as saying?

He may very well have been compelled to marry his wife, and decided to marry her anyway. Why would anyone marry if they were not compelled to do so?
We are compelled to do many things which we do not do. Some people don't pay their taxes, in spite of being compelled to do so. Of course, they are generally then forced to do so.
I myself pay my taxes of my own freewill, in spite of being compelled to do so, I am aware that our infrastructure requires my contribution.

Even when we are compelled to do something, we may do it of our own freewill, awareness and intent have far more to do with it than compulsion.

Why would anyone marry if they were not compelled to do so?

wayne wrote:

Why would anyone marry if they were not compelled to do so?

You are kidding- I hope. The point isn't whether we are compelled to do many of the things we do. The point is that we are not compelled to do some of the things we do. Those who say there is no free will are saying that we are compelled to do everything we do. Is that your view. For instance, is it your view that you are compelled to post every post you have posted?

Pulsion
(latin pulsio, action de pousser, pellere, pulsum, traduction de l'allemand Trieb). La théorie des pulsions, Amour et Faim, Vie(Eros) et Mort(Thanatos) est un concept fondamental de la psychanalyse. La pulsion est définie par Freud comme une poussée ponctuelle et motrice qui vise à une satisfaction et est le moyen initial de cette satisfaction. Son étude permet de rendre compte des modalités du rapport à l'objet et de la recherche de la satisfaction.

Noun

compulsion (plural compulsions)

1. An irrational need to perform some action, often despite negative consequences.

During the basketball game, I had a sudden compulsion to have a smoke.

2. The use of authority, influence, or other power to force (compel) a person or persons to act.
3. The lawful use of violence (i.e. by the administration).

wayne wrote:

Why would anyone marry if they were not compelled to do so?

You are kidding- I hope. The point isn't whether we are compelled to do many of the things we do. The point is that we are not compelled to do some of the things we do. Those who say there is no free will are saying that we are compelled to do everything we do. Is that your view. For instance, is it your view that you are compelled to post every post you have posted?

kennethamy wrote:

wayne wrote:

Why would anyone marry if they were not compelled to do so?

You are kidding- I hope. The point isn't whether we are compelled to do many of the things we do. The point is that we are not compelled to do some of the things we do. Those who say there is no free will are saying that we are compelled to do everything we do. Is that your view. For instance, is it your view that you are compelled to post every post you have posted?

I do not believe that I am compelled to post, but, given my limited awareness, I may be compelled by some force of which I am not aware.

I think it is obvious we have freewill, in the same limited sense that we have physical strength.
Those who say we are compelled to do everything we do are ignoring the fact that we may be aware that the ringing phone compels us to answer it, yet we may then intend to answer it of our own freewill, in spite of being compelled to do so.

kennethamy wrote:

wayne wrote:

Why would anyone marry if they were not compelled to do so?

You are kidding- I hope. The point isn't whether we are compelled to do many of the things we do. The point is that we are not compelled to do some of the things we do. Those who say there is no free will are saying that we are compelled to do everything we do. Is that your view. For instance, is it your view that you are compelled to post every post you have posted?

I do not believe that I am compelled to post, but, given my limited awareness, I may be compelled by some force of which I am not aware.

I think it is obvious we have freewill, in the same limited sense that we have physical strength.
Those who say we are compelled to do everything we do are ignoring the fact that we may be aware that the ringing phone compels us to answer it, yet we may then intend to answer it of our own freewill, in spite of being compelled to do so.