Reply Wed 27 May, 2009 09:32 pm
Well, Bam's made his nomination and we all "No" how the GOP will vote. Honestly I'm beginning to think this is a train and that there is not much way to avoid this train wreck. Of course I'm talking about the minority trying to "shut the Senate down in every way" if the majority adopts rules that will do what the Senate has done for 200 years, which is to vote up or down the President's judicial nominees.

We must put an end to this mockery of our system before it becomes impossible to undo the damage. I am sure a lot of Americans believe this is politics as usual. It is not. Filibustering of judicial nominations is an unprecedented intrusion into the longstanding practice of the Senate's approval of judges. We have a constitutional obligation of advise and consent when it comes to judicial nominees. While there has always been debate about nominees, the filibuster has never been used in partisan fashion to block an up-or-down vote on someone who has the support of a majority of the Senate.

History has proven the wisdom of having the President place judges with the support of the majority of the Senate. That process ensures balance on the court between judges placed by Republican Presidents and those placed by Democrat Presidents. The current obstruction led by Senate Republican leaders threatens that balance. It's time to make sure all judges receive a fair vote on the Senate floor.

What say you, ladies and gentlemen?
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Numpty
 
  1  
Reply Fri 29 May, 2009 01:17 am
@Sabz5150,
Sabz5150;65320 wrote:
Well, Bam's made his nomination and we all "No" how the GOP will vote. Honestly I'm beginning to think this is a train and that there is not much way to avoid this train wreck. Of course I'm talking about the minority trying to "shut the Senate down in every way" if the majority adopts rules that will do what the Senate has done for 200 years, which is to vote up or down the President's judicial nominees.

We must put an end to this mockery of our system before it becomes impossible to undo the damage. I am sure a lot of Americans believe this is politics as usual. It is not. Filibustering of judicial nominations is an unprecedented intrusion into the longstanding practice of the Senate's approval of judges. We have a constitutional obligation of advise and consent when it comes to judicial nominees. While there has always been debate about nominees, the filibuster has never been used in partisan fashion to block an up-or-down vote on someone who has the support of a majority of the Senate.

History has proven the wisdom of having the President place judges with the support of the majority of the Senate. That process ensures balance on the court between judges placed by Republican Presidents and those placed by Democrat Presidents. The current obstruction led by Senate Republican leaders threatens that balance. It's time to make sure all judges receive a fair vote on the Senate floor.

What say you, ladies and gentlemen?


Will someone please Assasinate Gordon Brown is what I say Very Happy Sorry
0 Replies
 
g-man
 
  1  
Reply Sun 31 May, 2009 09:23 pm
@Sabz5150,
Sabz5150;65320 wrote:

What say you, ladies and gentlemen?


Sounds like you object to the opposition opposing.
Didn't hear much of this complaint as Robert Bork and Justice Thomas were being ripped apart.
What asset is there for the GOP to vote "yea" on?

I doubt you have a serious concern. The republican party has no one who is courageous enough to subject him or herself to the media attacks and barrage of personal attacks that would certainly follow any serious criticism of Sotomayor. Besides, Harry Reid has issued his warning to anyone who dare vote against or speak ill of Cinderella.
A few comments will be made concerning her bigotry toward white men. But those will quickly be silenced.
This woman has been selected based on bigotry. The short list consisted of 5 women. No men were even considered. The fact that 80% of her decisions have been reversed by the supreme court is disregarded.
She is chosen due to her ethnicity and her interesting "life experiences". Nothing to do with her qualifications.
Qualifications matter in this job. "Interpretation of law".
Sympathy nor empathy have any place in the function.
The justice statue has a blindfold for a reason.
NotHereForLong
 
  1  
Reply Sun 31 May, 2009 11:35 pm
@Sabz5150,
Valedictorian of her high school. Went to Princeton on a full scholarship. Then Yale law school on scholarship. Assistant district attorney from 1976 to 1984. In 1984- entered the private practice as a civil litigation lawyer. 1991- nominated by the first George Bush to be a judge on a US District Court. 1997- nominated by Clinton to a Court of Appeals.

So that's 15 years as a lawyer and 18 years as a judge. 33 years in the legal system total, in a number of different roles.

By contrast, Thomas had 17 years experience when he was nominated to the Supreme Court and just 2 as a judge. Alito had 30 years of experiance when he was nominated and 16 as a judge. Anthony Kennedy had 27 years of experience

Sotomeyor has more experience than any of them. She's perfectly qualified.

