JESUS Was MUSLIM !

@SWORD of GOD,

SWORD of GOD;62981 wrote:

You seem to be good in posting jokes and insults but you got no capabilities for any serious logical debate or discussion. You always run away when you are faced with the scientific facts and evidences. It's not your first time and you didn't fail my expectation this time!

Have a nice day.

It's quite easy to point out the hilarity and ridiculousness of any fundamentalist position. As far as evidence goes, you've presented none that I haven't already refuted, over and over again all of your supposed 'evidence' is contrived or simply misinformed, the reason for this is simple you must find "facts" that support your worldview rather than creating a worldview based on the facts. because even if you were to follow where the evidence leads you'd never be able to come to terms with the implications, thus your zealous nature in defending archaic story tales written by primitive desert cattle-herders. It's what you were brought up so naturally you believe it, but if you were raised in viking society you can be sure you'd be worshiping Odin, or if you were raised in ancient Greek society you'd be worshiping Zeus. Each culture has their myths and legends and maybe it's time you let go of yours.

0 Replies

@SWORD of GOD,

SWORD of GOD;62977 wrote:

Everytime I ask you the simple question which any 10 years old child can answer directly, you start asking and asking naive questions just out of arrogancy thinking that will save you from giving the direct rational answer. Why do you feel scared from my primitive simple questions !!?

And by the way, I should have asked you this before we started any sensible dialogue: How old are you and may I know your education level, please?

Regarding myself: I am in my forties and I hold a Ph.D. degree in engineering.

It has nothing to do with arogance, you are not listening again. For the forth or fifth time now. The analogy you are using is very very poor and the logic behind it is very very flawed. Now in order for me to answer the questions I need to take into consideration all the factors involved, unfortunately, as I have demonstrated you keep adding things to your previous statements. If I were to do this would you not also have concerns?

It matters not how old i am nor my education level, for i am not a class snob. Be happy in the knowledge that I was born before 1990. I really don't care how old you are or your eduction level. If we were here debating Engineering then clearly I would be at a disadvantage, as we are not then we are on a level playing field.

But you seem very good at dishing out insults, is this how things are done where you come from? If you don't get what you want you start to smear the other persons character by trying to make out they are immature and poorly educated. Or is it just frustration on your behalf because so far because you have been unable to engage me?

Now are you going to answer my question?

Quote:

Originally stated by SWORD of GOD
"Not a single messenger did We (Allah) send before you (Muhammad) without this inspiration sent by Us to him - that there is no god but I, therefore worship and serve Me." [The Noble Quran 21:25]

Somewhat confused here. Is Allah a 'we' plural. I didn't realse there were more than one. I always thought yours was monotheistic faith. Or is that just a mispelling?

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@Numpty,

Oh, your not reading my posts again!!

Numpty;62976 wrote:

In the context of your question, you would be correct.

How can you possibly think I am poorly educated when you can't even read my posts when I answer your questions?

Please start reading the whole posts and not just the parts you want to.

2 Replies

@Numpty,

Numpty;62986 wrote:

Oh, your not reading my posts again!!

How can you possibly think I am poorly educated when you can't even read my posts when I answer your questions?

Please start reading the whole posts and not just the parts you want to.

Why don't you just give the direct answers in few words instead of writting long stories each time I asked you simple direct questions !!!

1 Reply

@SWORD of GOD,

Now for the record, let me repost my question and your answer here:

My question was:

Quote:

If a new object or a machine, which no one in the world has ever seen or heard of before, is shown to you and then a question is asked, " Who is the first person who will be able to provide details of the mechanism of this unknown object?

Quote:

Let's say a very advanced sophisticated flying saucer.

Quote:

Now, by common sense isn't the first person who will be able to provide details of the mechanism of this unknown object (flying saucer) should be the person who has made it or created it (if that person does exist and we can communicate with) !?

Am I right?

