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The REAL McCain I, II, III, etc

 
 
92b16vx
 
Reply Sat 9 Feb, 2008 01:14 am
[SIZE="7"]The War Secrets Senator John McCain Hides

Former POW Fights Public Access to POW/MIA Files
[/SIZE]

By Sydney Schanberg

April 25, 2000



NEW YORK (APBnews.com) ? The voters who were drawn to John S. McCain in his run for the Republican presidential nomination this year often cited, as the core of his appeal, his openness and blunt candor and willingness to admit past lapses and release documents that other senators often hold back. These qualities also seemed to endear McCain to the campaign press corps, many of whom wrote about how refreshing it was to travel on the McCain campaign bus, ?The Straight Talk Express,? and observe a maverick speaking his mind rather than a traditional candidate given to obfuscation and spin.



But there was one subject that was off-limits, a subject the Arizona senator almost never brings up and has never been open about ? his long-time opposition to releasing documents and information about American prisoners of war in Vietnam and the missing in action who have still not been accounted for. Since McCain himself, a downed Navy pilot, was a prisoner in Hanoi for 5 1/2 years, his staunch resistance to laying open the POW/MIA records has baffled colleagues and others who have followed his career. Critics say his anti-disclosure campaign, in close cooperation with the Pentagon and the intelligence community, has been successful. Literally thousands of documents that would otherwise have been declassified long ago have been legislated into secrecy.



For example, all the Pentagon debriefings of the prisoners who returned from Vietnam are now classified and closed to the public under a statute enacted in the 1990s with McCain?s backing. He says this is to protect the privacy of former POWs and gives it as his reason for not making public his own debriefing.



But the law allows a returned prisoner to view his own file or to designate another person to view it. APBnews.com has repeatedly asked the senator for an interview for this article and for permission to view his debriefing documents. He has not responded. His office did recently send APBnews.com an e-mail, referring to a favorable article about the senator in the Jan. 1 issue of Newsweek. In the article, the reporter, Michael Isikoff, says that he was allowed to review McCain?s debriefing report and that it contained ?nothing incriminating? ? although in a phone interview Isikoff acknowledged that ?there were redactions? in the document. Isikoff declined to say who showed him the document, but APBnews.com has learned it was McCain.



Many Vietnam veterans and former POWs have fumed at McCain for keeping these and other wartime files sealed up. His explanation, offered freely in Senate hearings and floor speeches, is that no one has been proven still alive and that releasing the files would revive painful memories and cause needless emotional stress to former prisoners, their families and the families of MIAs still unaccounted for. But what if some of these returned prisoners, as has always been the case at the conclusion of wars, reveal information to their debriefing officers about other prisoners believed still held in captivity? What justification is there for filtering such information through the Pentagon rather than allowing access to source materials? For instance, debriefings from returning Korean war POWs, available in full to the American public, have provided both citizens and government investigators with important information about other Americans who went missing in that conflict.



Would not most families of missing men, no matter how emotionally drained, want to know? And would they not also want to know what the government was doing to rescue their husbands and sons? Hundreds of MIA families have for years been questioning if concern for their feelings is the real reason for the secrecy.



Prisoners left behind



A smaller number of former POWs, MIA families and veterans have suggested there is something especially damning about McCain that the senator wants to keep hidden. Without release of the files, such accusations must be viewed as unsubstantiated speculation. The main reason, however, for seeking these files is to find out if there is any information in the debriefings, or in other MIA documents that McCain and the Pentagon have kept sealed, about how many prisoners were held back by North Vietnam after the Paris peace treaty was signed in January 1973. The defense and intelligence establishment has long resisted the declassification of critical records on this subject. McCain has been the main congressional force behind this effort.



The prisoner return in 1973 saw 591 Americans repatriated by North Vietnam. The problem was that the U.S. intelligence list of men believed to be alive at that time in captivity ? in Vietnam, Laos and possibly across the border in southern China and in the Soviet Union ? was much larger.



Possibly hundreds of men larger. The State Department stated publicly in 1973 that intelligence data showed the prisoner list to be starkly incomplete. For example, only nine of the 591 returnees came out of Laos, though experts in U.S. military intelligence listed 311 men as missing in that Hanoi-run country alone, and their field reports indicated that many of those men were probably still alive. Hanoi said it was returning all the prisoners it had. President Nixon, on March 29, 1973, seconded that claim, telling the nation on television: ?All of our American POWs are on their way home.? This discrepancy has never been acknowledged or explained by official Washington. Over the years in Washington, McCain, at times almost single-handedly, has pushed through Pentagon-desired legislation to make it impossible or much harder for the public to acquire POW/MIA information and much easier for the defense bureaucracy to keep it hidden.



The Truth Bill



In 1989, 11 members of the House of Representatives introduced a measure they called ?The Truth Bill.? A brief and simple document, it said: ?[The] head of each department or agency which holds or receives any records and information, including live-sighting reports, which have been correlated or possibly correlated to United States personnel listed as prisoner of war or missing in action from World War II, the Korean conflict and the Vietnam conflict shall make available to the public all such records and information held or received by that department or agency. In addition, the Department of Defense shall make available to the public with its records and information a complete listing of United States personnel classified as prisoner of war, missing in action, or killed in action (body not returned) from World War II, the Korean conflict, and the Vietnam conflict.?



Opposed by Pentagon



Bitterly opposed by the Pentagon, ?The Truth Bill? got nowhere. It was reintroduced in the next Congress in 1991 ? and again disappeared. Then, suddenly, out of the Senate, birthed by the Arizona senator, a new piece of legislation emerged. It was called ?The McCain Bill.? This measure turned ?The Truth Bill ? on its head. It created a bureaucratic maze from which only a fraction of the available documents could emerge. And it became law. So restrictive were its provisions that one clause actually said the Pentagon didn?t even have to inform the public when it received intelligence that Americans were alive in captivity.



First, it decreed that only three categories of information could be released, i.e., ?information ? that may pertain to the location, treatment, or condition of? unaccounted-for personnel from the Vietnam War. (This was later amended in 1995 and 1996 to include the Cold War and the Korean conflict.) If information is received about anything other than ?location, treatment or condition,? under this statute, which was enacted in December 199l, it does not get disclosed.



Second, before such information can be released to the public, permission must be granted by the primary next of kin, or PNOK. In the case of Vietnam, letters were sent by the Department of Defense to the 2,266 PNOK. More than 600 declined consent (including 243 who failed to respond, considered under the law to be a ?no?).



Hurdles and limitations



Finally, in addition to these hurdles and limitations, the McCain act does not specifically order the declassification of the information. Further, it provides the Defense Department with other justifications for withholding documents. One such clause says that if the information ?may compromise the safety of any United States personnel ? who remain not accounted for but who may still be alive in captivity, then the Secretary [of Defense] may withhold that record or other information from the disclosure otherwise required by this section.?