"This woman has been selected based on bigotry."

She's been chosen in part because she's a woman and hispanic. But (unlike Thomas), she was also chosen because she's qualified and has a pretty moderate record.

"A few comments will be made concerning her bigotry toward white men."

You've been watching too much Fox News or listening to too much Limbaugh. They don't give the news. They spin it. Get your head out of your ass.
Sabz5150
 
  1  
Reply Mon 1 Jun, 2009 09:04 am
@g-man,
g-man;65352 wrote:
Sounds like you object to the opposition opposing.
Didn't hear much of this complaint as Robert Bork and Justice Thomas were being ripped apart.
What asset is there for the GOP to vote "yea" on?


Really?

Lamar Alexander (R-TN) 04/12/2005 wrote:

I am beginning to think it is a train and that there is not much way to avoid a train wreck. The train wreck I am talking about is a threat by the minority to 'shut the Senate down in every way' if the majority adopts rules that will do what the Senate has done for 200 years, which is to vote up or down the President's appellate judicial nominees.


John Ensign (R-NV) 05/11/2005 wrote:

We must put an end to this mockery of our system before it becomes impossible to undo the damage. I am sure a lot of Americans believe this is politics as usual. It is not. Filibustering of judicial nominations is an unprecedented intrusion into the longstanding practice of the Senate's approval of judges. We have a constitutional obligation of advise and consent when it comes to judicial nominees. While there has always been debate about nominees, the filibuster has never been used in partisan fashion to block an up-or-down vote on someone who has the support of a majority of the Senate.


Chuck Grassley (R-IA) 05/08/2005 wrote:

History has proven the wisdom of having the President place judges with the support of the majority of the Senate. That process ensures balance on the court between judges placed by Republican Presidents and those placed by Democrat Presidents. The current obstruction led by Senate Democratic leaders threatens that balance. It's time to make sure all judges receive a fair vote on the Senate floor.


Tagged "watchthis" for a reason.

This is what was said when Bush was shoving Roberts and Alito through. Wanna talk about your "activists"? Look no further than those two. Wasn't there talk of a "nuclear option" thingamajig... something about nixing the filibuster? Wouldn't that have left a nasty scar?

This is why I like Obama. He's doing it right and having fun with it. Not the "let's ride the roller coaster, daddy!" type of fun... this is more of a Saw sort of fun.


Quote:
I doubt you have a serious concern. The republican party has no one who is courageous enough to subject him or herself to the media attacks and barrage of personal attacks that would certainly follow any serious criticism of Sotomayor. Besides, Harry Reid has issued his warning to anyone who dare vote against or speak ill of Cinderella.
A few comments will be made concerning her bigotry toward white men. But those will quickly be silenced.
This woman has been selected based on bigotry. The short list consisted of 5 women. No men were even considered. The fact that 80% of her decisions have been reversed by the supreme court is disregarded.
She is chosen due to her ethnicity and her interesting "life experiences". Nothing to do with her qualifications.
Qualifications matter in this job. "Interpretation of law".
Sympathy nor empathy have any place in the function.
The justice statue has a blindfold for a reason.


Why do they call it a tea party when all they drink is kool-aid?

You bit on to the so-called 80% (it's actually 60) reversal rate, but that number means jack. If you take everything she's done into consideration, it's more like 2%. But the rightwingnutosphere doesn't feed its drones that information...

Also, the "life experiences" bit was mirrored by Alito during his Senate hearings. But of course that's just another piece of outta' context. We call it "quote mining" when the creotards do it.

I want the GOP to pull a stunt. Please do. It'll show their hypocrisy from sea to shining sea and they'll all but lose any chance of gaining seats in 2010. Ol Normie is already costing you guys a pretty penny... politically and financially. Can their camel bear another straw?

Live or die. Make your choice. Smile
0 Replies
 
Sabz5150
 
  1  
Reply Mon 1 Jun, 2009 09:07 am
@NotHereForLong,
NotHereForLong;65357 wrote:
Valedictorian of her high school. Went to Princeton on a full scholarship. Then Yale law school on scholarship. Assistant district attorney from 1976 to 1984. In 1984- entered the private practice as a civil litigation lawyer. 1991- nominated by the first George Bush to be a judge on a US District Court. 1997- nominated by Clinton to a Court of Appeals.

So that's 15 years as a lawyer and 18 years as a judge. 33 years in the legal system total, in a number of different roles.