Your answer was:

Quote:

Originally stated by Numpty
In the context of your question, you would be correct.

0 Replies

@SWORD of GOD,

SWORD of GOD;62987 wrote:

Why don't you just give the direct answers in few words instead of writting long stories each time I asked you simple direct questions !!!

I just explained why, or did you not read the post again?

1 Reply

@Numpty,

Numpty;62989 wrote:

I just explained why, or did you not read the post again?

Finally, I got an explicit answer from you. That's enough for the introductory part.

Now, let me start the actual scientific approach to proving the existence of Allah (GOD). In doing that, there are several approaches and one of them is using the 'The Theory of Probability'. First, a simple demonstartion to explain this probability theory will be given here, then I will try to apply it to the Quran.

[SIZE="2"]'The Theory of Probability'[/SIZE]

2 Replies

@SWORD of GOD,

SWORD of GOD;62990 wrote:

Finally, I got an explicit answer from you. That's enough for the introductory part.

Now, let me start the actual scientific approach to proving the existence of Allah (GOD). In doing that, there are several approaches and one of them is using the 'The Theory of Probability'. First, a simple demonstartion to explain this probability theory will be given here, then I will try to apply it to the Quran.

[SIZE="2"]'The Theory of Probability'[/SIZE]

YouTube - Skewed views of science

and....

YouTube - Flawed thinking by numbers

2 Replies

@Fatal Freedoms,

Quote:

'The Theory of Probability'

Let us apply this theory of probability to the Quran, and assume that a person has guessed all the information that is mentioned in the Quran which was unknown at that time (more than 1400 years ago). Let us discuss the probability of all the guesses being simultaneously correct.

[SIZE="3"]# 1: [/SIZE]

This is what modern science has to say on the topic of zoology, in particular bees. Today science tells us that the male bee has only one purpose, and that is to reproduce with the female - there's really no other purpose for a male bee. Now here's the important point - however, the worker bee or the soldier bee is a female bee. She is the one that builds the nest, leaves her home, and goes out in search of food. This what modern science tells us - that we have discovered only recently. Now it takes a specialist in the field to detect the sex of the bee - you cannot look at it from the naked eye - it is impossible, there is no way you can look at it that way. Now let us see what the Quran says about bees. Now, keep one thing in mind here. In the Arabic language, animals are either male or female. Like in English we have the word cow - "the cow in the pasture" - that does not tell us if the cow is male or female. But in Arabic animals are either male or female. There is no gender neutral term for animals. Let's look inside chapter sixteen verse sixty-eight. It says over there:

"and thy Lord taught the bee" (here it is specified a female bee) "to build its cells in hills, on trees, and in men's habitations, then to eat of all the produce and find with skill the spacious paths of its Lord." [The Noble Quran 16:68]

This is exactly what modern science today tell us - that the bee that goes out and builds the nest, that goes out looking for food, as what the Quran has mentioned, is indeed the female bee.

Now, how did the author of the Quran know this scientific statement, that the bee that leaves the nest in search of food is the female bee?

Perhaps the author of the Quran was a genius or a scientist. Well, I don't think that could be a possibility, becuase no matter how smart you are, you'll never be able to detect the sex of a bee, unless you had these modern scientific methods/capabilities which did not exist 1400 years ago, so those could not be a possibility. Perhaps the scientific fact is observable. Well, this is not true either, because you cannot look at the bees and tell which one is a male or female. Moreover, this information about the bees never pre-existed in history.