Boiled down, the preceding paragraph means that the Defense Department is not obligated to tell the public about prisoners believed alive in captivity and what efforts are being made to rescue them. It only has to notify the White House and the intelligence committees in the Senate and House. The committees are forbidden under law from releasing such information.



At the same time, the McCain act is now being used to deny access to other sorts of records. For instance, part of a recent APBnews.com Freedom of Information Act request for the records of a mutiny on merchant marine vessel in the 1970s was rejected by a Defense Department official who cited the McCain act. Similarly, requests for information about Americans missing in the Korean War and declared dead for the last 45 years have been denied by officials who reference the McCain statute. (Read a denial letter.)



Another bill gutted in 1996



And then there is the Missing Service Personnel Act, which McCain succeeded in gutting in 1996. A year before, the act had been strengthened, with bipartisan support, to compel the Pentagon to deploy more resources with greater speed to locate and rescue missing men. The measure imposed strict reporting requirements.



McCain amended the heart out of the statute. For example, the 1995 version required a unit commander to report to his theater commander within two days that a person was missing and describe what rescue and recovery efforts were underway. The McCain amendments allowed 10 days to pass before a report had to be made.



In the 1995 act, the theater commander, after receiving the MIA report, would have 14 days to report to his Cabinet secretary in Washington. His report had to ? certify? that all necessary actions were being taken and all appropriate assets were being used ?to resolve the status of the missing person.? This section was stricken from the act, replaced with language that made the Cabinet secretary, not the theater commander, the recipient of the report from the field. All the certification requirements also were stricken. ?Turn commanders into clerks? ?This, ? said a McCain memo, ?transfers the bureaucracy involved out of the field to Washington.? He argued that the original legislation, if left intact, ?would accomplish nothing but create new jobs for lawyers and turn military commanders into clerks.?



In response, the backers of the original statute cited the Pentagon?s stained record on MIA?s and argued that military history had shown that speed of action is critical to the chances of recovering a missing man. Moving ?the bureaucracy? to Washington, they said, was merely a way to sweep the issue under a rug.



Chilling effect cited



One final evisceration in the law was McCain?s removal of all its enforcement teeth. The original act provided for criminal penalties for anyone, such as military bureaucrats in Washington, who destroy or cover up or withhold from families any information about a missing man. McCain erased this part of the law. He said the penalties would have a chilling effect on the Pentagon?s ability to recruit personnel for its POW/MIA office.



McCain does not deal lightly with those who disagree with him on any of these issues or who suggest that the evidence indeed shows that a significant number of prisoners were alive and cached away as future bargaining chips when he came home in the group of 591 released in 1973.



Over the years, he has regularly vilified any group or person who keeps trying to pry out more evidence about MIAs. He calls them ?hoaxers? and ?charlatans? and ?conspiracy theorists.? He decries the ?bizarre rantings of the MIA hobbyists? and describes them as ?individuals primarily who make their living off of keeping the issue alive.? Before he died last year of leukemia, retired Col. Ted Guy, a highly admired POW and one of the most dogged resisters in the camps, wrote an angry open letter to the senator in an MIA newsletter. In it, he said of McCain?s stream of insults: ?John, does this include Senator Bob Smith and other concerned elected officials? Does this include the families of the missing where there is overwhelming evidence that their loved ones were ?last known alive? ? Does this include some of your fellow POWs??



Sightings dismissed



McCain has said again and again that he has seen no ?credible? evidence that more than a tiny handful of men might have been alive in captivity after the official prison return in 1973. He dismisses all of the subsequent radio intercepts, live sightings, satellite photos, CIA reports, defector information, recovered enemy documents and reports of ransom demands ? thousands and thousands of pieces of information indicating live captives ? as meaningless. He has even described these intelligence reports as the rough equivalent of UFO and alien sightings.



In Congress, colleagues and staffers who have seen him erupt ? in the open and, more often, in closed meetings ? profess themselves confounded by his behavior. Insisting upon anonymity so as not to invite one of his verbal assaults, they say they have no easy way to explain why a former POW would work so hard and so persistently to keep POW/MIA information from coming out. Typical is the comment of one congressional veteran who has watched McCain over many years: ?This is a man not at peace with himself.? McCain?s sense of disgrace.



Some McCain watchers searching for answers point to his recently published best-selling autobiography, Faith of My Fathers, half of which is devoted to his years as a prisoner. In the book, he says he felt badly throughout his captivity because he knew he was being treated more leniently than his fellow POWs owing to his propaganda value as the son of Adm. John S. McCain II, who was then the CINCPAC ? commander in chief of all U.S. forces in the Pacific region, including Vietnam. (His captors considered him a prize catch and nicknamed him the ?Crown Prince.?)



Also in the book, the Arizona Senator repeatedly expresses guilt and disgrace at having broken under torture and given the North Vietnamese a taped confession, broadcast over the camp loudspeakers, saying he was a war criminal who had, among other acts, bombed a school. ?I felt faithless and couldn?t control my despair,? he writes. He writes, revealing that he made two half-hearted attempts at suicide. Most tellingly, he said he lived in ?dread? that his father would find out. ?I still wince,? he says, ?when I recall wondering if my father had heard of my disgrace.?



After McCain returned home, he says he told his father about the confession, but ?never discussed it at length.? The admiral, McCain says, didn?t indicate he had heard anything about it before.



McCain?s father died in 1981. McCain writes: ?I only recently learned that the tape ? had been broadcast outside the prison and had come to the attention of my father.?



McCain wasn?t alone ? it?s well-known that a sizeable percentage of prisoners of war will break down under torture. In fact, many of his supporters view McCain?s prison travails as evidence of his overall heroism. Fears unpublished details?



But how would McCain?s forced confession alone explain his endless campaign against releasing MIA/POW information?



Some veterans and other McCain watchers have speculated that McCain?s mortification, given his family?s proud military tradition (his grandfather was also an admiral), was so severe that it continues to haunt him and make him fear any opening up of information that could revive previously unpublished details of the era, including his own nagging history.



Another question that defies easy explanation is why there has never been any significant public outcry over the POWs who didn?t come home or about the machinations of public officials like McCain who carefully wove a blanket of secrecy around this issue. It can only be understood in the context of what the Vietnam War did to the American mind.



Forgetting the Vietnam War



It was the longest war in our history and the only one in which we accepted defeat and brought our troops home. It had roiled the country more than any conflict but the Civil War ? to the point where almost everyone, regardless of their politics, wanted to get away from anything that reminded them of this bloody failure. Only a small band of Americans, led by Vietnam veterans and MIA families, kept asking for more information about the missing men and demanding that the government keep its promise to do everything possible to bring them home. Everyone else seemed to be running away from all things Vietnam.