By contrast, Thomas had 17 years experience when he was nominated to the Supreme Court and just 2 as a judge. Alito had 30 years of experiance when he was nominated and 16 as a judge. Anthony Kennedy had 27 years of experience

Sotomeyor has more experience than any of them. She's perfectly qualified.

"This woman has been selected based on bigotry."

She's been chosen in part because she's a woman and hispanic. But (unlike Thomas), she was also chosen because she's qualified and has a pretty moderate record.

"A few comments will be made concerning her bigotry toward white men."

You've been watching too much Fox News or listening to too much Limbaugh. They don't give the news. They spin it. Get your head out of your ass.


Psst. She isn't far-right.
0 Replies
 
Grouch
 
  1  
Reply Mon 1 Jun, 2009 03:08 pm
@Sabz5150,
Bush Jr. Nominated the first Hispanic so this bullshit that she is important because of that is just garbage coming from the Dems.

She's already proven to be both a sexist, racist and have apparently little care for the actual role of a judge (hint, its not to make policy). While her credentials are great, her actions prove her to be unfit. Out side of settle the baseball strike in 95 she has made no name for herself, and many of her peers are already questioning her abilities and behavior behind the bench.

But Obama has the government in his hand, and has already eluded to the press that it would not be a good idea to try and disrupt or dispute he confirmation.

Its as partisan of a choice as has ever been made, it is not one based on merit or outstanding work.
Sabz5150
 
  1  
Reply Mon 1 Jun, 2009 08:03 pm
@Grouch,
Grouch;65365 wrote:
Bush Jr. Nominated the first Hispanic so this bull**** that she is important because of that is just garbage coming from the Dems.

She's already proven to be both a sexist, racist and have apparently little care for the actual role of a judge (hint, its not to make policy). While her credentials are great, her actions prove her to be unfit. Out side of settle the baseball strike in 95 she has made no name for herself, and many of her peers are already questioning her abilities and behavior behind the bench.

But Obama has the government in his hand, and has already eluded to the press that it would not be a good idea to try and disrupt or dispute he confirmation.

Its as partisan of a choice as has ever been made, it is not one based on merit or outstanding work.


Actually, in some cases it IS the responsibility of a judge to make policy. Roe v. Wade? Excellent example. Whenever you have two disputing parties at that level, you're gonna wind up setting policy one way or another.

The sexist and racist schpeel is nonstop banter from the Right. Remember... Jones was "one of theirs" (their own words) before denounced as an activist who received death threats all because of one little bit of "policy" setting in Dover.

Don't believe the hype.
NotHereForLong
 
  1  
Reply Tue 2 Jun, 2009 05:32 am
@Sabz5150,
"Its as partisan of a choice as has ever been made"

Are you serious? Part of the reason she was chosen was because she hasn't made many rulings on hot button social issues and she generally sided with the conservative side when she did.

From wikipedia:

"Over her ten years on the circuit court, Sotomayor has heard appeals in more than 3,000 cases, and has written about 380 opinions where she was in the majority.[8] The Supreme Court reviewed five of those, reversing three and affirming two[8] – not high numbers for an appellate judge of that many years.[12] Sotomayor's circuit court rulings have led to her being considered a political centrist by the American Bar Association Journal[39][65] and other sources and organizations.[39][52][65][66][67][68] Several lawyers, legal experts, and news organizations, however, identify her as someone who has liberal inclinations.[69][70][71] In any case, the Second Circuit's caseload typically skews more towards business and securities law rather than hot-button social or constitutional issues.[12] Sotomayor has tended to write narrowly-formed rulings that rely upon close application of the law rather than import general philosophical viewpoints.[12] Sotomayor's influence in the federal judiciary, as measured by the number of citations of her rulings by other judges and in law review articles, has increased significantly during the length of her appellate judgeship and has been greater than that of some other prominent federal appeals court judges.[72]

Sotomayor was a member of the Second Circuit Task Force on Gender, Racial and Ethnic Fairness in the Courts.[59] In October 2001, she presented the annual Judge Mario G. Olmos Memorial Lecture at UC Berkeley School of Law;[11] entitled "A Latina Judge's Voice", it was published in the Berkeley La Raza Law Journal the following spring.[73] In the speech, she discussed the characteristics of her Latina upbringing and culture and discussed the history of minorities and women ascending to the federal bench.[74] She said the low number of minority women on the federal bench at that time was "shocking".[31] She then discussed at length how her own experiences as a Latina might affect her decisions as a judge.[74] In any case, her past background in activism has not necessarily influenced her rulings: a study of 50 racial discrimination cases brought before her panel showed that 45 of them were rejected, with Sotomayor never filing a dissent.[31]"