Finally, perhaps it was a very good guess. Well, it is a possibility. If it was a good guess then we'll say it was a fifty-fifty chance, one half chance if that was the case - or coincidence, we can look at it that way. [SIZE="3"]Therefore, the chances that this guess will be correct is 50% (1 out of 2) i.e. 1/2.[/SIZE]

3 Replies

@SWORD of GOD,

[SIZE="3"]#2: The Quran on the Origin of the Universe: 1

http://www.islam-guide.com/ch1-1-c-img1.jpg

[/CENTER]
Figure 1:

http://www.islam-guide.com/ch1-1-c-img2.jpg

[/CENTER]
Figure 2: The Lagoon nebula is a cloud of gas and dust, about 60 light years in diameter. It is excited by the ultraviolet radiation of the hot stars that have recently formed within its bulk. (Horizons, Exploring the Universe, Seeds, plate 9, from Association of Universities for Research in Astronomy, Inc.)Then He turned to the heaven when it was smoke... (Quran, 41:11) Have not those who disbelieved known that the heavens and the earth were one connected entity, then We separated them?... (Quran, 21:30)

[SIZE="2"]Dr. Alfred Kroner[/SIZE] Thinking where Muhammad came from . . . I think it is almost impossible that he could have known about things like the common origin of the universe, because scientists have only found out within the last few years, with very complicated and advanced technological methods, that this is the caseTo view the RealPlayer video of this comment click here View the RealPlayer video of this comment ).

Again, how did the author of the Quran know this scientific statement, about the origin of the uinverse?

Perhaps the author of the Quran was a genius or a scientist. Well, I don't think that could be a possibility, becuase no matter how smart you are, you'll never be able to discover the origin of the uinverse, unless you had these advanced modern scientific methods/capabilities which did not exist 1400 years ago, so those could not be a possibility. Perhaps the scientific fact is observable. Well, this is not true either. Moreover, this information about the uinverse never pre-existed in history.

Finally, perhaps it was a very good guess. Well, it is a possibility. The possibility for this guess to be correct can be much less than 1:1000. If it was a good guess then we'll say it was a 1/1000 chance if that was the case - or coincidence, we can look at it that way. [SIZE="3"]Therefore, the chances that this guess will be correct is 1/1000.[/SIZE]

Footnotes:

(1) The First Three Minutes, a Modern View of the Origin of the Universe, Weinberg, pp. 94-105.

1 Reply

@SWORD of GOD,

[SIZE="3"]# 3: Quran on The Lowest Area on Earth[/SIZE]

Allah, the Almighty, says in the Noble Quran:
"Alif*Lam*Mim. The Romans have been defeated in the lowest land, and they, after their defeat, will be victorious within three to nine years. The decision of the matter, before and after (these events) is only with Allah,(before the defeat of the Romans by the Persians, and after, i.e. the defeat of the Persians by the Romans). And on that Day, the believers (i.e. Muslims) will rejoice (at the victory given by Allah to the Romans against the Persians). With the help of Allah, He helps whom He wills, and He is the Almighty, the Most Merciful.(It is) a Promise of Allah (i.e. Allah will give victory to the Romans against the Persians), and Allah fails not in His Promise, but most of men know not." [The Noble Quran; Ar-Rum: 1-6]

The Scientific Fact:Facets of Scientific Inimitability:

There are two miracles in these verses;
1) the Ever-Glorious Quran gave glad tidings of victory to the Romans in a course of three to nine years. After seven years, the prophecy of the Ever-Glorious Qur'an came true. This Roman victory coincided with the victory of the Muslims in the Battle of Badr. To the Arab disbelievers, the victory of the Romans seemed impossible and they started mocking the Muslims and ridiculing them about these Quranic words. When the prophecy came true, they were disappointed and humbled.

2) They told us about a geographical fact that was not known to anyone at that time. The verses said that the Romans would lose the battle in the lowest area of land which means that it is the nearest place to the Arabian Peninsula and is the lowest spot on earth; it is 1,312 feet (around 400 meters) below sea level. According to the Encyclopedia Britannica, satellites have recorded that it is indeed the lowest spot on earth. Historical facts testify that the battle took place at the lowest spot on earth; near to the Dead Sea. At that time, it was impossible for anyone to know this was the lowest area on earth.

Once again, how did the author of the Quran know this scientific statement, about the lowest spot on earth?