Knowledgeable observers note that it?s quite possible that Nixon, leading the country?s withdrawal, accepted the peace treaty of Jan. 27, 1973, while telling himself that somehow he would negotiate the release of the remaining POWs later. But when Congress refused to provide the $3 billion to $4 billion in proposed national development reparations that National Security Adviser Henry Kissinger had dangled as a carrot to Hanoi, the prospects for the abandoned men began to unravel.



Observers also point out that over the years that followed, Washington continued to reject paying what it branded as ransom money and so, across six presidencies, including the present one, the issue of POWs who may have been left behind remained unacknowledged by the White House and the Pentagon. Hanoi refused to correct the impression that all the prisoners had been returned, and Washington, for its part, refused to admit that it had known about abandoned POWs from the beginning.



Mainstream press indifferent



Of course, the government and many mainstream scholars reject this theory. And whether any such prisoners remain alive to this day is impossible for the outsider to know. Intelligence sources privately express the belief that most of the men had either died or been executed by the early 1990s. Presumably, these sources say, the POW?s lost their bargaining value to Hanoi as time passed and ransom dollars never materialized. Eventually Hanoi began seeking another path to the money ? the renewal of relations with Washington. Diplomatic ties were restored by President Clinton in 1994, and American economic investment quickly followed.



One factor in the nation?s indifference to the POWs was the stance of the national press. From the very start to the present, the mainstream media showed little interest. With just a smattering of exceptions, the journalistic community, like the rest of the country, ran away from the story. During the war, thousands of American journalists poured into Vietnam in shifts; now only a handful cover the country, most of them filing business stories about Nike and other conglomerates opening up factories to avail themselves of the cheap labor.



Even reporters who had covered the war came to view the MIA story, in the years afterward, as a concoction of the far right. Without doing much, if any, first-hand reporting, such as digging into the available documents in the National Archives, nearly all these journalists dismissed the MIA story as unfounded.



Generated a hero aura



In McCain?s recently suspended campaign for the presidency, it was almost as if, in the press?s eyes, he was to be treated differently and quite gingerly because of the hero aura generated by his POW experience. None of his political opponents ever dared criticize him for his legislative history on withholding POW information, and the press never brought itself to be direct enough to even question him on the issue.



It?s not that he didn?t give reporters plenty of openings to ask the right Vietnam questions. For one thing, he used his history as a Vietnam prisoner as a constant campaign theme in his speeches. Rarely did he appear without a larger-than- life photo backdrop showing him in battle gear as a Navy pilot before he was shot down over Hanoi in 1967.



Here is a passage typical of the soft, even erroneous reporting on McCain ? this from a March 4 story in The New York Times: ?His most striking achievement came when he joined with another Vietnam veteran, Senator John Kerry, Democrat of Massachusetts, to puncture the myth that Vietnam continued holding American prisoners. ? The piece went on to speak with admiration about ?his concern over the prisoners-of-war issue? ? but, tellingly, it offered no details.



Tepid veterans? vote



The press corps, covering the state-by-state primary vote, made an assumption, based apparently on sentiment, that McCain, as the war hero, would capture the significant veterans? vote by stunning margins. Actually, he didn?t capture it at all. He carried veterans only in the states that he won, like Michigan and New Hampshire, but was rejected by them in the larger number of states that he lost, like New York, Ohio and California. Added together, when the states were tallied up, the veterans? vote went to George W. Bush.



The Washington press corps had gone openly soft once before on the prisoner issue, again benefiting McCain. That was in 1991-93, during the proceedings of the Senate Select Committee on POW/MIA Affairs. McCain starred on that committee, working hand in hand with his new ally, Sen. John Kerry, the panel?s co-chairman, to play down voluminous evidence that sizeable numbers of men were still held alive after the prisoner return in 1973. One example: At the time of the committee?s hearings, the Pentagon had received more than 1,600 firsthand sightings of live American prisoners and nearly 14,000 secondhand reports. The intelligence officers who gathered these reports from refugees and other informants in the field described a large number of them as ?credible? and so marked the reports. Some of the informants had been given lie-detector tests and passed.



But the Pentagon?s Defense Intelligence Agency, after reviewing all the reports, concluded that they ?do not constitute evidence? that men were still alive at the time.



McCain and Kerry endorsed the Pentagon?s findings. They also treated both the Pentagon and the CIA more as the committee?s partners than as objects of its inquiry. As one committee staff investigator said, in a memo preserved from the period: ?Speaking for the other investigators, I can say we are sick and tired of this investigation being controlled by those we are supposedly investigating.?



McCain stood out because he always showed up for the committee hearings where witnesses were going to talk about specific pieces of evidence. He would belittle and berate these witnesses, questioning their patriotism and otherwise scoffing at their credibility. All of this is on record in the National Archives.



Confrontation with witness



One such witness was Dolores Apodaca Alfond, chairwoman of the National Alliance of Families, an all-volunteer MIA organization. Her pilot brother, Capt. Victor J. Apodaca, out of the Air Force Academy, was shot down over Dong Hoi, North Vietnam, in the early evening of June 8, 1967. At least one person in the two-man plane survived. Beeper signals from a pilot?s distress radio were picked up by overhead helicopters, but the cloud cover was too heavy to go in. Hanoi has recently turned over some bone fragments that are supposed to be Apodaca?s. The Pentagon first declared the fragments to be animal bones. But now it is telling the family ? verbally ? that they came from the pilot. But the Pentagon, for unexplained reasons, will not put this in writing, which means Apodaca is still unaccounted for. Also the Pentagon refuses to give Alfond a sample of the fragments so she can have testing done by an independent laboratory.



Alfond?s testimony, at a hearing of the POW/MIA committee Nov. 11, 1992, was revealing. She pleaded with the committee not to shut down in two months, as scheduled, because so much of its work was unfinished. Also, she was critical of the committee, and in particular Kerry and McCain, for having ?discredited the overhead satellite symbol pictures, arguing there is no way to be sure that the [distress] symbols were made by U.S. POWs.? She also criticized them for similarly discounting data from special sensors, shaped like a large spike with an electronic pod and an antenna, that were airdropped to stick in the ground along the Ho Chi Minh trail.



These devices served as motion detectors, picking up passing convoys and other military movements, but they also had rescue capabilities. Specifically, someone on the ground ? a downed airman or a prisoner on a labor detail ? could manually enter data into the sensor pods. Alfond said the data from the sensor spikes, which was regularly gathered by Air Force jets flying overhead, had showed that a person or persons on the ground had manually entered into the sensors ? as U.S. pilots had been trained to do ? ?no less than 20 authenticator numbers that corresponded exactly to the classified authenticator numbers of 20 U.S. POWs who were lost in Laos.?