Doesn't sound that "partisan" to me. The Republicans would be spinning almost anyone Obama had chosen as "the most partisan of a choice as has ever been made".
NotHereForLong
 
  1  
Reply Tue 2 Jun, 2009 06:01 am
@Sabz5150,
I actually wouldn't have a problem with Obama chosing someone partisan. After all, the Republicans choose someone partisan whenever they can; Alito, Roberts, Scalia, Thomas. Every Republican president faces pressure from the religious right to choose someone way out of the mainstream. Democratic presidents don't face similar pressure from liberals when it comes to the supreme court. And that's why both Clinton and Obama choose moderates. It's in the political interests of Democrats to nominate left of center moderates, and the political interests of Republicans to nominate far right wingers.
Sabz5150
 
  1  
Reply Tue 2 Jun, 2009 08:27 pm
@NotHereForLong,
NotHereForLong;65369 wrote:
I actually wouldn't have a problem with Obama chosing someone partisan. After all, the Republicans choose someone partisan whenever they can; Alito, Roberts, Scalia, Thomas. Every Republican president faces pressure from the religious right to choose someone way out of the mainstream. Democratic presidents don't face similar pressure from liberals when it comes to the supreme court. And that's why both Clinton and Obama choose moderates. It's in the political interests of Democrats to nominate left of center moderates, and the political interests of Republicans to nominate far right wingers.


Because when the Right chooses a justice, it boils down to one single thing:

Abortion.

The Right literally kills over that.
Sabz5150
 
  1  
Reply Tue 2 Jun, 2009 09:14 pm
@Sabz5150,
http://www.cagle.com/working/090530/beeler.jpg

Sums it up neatly.
0 Replies
 
g-man
 
  1  
Reply Wed 3 Jun, 2009 12:27 am
@Sabz5150,
Sabz5150;65366 wrote:
Actually, in some cases it IS the responsibility of a judge to make policy. Roe v. Wade? Excellent example. Whenever you have two disputing parties at that level, you're gonna wind up setting policy one way or another.

The sexist and racist schpeel is nonstop banter from the Right. Remember... Jones was "one of theirs" (their own words) before denounced as an activist who received death threats all because of one little bit of "policy" setting in Dover.

Don't believe the hype.


Because Roe vs Wade was decided by a court and became law, does not make it the "correct" manner to have handled it.
Law, concerning the destruction of living beings should have been put up for referendum.
The court should have decided only on that case and then had the policy set by the people via vote.
But, they knew where that would have led.
Cowards on the right, fearing the press, knees shaking have cost a lot of lives. Makes one hope for the existence of hell.
Sabz5150
 
  1  
Reply Wed 3 Jun, 2009 01:03 am
@g-man,
g-man;65374 wrote:
Because Roe vs Wade was decided by a court and became law, does not make it the "correct" manner to have handled it.
Law, concerning the destruction of living beings should have been put up for referendum.
The court should have decided only on that case and then had the policy set by the people via vote.
But, they knew where that would have led.
Cowards on the right, fearing the press, knees shaking have cost a lot of lives. Makes one hope for the existence of hell.


Conservative to English translation: I don't like the law because it conflicts with my faith, therefore the law is wrong.
Grouch
 
  1  
Reply Wed 3 Jun, 2009 02:24 am
@Sabz5150,
Sabz5150;65366 wrote:
Actually, in some cases it IS the responsibility of a judge to make policy. Roe v. Wade? Excellent example. Whenever you have two disputing parties at that level, you're gonna wind up setting policy one way or another.

The sexist and racist schpeel is nonstop banter from the Right. Remember... Jones was "one of theirs" (their own words) before denounced as an activist who received death threats all because of one little bit of "policy" setting in Dover.

Don't believe the hype.


Its a Judges job to see if a law is constitutional, that is what a supreme court justice does. That is what Roe V Wade did, it said that anti-abortion laws were unconstitutional because they violated the right to privacy and due process. It only made policy in that clarified how far these rights extend. And no decent judge should have the gall to say, "its our job to make policy". That's exactly not their job.