Perhaps the author of the Quran was a genius or a scientist. Well, I don't think that could be a possibility, becuase no matter how smart you are, you'll never be able to discover the the lowest spot on earth, unless you had these advanced modern scientific methods/capabilities with planes and satellites which did not exist 1400 years ago, so those could not be a possibility. Perhaps the scientific fact is observable. Well, this is not true either. Moreover, this information about the uinverse never pre-existed in history.

Finally, perhaps it was a very good guess. Well, it is a possibility. Due the vast earth surface area, the possibility for this guess to be correct can be less than 1:10,000. However, If it was a good guess then we'll say it was just a 1/1000 chance if that was the case - or coincidence, we can look at it that way. [SIZE="3"]Therefore, the chances that this guess will be correct is 1/1000.[/SIZE]

Also, the possibility for the prophecy of the author of the Quran regarding the Roman victory in a course of three to nine years to come true can be said to be 50%, i.e. 1/2. [SIZE="3"]Therefore, the chances that this guess also will be correct is 1/2.[/SIZE]

[SIZE="3"]The probability of all the two guesses i.e. the lowest spot on earth and the prophecy regarding the Roman victory being correct is 1/1000 x 1/2 = 1/2000 which is equal to about 0.00005 (or 0.05%)[/SIZE]

1 Reply

@SWORD of GOD,

[SIZE="3"]# 4: Quran States The Sun & The Moon Run on a Fixed Course (Orbits)[/SIZE]

Allah (God) stated in the Noble Quran more than 1400 years ago this new discovered scientific fact about the fixed course of the Sun:

"And the sun runs on its fixed course for a term (appointed). That is the Decree of the All-Mighty, the All-Knowing." [Quran 36:38]

This fact has only been discovered recently and here is a NASA link emphasizing this scientific fact which has been told by Allah (God) in the Noble Quran more than 1400 years ago:

NASA Link Does the Sun move around the Milky Way??

The following is quoted from that NASA website:

Quote:

"Yes, the Sun - in fact, our whole solar system - orbits around the center of the Milky Way Galaxy. We are moving at an average velocity of 828,000 km/hr. But even at that high rate, it still takes us about 230 million years to make one complete orbit around the Milky Way!

The Milky Way is a spiral galaxy. We believe that it consists of a central bulge, 4 major arms, and several shorter arm segments. The Sun (and, of course, the rest of our solar system) is located near the Orion arm, between two major arms (Perseus and Sagittarius). The diameter of the Milky Way is about 100,000 light-years and the Sun is located about 28,000 light-years from the Galactic Center. You can see a drawing of the Milky Way below which shows what our Galaxy would look like "face-on" and the direction in which it would spin as viewed from that vantage point. Also shown, is the location of the Sun in the big picture view of our Galaxy."

Today, we all know, and this is not a surprise for anyone, that the moon actually moves in an orbit - a circular path, we all know that. But the scientists also tell us today that the sun also has an orbit, which many people do not know. Yes, all the planets are revolving around the sun, but the sun has an orbit in which is revolves around the center of the Milky Way galaxy. So both the sun and the moon have an orbit. This is what scientists have only recently discovered.

Let me now point you to chapter twenty-one, verse thirty-three of the Quran. It says over there:

"and He it is Who has created the night and the day, the sun and the moon, each in an orbit floating." [The Noble Quran 21:33]

The Quran clearly states that the sun and the moon have an orbit, and that word, falak (appears in the verse), if you look in the Hans-Wehr dictionary, that word refers to a woman's chest, a round woman's chest. So it talks about that the sun and moon have a circular orbit. So this is a statement which clearly agrees with modern science.