Other than the panel?s second co-chairman, Sen. Bob Smith, R-N.H., not a single committee member attended this public hearing. But McCain, having been advised of Alfond?s testimony, suddenly rushed into the room to confront her. His face angry and his voice very loud, he accused her of making ?allegations ? that are patently and totally false and deceptive.? Making a fist, he shook his index finger at her and said she had insulted an emissary to Vietnam sent by President Bush. He said she had insulted other MIA families with her remarks. And then he said, through clenched teeth: ?And I am sick and tired of you insulting mine and other people?s [patriotism] who happen to have different views than yours.?



Brought to tears



By this time, tears were running down Alfond?s cheeks. She reached into her handbag for a handkerchief. She tried to speak: ?The family members have been waiting for years ? years! And now you?re shutting down.? He kept interrupting her. She tried to say, through tears, that she had issued no insults. He kept talking over her words. He said she was accusing him and others of ?some conspiracy without proof, and some cover-up.? She said she was merely seeking ?some answers. That is what I am asking.? He ripped into her for using the word ?fiasco.? She replied: ?The fiasco was the people that stepped out and said we have written the end, the final chapter to Vietnam.? ?No one said that,? he shouted. ?No one said what you are saying they said, Ms. Alfond.? And then, his face flaming pink, he stalked out of the room, to shouts of disfavor from members of the audience.



As with most of McCain?s remarks to Alfond, the facts in his closing blast at her were incorrect. Less than three weeks earlier, on Oct. 23, 1992, in a ceremony in the White House Rose Garden, President Bush ? with John McCain standing beside him ? said: ?Today, finally, I am convinced that we can begin writing the last chapter in the Vietnam War.?



The committee did indeed, as Alfond said they planned to do, shut down two months after the hearing.



Cannot discuss it



As for her description of the motion sensor evidence about prisoners in Laos, McCain?s response at the hearing was that this data was in a 1974 report that the committee had read but was still classified, so ?I cannot discuss it here. ? We hope to get it declassified.?



The question to the senator now is: What happened to that report and what happened to the pilots who belonged to those authenticator numbers? Intelligence sources in Washington say the report was never declassified. It became clear over the months of hearings and sparrings that the primary goal of the Kerry-McCain alliance was to clear the way for normalization of relations with Vietnam. They did it in two ways ? first, by regularly praising Hanoi for its ?cooperation? in the search for information about the unaccounted-for prisoners and then by minimizing and suppressing the volume of evidence to the contrary that had been unearthed by the committee?s staff investigators.



Recasting the issue



Kerry and McCain also tried, at every opportunity, to recast the issue as a debate about how many men could still be alive today, instead of the real issue at stake: How many men were alive in 1973 after the 591 were returned? Although much evidence was kept out of the committee?s final report in January 1993, enough of it, albeit watered down by the committee?s majority, was inserted by the determined staff to demonstrate conclusively that all the prisoners had not come home. Still, if the reader didn?t plow through the entire 1,223-page report but scanned just the brief conclusions in the 43-page executive summary at the beginning, he or she would have found only a weak and pallid statement saying that there was ?evidence ? that indicates the possibility of survival, at least for a small number? after the repatriation of 1973. On page 468 of the report, McCain provided his own personal statement, saying that ?we found no compelling evidence to prove that Americans are alive in captivity today. There is some evidence ? though no proof ? to suggest only the possibility that a few Americans may have been kept behind after the end of American?s military involvement in Vietnam.?



Two defense secretaries



And even these meager concessions were not voluntary. They had been forced by the sworn public testimony before the Senate committee of two former defense secretaries from the Nixon Administration, Melvin Laird and James Schlesinger. Both these men testified that they believed in 1973, from strong intelligence data, that a number of prisoners in Vietnam and Laos had not been returned. Their testimony has never been challenged. Schlesinger, before becoming defense secretary, had been the CIA director. During his committee appearance, Schlesinger was asked why Nixon would have accepted the prisoners being held back in 1973. He replied: ?One must assume that we had concluded that the bargaining position of the United States ? was quite weak. We were anxious to get our troops out and we were not going to roil the waters ?? Then he was asked ?a very simple question. In your view, did we leave men behind?? ?Some were left behind? ?I think that as of now,? replied the former Pentagon secretary, ?that I can come to no other conclusion [that] ? some were left behind.? The press went along once again with the debunkers. The Schlesinger-Laird testimony, which seemed a bombshell, became but a one-day story in the nation?s major media. The press never followed it up to explore its implications. On Jan. 26, 1994, when a resolution ardently backed by McCain and Kerry came up in the Senate calling for the lifting of the two-decade-old economic embargo against Vietnam, some members ? in an effort to stall the measure ? tried to present new evidence about men left behind. McCain rose to his feet and, offering no rebuttal evidence of his own, proceeded to chide ?the professional malcontents, conspiracy mongers, con artists and dime-store Rambos who attend this issue.? The resolution passed, 62-38. ?Isolated Personnel? These days, the Pentagon seems to be moving toward closing its POW/MIA books completely. In recent statements and reports, it has begun describing prisoners not as POWs but as IPs ? Isolated Personnel.



And in a 1999 booklet, the Pentagon said: ?By the end of the year 2004, we will have moved from the way the US government conducts the business of recovery and accounting [now] to an active program of loss prevention, immediate rescues, and rapid post-hostility accounting.? More important, there seems to be no allocation of funds in 2004 for the task force that now conducts POW/MIA investigations, searches for remains and does archival research. As for McCain, he continues to stonewall on his own POW records. Through numerous phone calls, faxes and letters to his office, APBnews.com has been trying since late January to interview the Senator and get his permission to view his POW debriefing. The response has been that the senator has been occupied by his campaign schedule.



Call for openness and disclosure



During the campaign, McCain, who is chairman of the Senate Commerce Committee, had to address a controversy over queries he had made to the Commerce Department on behalf of a major campaign contributor. To deal with the press interest, he announced he was releasing all of his correspondence with the Commerce Department, not just the letters involving the one case. In addition, to show his full commitment to openness and disclosure, he called on every other government agency to release his communications with them. On Jan. 9 on the CBS program Face the Nation, he announced: ?Today, we are asking the federal government to release all correspondence that I?ve had with every government agency.?



McCain?s staff has acknowledged that this request includes the Pentagon. But the Pentagon says it needs an official document from McCain designating a surrogate before it can show his debriefing report to anyone else. APBnews.com has repeatedly asked the senator for this waiver. He does not respond.