See you're not providing any reason why she is good choice. all you're doing is trying to down play why she sucks.

If a white man said the opposite of what she said, he would be lambasted for life his legal career done and rightfully so. You know that is true, but for some reason we are sheeple for wanting to hold her to the same standard. You'll have to explain that one if you wish to be taking seriously.
0 Replies
 
Grouch
 
  1  
Reply Wed 3 Jun, 2009 02:27 am
@NotHereForLong,
NotHereForLong;65367 wrote:


Doesn't sound that "partisan" to me. The Republicans would be spinning almost anyone Obama had chosen as "the most partisan of a choice as has ever been made".



Learn to quote. :thumbdown:
0 Replies
 
NotHereForLong
 
  1  
Reply Wed 3 Jun, 2009 05:11 am
@Sabz5150,
"Learn to quote."

I was quoting you from memory and i misquoted you slightly. You wrote, "Its as partisan of a choice as has ever been made". I wrote, "the most partisan of a choice as has ever been made". I was going to apologize for misquoting you but the truth is, it was such a dumb statement either way that it makes little difference. The right wing echo chamber is attacking Sotomayor because she's the nominee. It's comparable to what they did during the Democratic presidential primary elections. They slammed Hillary Clinton as a femi nazi and turned her into a negative caricature the entire time it seemed she had the nomination in the bag. And then when it became obvious that Obama would beat her, they portrayed Obama as extreme left wing and compared Clinton favorably to him. This is the same thing. If Obama retracted the Sotomayor nomination, they'd compare her favorably with whoever he chose next.

"It only made policy in that clarified how far these rights extend."

But nevertheless, that is making policy. It is what it is. It's stating the obvious. The legislative and executive branches make the law but when the law is unclear or when it might violate the constitution, the decision usually falls to the court of appeals and they decide. In that sense, they make policy. I don't find that particularly controversial. Sotomayor's answer seems to have been in response to a question about why legal defense funds look for ppl with court of appeals experiance. And as soon as she made that statement, she qualified it to show that she didn't mean what you seem to think she meant.

[URL="<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/OfC99LrrM2Q&color1=0xb1b1b1&color2=0xcfcfcf&hl=en&feature=player_embedded&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/OfC99LrrM2Q&color1=0xb1b1b1&color2=0xcfcfcf&hl=en&feature=player_embedded&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>"]<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/OfC99LrrM2Q&color1=0xb1b1b1&color2=0xcfcfcf&hl=en&feature=player_embedded&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/OfC99LrrM2Q&color1=0xb1b1b1&color2=0xcfcfcf&hl=en&feature=player_embedded&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>[/URL]

"If a white man said the opposite of what she said, he would be lambasted for life his legal career done and rightfully so."

I assume you're refering to her "wise latina" quote. I can see how this quote would be construed as racist. But i think it's clear when you read the speech that what she meant was that judges are all influenced by their experiances no matter how impartial they try to be, and that a female hispanic judge is more likely to make the right decision on some minority and gender issues. She didn't qualify the quote properly. But i'm willing to give her the benefit of the doubt because I disagree with the practice of trying to pigeonhole someone as racist due to one quote they make out of one very casual speech they've made in their lifetime.
0 Replies
 
NotHereForLong
 
  1  
Reply Wed 3 Jun, 2009 05:15 am
@Sabz5150,
YouTube - Judge Sonia Sotomayor: Court is Where Policy is Made
0 Replies
 
NotHereForLong
 
  1  
Reply Wed 3 Jun, 2009 05:22 am
@Sabz5150,
"See you're not providing any reason why she is good choice. all you're doing is trying to down play why she sucks."

She's more qualified than most of the judges on the Supreme Court were when they were nominated. She has a moderate record. She has experience in many different areas of the legal system. She was an overachieving, top level, ivy league grad. What more do you want?
Grouch
 
  1  
Reply Wed 3 Jun, 2009 06:40 am
@NotHereForLong,
NotHereForLong;65381 wrote:
"See you're not providing any reason why she is good choice. all you're doing is trying to down play why she sucks."

She's more qualified than most of the judges on the Supreme Court were when they were nominated. She has a moderate record. She has experience in many different areas of the legal system. She was an overachieving, top level, ivy league grad. What more do you want?



More qualified based on what grounds? Because she has been an insignificant judge longer? Her current appointment and most of her experience is actually very limited in scope to mostly business and corporate law, and she has poor reviews from her legal peers.
 

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