Perhaps it was a very good guess by the author of the Quran. Well, it is a possibility. There are several options for the motion of the sun. It could be stationary, it could be moving in a random path (not fixed course), or it could be moving in a fixed course (orbit). So, there are 3 different options for the motion of the sun. [SIZE="3"]The Quran rightly says the sun is moving in a fixed course (orbit), if it was a guess the chances of the guess being correct is 1/3.[/SIZE]

Similarly for the moon. There are several options for the motion of the sun. It could be stationary, it could be moving in a random path (not orbit), or it could be moving in an orbit. So, there are 3 different options for the motion of the moon. [SIZE="3"]The Quran rightly says the moon is moving in an orbit, if it was a guess the chances of the guess being correct is 1/3.[/SIZE]

[SIZE="3"]The probability of all the two guesses i.e. the sun moving in an orbit and the moon also moving in an orbit being correct is 1/3 x 1/3 = 1/9 which is equal to about 0.1111 (or 11.11%)[/SIZE]

0 Replies

@SWORD of GOD,

SWORD of GOD;63015 wrote:

Now, how did the author of the Quran know this scientific statement, that the bee that leaves the nest in search of food is the female bee?

Perhaps the author of the Quran was a genius or a scientist. Well, I don't think that could be a possibility, becuase no matter how smart you are, you'll never be able to detect the sex of a bee, unless you had these modern scientific methods/capabilities which did not exist 1400 years ago, so those could not be a possibility. Perhaps the scientific fact is observable. Well, this is not true either, because you cannot look at the bees and tell which one is a male or female. Moreover, this information about the bees never pre-existed in history.

Finally, perhaps it was a very good guess. Well, it is a possibility. If it was a good guess then we'll say it was a fifty-fifty chance, one half chance if that was the case - or coincidence, we can look at it that way. [SIZE="3"]Therefore, the chances that this guess will be correct is 50% (1 out of 2) i.e. 1/2.[/SIZE]

Um, first of all the chance of a male bee and a female bee is NOT 50-50, male bees are significantly more common there is only about 1 female bee in any given hive (the queen) and no the queen bee doesn't leave the hive in search of food the worker bees, all male, do this.

2 Replies

@Fatal Freedoms,

Sword,

you have a gross misunderstanding of how probability applies in the physical world. Simply because there are two options doesn't mean you have a 50-50 chance. For example

http://www.usablemarkets.com/images/pie_pacman_chart.png

There is only two options here but if you spun this chart like a wheel the chance of landing on either section is NOT 50% because the sections are not equal. Likewise, in the real world the chance of something happening and not happening, is NOT 50%, or the chance of something being true or not being true is NOT 50%, the reason for this is because in the real world there are innumerable factors that cannot be accurately quantified. This is the reason any statistics that predict real-world things happening are balderdash.

You may have even heard the phrase "That's like getting struck by lightning _____ times!", but this phrase is entirely relative because you cannot accurately predict the chance of getting struck by lightning, because you'd have to take other things into consideration like:

* How electrically charged is the atmosphere?
* Are you on a hill, if so how high of a hill?
*Are you wet, if so how wet?
* Do you have any metal on you?
*Are you carrying anything in your hands?
*Are you holding a lightning rod?
* How many trees are around you?
* How tall are you?
* Are you standing or sitting down?
* How big is the lightning bolt?
* How many "branches" does the bolt have?
* Is it windy, if so how windy?

Hopefully you now have a better understanding of probability.:thumbup:

1 Reply

@Fatal Freedoms,

Fatal_Freedoms;63021 wrote:

Um, first of all the chance of a male bee and a female bee is NOT 50-50, male bees are significantly more common there is only about 1 female bee in any given hive (the queen) and no the queen bee doesn't leave the hive in search of food the worker bees, all male, do this.

It seems you don't bother to read correctly what's written.

First: 50/50 is the chance of the guess to be correct (Not the percentage of males and females as you falsely wrote it!).

Second: I never wrote that the Queen bee leaves the colony in search of food. Again this only what you falsely wrote!