Sydney H. Schanberg is the editor of APBnews.com?s investigative unit. He was awarded a Pulitzer Prize for his 1975 coverage of political and social chaos in Cambodia. His news reports and a best-selling book about his experiences in Southeast Asia became the basis for the Academy Award-winning film The Killing Fields.
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92b16vx
 
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Reply Sat 9 Feb, 2008 01:17 am
@92b16vx,
Sen. McCain Wants To Be President
Check-out his unpresidential credentials

January-February 1997 Issue
By Ted Sampley
U.S. Veteran Dispatch


Citing his 5-1/2 years as a prisoner of war in North Vietnam, columnists and journalists freehandedly describe Republican Senator John McCain of Arizona as a war hero.

Washington Post columnist George Will wrote about McCain in 1988, "He was a prisoner for 5-1/2 years. Because he was properly obstinate, he was in solitary confinement most of that time . . . Every day for two years, one of his guards ordered him to bow, and then knocked him down."

Joseph Spear, an awestruck columnist who wanted presidential candidate Bob Dole to pick McCain for vice president wrote, "McCain is a war hero . . . He was tossed into the infamous 'Hanoi Hilton' prison camp, where he was hung by his fractured arms for hours at a time." Many have written columns suggesting that McCain is presidential material and advocate his running for the nation's highest office.

McCain obviously agrees.
Reuter's News Service reported in January that the 60 year old McCain says he wants to be President of the United States.

McCain also thinks President Clinton, who dodged the draft rather than serve in Vietnam, is the perfect presidential role model. He recently told the press that Clinton "is the best politician I have ever seen."

McCain, however, does not think so highly of the POW/MIA families and activists who openly challenge the U.S. government's POW/MIA policy, many of whom walked the halls of Congress during the Vietnam War years demanding America's prisoners of war, including POW McCain, not be forgotten.

McCain, as a member of the 1992 Senate Select Committee on POW/MIA Affairs, took the lead in demanding a U.S. Justice Department investigation of the POW/MIA activists and their organizations. He accused the activists of fraud because in some of their fund-raising literature the activists claimed the U.S. government knowingly left U.S. POWs behind after the Vietnam War and that some remain alive today.

McCain openly attacked the activists telling the press, "The people who have done these things are not zealots in a good cause. They are the most craven, most cynical and most despicable human beings to ever run a scam." The Justice Department did investigate the POW/MIA activists and their organizations and found no reason to charge any POW/MIA activist.

McCain's use of the words craven, despicable and scam are mighty powerful and poisonous words from a man who admittedly traded "military information" to his communist captors in exchange for better medical treatment--or who divorced the wife that stood by him while he was a POW, after she became crippled in an accident.

Those words are hypocritical from a man whose younger and richer wife (she's an heir to Hensley & Co., the second largest Anheuser-Busch beer distributor in the United States) got caught after stealing drugs for two years from a charitable organization of which she was president.

Editor's note: The U.S. military Code of Conduct is the definitive code specifying the responsibilities of American military personnel while in combat or captivity.

Article V of the Code is very specific in ordering U.S. military personnel to avoid answering questions to the utmost of their ability and to make no oral or written statements disloyal to the United States and its allies or harmful to their cause. Any willful violation of the Code is considered collaborating with the enemy.

U.S. Navy pilot John McCain was shot down on his 23rd mission over North Vietnam, October 26, 1967. He was released March 1973 after being held captive by the North Vietnamese for 5-1/2 years.

Within days of his release, McCain wrote the following account of his captivity, which was published in U.S. News and World Report - May 14, 1973:
"I think it was on the fourth day [after being shot down] that two guards came in, instead of one. One of them pulled back the blanket to show the other guard my injury. I looked at my knee. It was about the size of a football . . . when I saw it, I said to the guard, 'O.K., get the officer' . . . an officer came in after a few minutes. It was the man that we came to know very well as 'The Bug.' He was a psychotic torturer, one of the worst fiends that we had to deal with. I said, 'O.K., I'll give you military information if you will take me to the hospital.'"

McCain now says it was only a coincidence that at the same time he was offering "military information" in exchange for special medical treatment, his captors discovered that his father was Adm. John S. McCain Jr., commander of all U.S. forces in Europe and soon-to-be commander of all U.S. forces in the Pacific, including Vietnam.

Upon learning about McCain's father, the communists, in an unprecedented move, rushed McCain to one of their military hospitals where he received treatment not available for other U.S. prisoners of war.

Read following news excerpts that chronicle McCain and his associations:

"Nhan Dan today published answers to questions by one of its correspondents made by a U.S. air pirate detained in North Vietnam. "He is Lt. John Sidney McCain . . ." Hanoi VNA International Service in French - November 9, 1967

"To a question of the correspondent, McCain answered: 'My assignment to the Oriskany, I told myself, was due to serious losses in pilots which were sustained by this aircraft carrier due to its raids over North Vietnam territory and which necessitated replacements. From 10 to 12 pilots were transferred like me from the Forrestal to the Oriskany . . . upon arrival near the target, our formation, with six bombers, would mount the attack according to the following order: I would be number three, and the chief of the formation, number one. Each pilot would have to approach the target from a different direction, the choice of which would be left to him.'" A November 9, 1967 declassified Department of Defense document

"A meeting which will leave its mark on my life: My meeting with John Sidney McCain was certainly one of those meetings which will affect me most profoundly for the rest of my life. I had asked the North Vietnamese authorities to allow me to personally interrogate an American prisoner. They authorized me to do so. When night fell, they took me--without any precautions or mystery--to a hospital near the Gia Lam Airport reserved for the military. (Passage omitted) The officer who receives me begins: I ask you not to ask any questions of political nature. If this man replies in a way unfavorable to us, they will not hesitate to speak of "brainwashing" and conclude that we threatened him. (Passage omitted) "This John Sidney McCain is not an ordinary prisoner. His father is none other than Admiral Edmond John McCain, commander in chief of U.S. Naval forces in Europe." Written by "prominent" French television reporter Francois Chalais - January 1968

"Reds Say PW Songbird Is Pilot Son of Admiral
. . . Hanoi has aired a broadcast in which the pilot son of United States Commander in the Pacific, Adm. John McCain, purportedly admits to having bombed civilian targets in North Vietnam and praises medical treatment he has received since being taken prisoner." Saigon-UPI, June 4, 1969

"The English-Language broadcast beamed at South Vietnam was one of a series using American prisoners. It was in response to a plea by Defense Secretary Melvin S. Laird, May 19, that North Vietnam treat prisoners according to the humanitarian standards set forth by the Geneva Convention." The Washington Post - June 5, 1969

"Dr. Fernando Barral, a Spanish psychiatrist residing in Cuba, returned from the Democratic Republic of Vietnam . . . he brought back some journalistic news: an interview with a North American pilot captured in the DRV after bombing Hanoi on 26 October 1967. The meeting between him and the pilot took place in an office of the Committee for Foreign Cultural Relations in Hanoi. The pilot interviewed is Lt Cmdr John Sidney McCain, son and grandson of American Navy Admirals . . . "In the course of the interview, on various occasions he showed that knowledge of the language, saying some words, dates, and so forth in Spanish, or [using it] when he thought the interpreter was seeking the corresponding French word. "Naturally, from the beginning this established a more direct communication between us, and more than one question or my response was made directly in Spanish." Havana Granma - January 24, 1970

"Let me emphasize that there were many, many fine women who supported what they knew their husbands believed in. My wife, Carol, was one of those and I am proud of her." U.S. New and World Report - May 14, 1973

Editor's note: In 1980, McCain's personal life soured. He divorced Carol, who had been seriously injured and crippled in a motor vehicle accident, and married Cindy Hensley, whose father Jim is an Arizona "beer baron."

"Republican Sen. John McCain reported a net worth of at least $830,705 but possibly as much as $1.2 million or more, excluding personal residences . . . McCain listed his wife, Cindy, as the source of most of his assets. . . the bulk of McCain's assets consisted of stock in three Glendale firms - Hensley & Co., a beer distributorship headed by his father-in-law; Western Leasing Co., which leases trucks and equipment; and Eagle Enterprises, which invests in real estate and stock." The Phoenix Gazette - May 19, 1987

"So why has Sen. McCain, R-Ariz., gone to unprecedented lengths to block reform of the Senate campaign finance system? Why does he oppose letting this important matter even come to a vote? Perhaps it's because he is a prime beneficiary of the special interest funding of congressional elections. "McCain raised over $2.5 million for his 1986 election . . . more than $760,000 of his campaign funds came from political action committee (PACs) . . . especially disturbing are the contributions to McCain's campaign coffers from PACs outside of Arizona." The Phoenix Gazette - December 8, 1987

"While Sen. John McCain's wife and father-in-law were investing with Charles H. Keating, Jr. in a shopping center, McCain was helping Keating battle federal regulators who questioned his operation of Lincoln Savings and Loan . . . [photo caption] Documents show that Sen. John McCain's wife, Cindy, and father-in-law, James W. Hensley (second from right) are the largest investors in Fountain Square Shopping Center. Their partnership is managed by subsidiaries of American Continental Corp., run by Charles H. Keating, Jr. (right). But John McCain contends there was no conflict in his helping Keating battle federal regulators." The Arizona Republic - October 8, 1989

"Sen. John McCain had more than a constituent relationship with Charles H. Keating, Jr. prior to 1987 . . . the McCains - sometimes with their daughter and baby sitter - made at least nine trips at Keating's expense from August 1984 to August 1986 aboard either Keating's American Continental Corporation's jet or chartered planes and helicopters owned by Resorts International. Three of the trips were for vacations at Keating's luxurious retreat in the Bahamas." The Arizona Republic - October 8, 1989

"McCain, in a radio talk-show appearance last week condemned disclosures of his family's ties to Keating as "irresponsible journalism." The Arizona Republic - October 17, 1989

" . . . both in telephone conversations with reporters and on a live radio talk show, the Republican senator was far from calm. He was agitated. Angry. And the way he dealt with unpleasant questions was to bully the questioners . . . 'You're a liar,' McCain snapped Sept. 29 when an Arizona Republic reporter asked him about business ties between his wife, Cindy McCain, and Keating . . . 'That's the spouse's involvement, you idiot,' McCain sneered later in the same conversation. 'You do understand English, don't you?' ". . . Not content with just bullying reporters, McCain tried belittling them: 'It's up to you to find that out, kids.' . . . McCain wasn't talking to liars. He wasn't talking to juveniles. The senator was talking to two reporters." The Arizona Republic - October 17, 1989

"Employees at Hensley & Co., a $100 million Anheuser-Busch distribution firm, also say that during McCain's first campaign for Congress, some workers were pressured into going door-to-door in neighborhoods to hand out McCain election pamphlets . . . Hensley employees say they must take the checks to work, where they are collected by supervisors. I asked one person if employees were assured that all contributions were voluntary . . . 'no way,' I was told. 'And my (spouse) and I aren't even registered (to vote). That's what makes us so mad." The Arizona Republic - November 1, 1989

"As a 100 percent, service-connected, disabled ex-prisoner of war, I sought help from John McCain when he was a member of the U.S. House of Representatives and I needed help in regard to a claim for back service-connected disability compensation. I did so because I thought that as an ex-POW himself he could relate to my problem. When I could not reach him via letters to his office, I wrote to his home address. That was a very enlightening experience . . . my letter, addressed to the congressman, was opened by his wife, Cindy. She didn't like what she read, so she wrote me a nasty letter. Apparently John McCain isn't even capable of communicating on a one-to-one basis with someone who was a POW and returned from his experience in far worse physical condition than John McCain returned from his experience . . . M. "Shane" Schoenborn." The Phoenix Gazette - November 4, 1989

"Reporters also 'discovered' that the senator's wife and father-in-law invested $359,100.00 in one of Mr. Keating's projects in 1986 . . ." The Phoenix Gazette - November 13, 1989

"The liquor case is particularly intriguing as it resulted in criminal charges against Marley's subordinates, James and Eugene Hensley. If the last name sounds familiar, it's because James is papa to Cindy McCain, who is wife of Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., who is infamous lately as a member of the Keating Five . . . Marley also has been a shadow figure in the 1976 slaying of Republic reporter Don Bolles. Bolles wrote extensively about Marley's lucky past. And about how the Hensleys (Marley's managers) bought Ruidso Downs racing track in New Mexico. He wrote about Eugene Hensley spending five years in federal prison for a skimming scam. And about the Hensleys selling their track to a buyer linked with Emprise Corp. And about Marley's liquor ties with Emprise . . . one of Bolles' final dispatches appeared as Marley was about to become a member of the Arizona Racing Commission - the agency that regulates racetracks, including those run at the time by Emprise . . . the story dispatched Marley's appointment. Two months later, a car bomb killed Bolles." The Phoenix Gazette - January 4, 1990