Third: The worker bees are Only the females. Male bees live only to mate with the queen. Educate yourself instead of making fun of yourself talking about something you don't even bother to read about. Here is something for you to gain some knowledge:

Honey Bees - Roles Within the Honey Bee Colony
Honey Bees - Roles Within the Honey Bee Colony

Quote:

Honey bees enlist a caste system to accomplish the tasks that ensure survival of the colony. Each member of the community fulfills a need that serves the group. Tens of thousands of worker bees, all females, assume responsibility for feeding, cleaning, nursing, and defending the group. Male drones live only to mate with the queen, who is the only fertile female in the colony. The queen need not lift a wing, as workers tend to her every need.

It seems a waste of time to make any intellectual decent dialogue with you anymore. Gain knowledge before you try to speak.

1 Reply

@SWORD of GOD,

:rollinglaugh::rollinglaugh::rollinglaugh:

First you state that you must either be a scientist or posses divine knowledge to determine the sex of a bee and then you state the chance is 50-50 of guessing correctly. Do you not realize you contradict yourself, why must you be a scientist to guess correctly if the odds are truly 50-50?

0 Replies

@Fatal Freedoms,

Fatal_Freedoms;63022 wrote:

Sword,

you have a gross misunderstanding of how probability applies in the physical world. Simply because there are two options doesn't mean you have a 50-50 chance. For example

There is only two options here but if you spun this chart like a wheel the chance of landing on either section is NOT 50% because the sections are not equal. Likewise, in the real world the chance of something happening and not happening, is NOT 50%, or the chance of something being true or not being true is NOT 50%, the reason for this is because in the real world there are innumerable factors that cannot be accurately quantified. This is the reason any statistics that predict real-world things happening are balderdash.

You may have even heard the phrase "That's like getting struck by lightning _____ times!", but this phrase is entirely relative because you cannot accurately predict the chance of getting struck by lightning, because you'd have to take other things into consideration like:

* How electrically charged is the atmosphere?
* Are you on a hill, if so how high of a hill?
*Are you wet, if so how wet?
* Do you have any metal on you?
*Are you carrying anything in your hands?
*Are you holding a lightning rod?
* How many trees are around you?
* How tall are you?
* Are you standing or sitting down?
* How big is the lightning bolt?
* How many "branches" does the bolt have?
* Is it windy, if so how windy?

Hopefully you now have a better understanding of probability.:thumbup:

Each time you write a response you make fun of yourself. Why you do that!?

Here is a simple introduction to Introduction to Probability and Statistics (click here >>) Introduction to Probability and Statistics

Read and get knowledge instead of wasting your time trying to prove how ignorant you are! I really feel sorry for you. I used to think that you got better to offer but I discovered that you got nothing.

1 Reply

@SWORD of GOD,

SWORD of GOD;63028 wrote:

Each time you write a response you make fun of yourself. Why you do that!?

Here is a simple introduction to Introduction to Probability and Statistics (click here >>) Introduction to Probability and Statistics

Read and get knowledge instead of wasting your time trying to prove how ignorant you are! I really feel sorry for you. I used to think that you got better to offer but I discovered that you got nothing.

I grow weary of your quibbling and incessant insults. If you cannot speak in a respectful tone then you should not speak. I am not here for your insolence. It is said that insults are the best friend of one with no argument to present. If you have no objection to my previous post, then you should remain silent or agree but if indeed you do have an objection then you should point it out instead of giving a reference to correct a non-specified mistake that I am supposed to assume you found.

0 Replies

@SWORD of GOD,

SWORD of GOD;62990 wrote:

Finally, I got an explicit answer from you. That's enough for the introductory part.

Now, let me start the actual scientific approach to proving the existence of Allah (GOD). In doing that, there are several approaches and one of them is using the 'The Theory of Probability'. First, a simple demonstartion to explain this probability theory will be given here, then I will try to apply it to the Quran.

[SIZE="2"]'The Theory of Probability'[/SIZE]

JESUS Was MUSLIM !

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