"Bradley J. Funk, an antique dealer linked to the 13-year-old Don Bolles murder case through his family's former ownership of dog-racing tracks, has died of a heart attack, authorities said Jan. 2 . . . Bolles, 47, a former investigative reporter with the Arizona Republic, died June 13, 1976, about 11 days after a dynamite-based bomb blew up beneath his car . . . in his last statement before lapsing into unconsciousness, he mentioned the Mafia, John Adamson and Emprise Corp., a Buffalo, N.Y. company with a far-flung sports empire which once included ownership of the Boston Bruins hockey team and the former Cincinnati Royals basketball franchise . . . now known as Delaware North Cos., Emprise was convicted in 1972 of a federal charge of conspiring to hide Mafia interest in a Las Vegas, Nev., casino . . . Emprise and the Funk family were partners in six dog-racing tracks in the state and the Prescott Downs horse track, and Bolles had ripped their operations in print." Arizona Business Gazette - January 5, 1990

"McCain's involvement with Keating . . . when reporters called him with questions last year about previously unknown ties to Keating, an investment by wife Cindy McCain in a Keating shopping center and trips to Keating's Bahamas home, McCain went into a rage." The Arizona Republic - April 29, 1990

"Cars, homes and bank accounts of 18 people, including eight state legislators, were confiscated in a civil racketeering lawsuit that paints a portrait of lawmakers eager to sell their influence for as little as $660 and as much as $750,000 . . . Richard Scheffel, another lobbyist indicted but not targeted in the civil racketeering suit, is reputed to have been paid $20,000 to identify and approach lawmakers interested in trading votes for money . . . in a bid to establish his professional credentials with Stedino, Scheffel is reported to have boasted that '(U.S.) Sen. John McCain's father-in-law gives money to politicians through him' . . . Bauer, in his report, said Scheffel claimed that 'each January he receives $30,000 from the local Anheuser-Busch distributor, Jim Hensley,' adding that Hensley also supplied him with names of people to list as contributors." The Phoenix Gazette - February 6, 1991

". . . Bob Delgado, executive vice president for Hensley. He also pointed out that Scheffel was a lobbyist for Anheuser-Busch Inc. and not Hensley & Co . . . Hensley & Co. has a pattern, according to state campaign filings, of registering key executives as lobbyists." The Phoenix Gazette - February 9, 1991

"Hensley & Co., a Phoenix-based beer distributor, rewards its drivers and sales people with parties at Phoenix Greyhound Park . . . 'It's been an excellent motivator for us to use for incentive contests,' said Dave Daulton, assistant vice president at Hensley." The Arizona Republic - February 15, 1991

"Don't overlook that multifaceted beer distributor Jim Hensley, father-in-law to Republican Sen. John McCain of modest Keating fame. According to current AzScam records, Hensley is a financial godfather to hosts of lobbyists." The Phoenix Gazette - March 16, 1991

"McCain, meanwhile, reported assets of more than $5.4 million, much of it held jointly with his wife, Cindy. The couple reported holding at least $2 million in stock in Hensley & Co., a beer distributorship owned by Cindy McCain's father, Jim Hensley . . . John McCain, R-Ariz., also reported at least $500,000 in Anheuser-Busch debentures, with most of the rest of the assets primarily in land holdings that his wife has invested in with her family . . . last year, McCain's wealth was estimated by Roll Call at closer to $2.9 million." The Arizona Republic - May 16, 1991

"At the time, Devereux stumbled upon Bolles' notes concerning Charles C. Morgan, a Tucson escrow agent who took a bullet to the head in 1977 while wearing a bulletproof vest. According to Devereux, Morgan worked for organized crime figures . . . Devereux says, Danny Casolaro called 'out of the blue' to ask about laundering operations, a Tucson bank, the Bonanno family and Reagan administration officials . . . a few weeks after that conversation, Casolaro was found in a West Virginia motel room with his wrists slashed. The case, initially ruled a suicide . . . The Phoenix Gazette - March 28, 1992

"Miller blamed the car-bomb slaying on former greyhound owner John Harvey Adamson, who has confessed to murdering Bolles; Phoenix lawyer Neal Roberts; and the late Bradley Funk, whose family used to race greyhounds in Arizona . . . 'this is a case of two contracts, a contract to kill and a contract to cover up who ordered the killing,' he said . . . Granville contended that Dunlap plotted with Adamson to have Bolles killed in behalf of Kemper Marley Sr., a Phoenix land and liquor baron." The Arizona Republic - February 10, 1993

"An Oregon racing regulator who has been offered the top post in the Arizona Racing Department thwarted in 1990 a Portland newspaper's investigation of a possible link between an Oregon track and an alleged organized-crime figure . . . on Friday, Gov. Fife Symington offered Barham the position of director of the Arizona Racing Department. Barham also would become director of the State Gaming Agency, which regulates Indian gaming . . . the Oregonian was looking into a possible connection between Oregon Racing, Inc. and the Emprise Corp., which had been forced out of Oregon because of allegations involving organized crime . . . the Oregonian became curious about Oregon Racing after learning that one of its early investors shared an office in Kenner, La., with John G. Masoni, a longtime Emprise partner . . . the Oregonian said Florida officials consider Masoni an 'associate' of the Detroit Mafia . . . Emprise, now called Delaware North Cos., long has had an interest in Arizona racing. At one time, the company had a virtual monopoly on dog and horse racing in the state in partnership with the Funk family of Phoenix . . . in the mid- '70s, the state moved to break the monopoly in light of a 1972 felony conviction of the company. Emprise was convicted in U.S. District Court in California of conspiring with racketeers to hide an ownership interest in the Frontier Hotel and Casino in Las Vegas." The Arizona Republic - June 23, 1993

Photo caption: "Below, Charles Keating III and McCain, then a member of the U.S. House, celebrate their August birthdays at the Keating's beachside estate at Cat Cay in the Bahamas." The Phoenix Gazette - September 12, 1993

"Cindy McCain, the wife of U.S. Republican Sen. John McCain of Arizona, admitted in a series of media interviews Monday that she became addicted to the painkillers Percocet and Vicodin. She said that she used the drugs from 1989 to 1992 and acknowledged that she had stolen some pills from the American Voluntary Medical Team, a charitable organization of which she is president . . . at one point, McCain, 40, was ingesting 15 to 20 pills a day . . . the normal dosage for seriously ill patients is 6 to 10 a day for a short period." The Arizona Republic - August 24, 1994

"Cindy McCain, who admitted to drug addiction this week, faces more problems, this time involving the adoption of a Bangladeshi baby two years ago.
"Sources confirmed Wednesday that a former employee of McCain's volunteer medical team has accused her of demanding that he commit perjury in adoption proceedings for her daughter, Bridget." The Phoenix Gazette - August 25, 1994

"Her husband is Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz."
"Cindy McCain was investigated recently by the Drug Enforcement Administration for stealing and using Percocet and Vicodin, both narcotic painkillers from her aid organization . . . the county attorney's report provides a window to drug dealings within Cindy McCain's nonprofit corporation . . . Gosinski also alleged that Cindy McCain abused her husband's office and diplomatic privileges by transporting illegal substances overseas. He also claimed, according to her lawyers, that Cindy McCain tried to prevent him from providing accurate information to the DEA." The Phoenix Gazette - August 25, 1994

"About 300 guests turned out Saturday night to celebrate the 90th birthday of Joseph 'Joe Bananas' Bonanno, retired boss of New York's Bonanno crime family. He retired to Tucson in 1968 . . . John McCain, R-Ariz., and Gov. Fife Symington sent their regards by telegram." The Arizona Republic - January 17, 1995
0 Replies
 
92b16vx
 
  1  
Reply Sat 9 Feb, 2008 01:19 am
@92b16vx,
John McCain vs. the Right:
No easy peace; Update:McCain at CPAC
By Michelle Malkin
? January 30, 2008 12:30 AM Update 11:11pm Eastern.

The Club for Growth joins what McCain?s defenders derisively and speciously label the ?McCain Derangement Syndrome? crowd. Here?s the CFG?s statement tonight. You can dismiss it as ?hate? and accuse them of ?acting like a liberal,? or you can deal with the facts:

When Janet Hook asked John McCain in tonight?s CNN Republican debate ?What makes you more qualified than Mitt Romney, a successful CEO and businessman, to manage our economy?? Senator McCain offered a simple answer: ?Because I know how to lead.?

Well, John McCain is certainly right about one thing. He knows how to lead, but he is often leading in the wrong direction, and often found with his liberal Democratic friends at his side. The 2001 and 2003 tax cuts are a case in point. John McCain was certainly a leader on the tax cuts: He led by being 1 of 2 Republicans in 2001 and 1 of 3 Republicans in 2003 to oppose the most pro-growth legislation in a generation.

John McCain joined with his Democratic friends in leading the opposition against the tax cuts. Like Ted Kennedy?who said ?Now, they are proposing more of the same, more tax breaks benefiting only the wealthiest among us??John McCain stood on the Senate floor and declared: ?I cannot in good conscience support a tax cut in which so many of the benefits go to the most fortunate among us at the expense of middle-class Americans who need tax relief.? John McCain also proved his leadership skills by teaming up with Senator Tom Daschle in sponsoring an amendment designed to reduce the tax cuts and undermine their efficacy.

John McCain has also been a leader on several other key Democratic issues:

?He led by crusading, along with Democratic Senator Russ Feingold, against the First Amendment, pushing for legislation designed to wipe out free speech from the political realm

?He led by teaming up with Ted Kennedy and John Edwards in sponsoring the Patients? Bill of Rights, a bill that imposed onerous mandates on insurance coverage and encouraged an increase in the number of frivolous lawsuits filed against healthcare providers

?Having leadership is an important quality, but it is important to consider the political philosophy underlying John McCain?s leadership,? said Club for Growth President Pat Toomey. ?Hillary Clinton is also a leader, but Republicans don?t want Hillary Clinton to be their nominee. While John McCain has demonstrated his leadership skills, too often, on economic issues, he is leading the country in the wrong direction.?
92b16vx
 
  1  
Reply Sat 9 Feb, 2008 01:50 am
@92b16vx,
YouTube - John McCain is Dr. Strangelove

Hahaha straight talk, riiiiiight.
0 Replies
 
Silverchild79
 
  1  
Reply Sat 9 Feb, 2008 05:05 pm
@92b16vx,
blahblahblahblah

don't be biter like ur failing candidate

McCain doesn't hide behind his life story, it's a testament to him as a man

even Hillary has referred to McCain's past as "Legendary", Ron Paul doesn't get that kinda press from his own party

The only reason Ron Paul doesn't like anything but the Constitution is because he's from Texas ergo it goes over his head and he can't comprehend it
0 Replies
 
92b16vx
 
  1  
Reply Sat 9 Feb, 2008 05:43 pm
@92b16vx,
Don't be all butthurt because conservatives, republicans,and Americans in general have plenty of REAL reasons to hate McCain, and the other neocons while you have to resort to halftruths, and outright lies to get anywhere against Ron Paul. Your lies about Ron Paul have no backing at all, and you have been called out on it, and attempt to dance around it, it's really sad.

I have provided you with an almost infinite resource of reading material, not half assed copy pasted crap with no background to support it, on every subject you posted lies about, and I am guessing you are going to emulate your boy Julie and chuckle like a school girl and not investigate for yourself. Your loss, you have been owned.
0 Replies
 
Reagaknight
 
  1  
Reply Sat 9 Feb, 2008 08:38 pm
@92b16vx,
Is it really necessary to have 4 threads?
92b16vx
 
  1  
Reply Sat 9 Feb, 2008 09:38 pm
@Reagaknight,
Reagaknight;53116 wrote:
Is it really necessary to have 4 threads?


Each one represents a different aspect of why Jaun McCain is a not going to be president, that's a lot of ground, I don't want anyone to get lost.
0 Replies
 
Silverchild79
 
  1  
Reply Sat 9 Feb, 2008 11:25 pm
@92b16vx,
ur like the libertarian version of swordofgod...

nobodies cares man, get over yourself

no, paul's been owned by McCain
92b16vx
 
  1  
Reply Sun 10 Feb, 2008 12:26 am
@Silverchild79,
Silverchild79;53131 wrote:
ur like the libertarian version of swordofgod...

nobodies cares man, get over yourself

no, paul's been owned by McCain


And yet you continue to respond bringing nothing of any worth, and digging the hole even deeper. I don't even have to try, you make yourself look ridiculous, and the fact that you can't bring a single item to substantiate your lies makes it that much more funny.

I guess Swordofgod would post tons, and tons of proof, backing up his positions, and be responded to by gibberish.
0 Replies
 
rugonnacry
 
  1  
Reply Mon 11 Feb, 2008 09:27 am
@92b16vx,
I would rather get lost than reach your destination.
92b16vx
 
  1  
Reply Mon 11 Feb, 2008 12:21 pm
@rugonnacry,
rugonnacry;53197 wrote:
I would rather get lost than reach your destination.


Yes, being informed is such a ill state of being.
0 Replies
 
Silverchild79
 
  1  
Reply Mon 11 Feb, 2008 01:51 pm
@Reagaknight,
Reagaknight;53116 wrote:
Is it really necessary to have 4 threads?


good point

(threads mereged)
0 Replies
 
Silverchild79
 
  1  
Reply Mon 11 Feb, 2008 01:54 pm
@92b16vx,
they are mereged, anything further in the "Real McCain" series should go here
0 Replies
 
 

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