Major Question

What did I mean? You already have the quote right there, would you like me to dissect it for you? I said that the desire is both natural and not immoral. Isn't that clear? Nowhere did I state that what is natural is necessarily moral or vice versa, though you may have incorrectly inferred it. Can we move on now boss? Or should we continue to delve into the non-substantive here... :sarcastic:

As you like. But the natural interpretation of what you wrote would be, "Sexual desire is natural, and so, not immoral". Otherwise, why say them together? And, to be frank, I think that is what you meant, but you are just backpedaling. Anyway, for the record, what is natural need not be moral.

Hey William- It's one thing to play devil's advocate, but its another thing to hijack threads by nitpicking each individual post that someone makes...

William;158198 wrote:

. I think most with the exception of a very few that thrive on stirring sh*t up, are catching on.

Indeed, a glance at my Rep Power is enough to show that right away.
Thanked 1,164 Times in 977 Posts
Rep Power: 23

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So glad you have decided you are going to continue to learn as much as you are capable of learning. Wise move. You never know how much you can understand until you try. But try harder, promise me.

Nah, tried that once, it didn't take. One day you will understand that too. It's a waste of energy so I think I will conserve mine now. So until we meet again to engage in your innocuous chatter, bye for now.

William

William;158198 wrote:

. I think most with the exception of a very few that thrive on stirring sh*t up, are catching on.

Indeed, a glance at my Rep Power is enough to show that right away.
Thanked 1,164 Times in 977 Posts
Rep Power: 23

So I have an internal battle going on, and there really shouldnt be one. Seeing as how i havent started my study of philosophy yet, i was hoping that i could get some feed back on this issue of mine from a philosophic view point on what to do about it because i have no idea what do do.

I am married, I love my wife every much. I would go to the end of the world for her. And yet, I find myself fantasizing about her sister...a lot. This only started a couple months ago, but it is worrisome to me.

Help. Give me opinions.

Occasionally I found and still find an under-aged girl attractive. (High-school not grade-school mind you.) When I was younger I admit I indulged in the fantasy once or twice (some variation of the schoolgirl teacher story for example) but I don't really indulge in that fantasy anymore. The change happened when it occurred to me one day to think of her as my little sister or even my daughter i.e. someone I cared for an wanted to grow up strong, happy and undamaged. And though it is true that she isn't actually my daughter or my little sister I feel I still have that sort of responsibility towards a young girl.

Nowadays when I see an attractive high-school girl in the bloom of her youth I can still appreciate the beauty and attractiveness but that other idea kicks in - the idea of her being a younger sister or a daughter and my responsibility towards her as a member of society, and this keeps that recognition of beauty from becoming depraved and dipping into something more lustful. It's part of growing up I guess.

I think some variation of this might work for you too. Your sister-in-law is a beautiful woman but don't you want her to be strong, happy and undamaged? There is such a thing as a higher desire trumping a lower desire. Our society is perhaps too permissive when it comes to fantasy because I think that many fantasies do at least some damage to the one who is fantasizing even if this is nothing more than alienating the fantasizer from a more authentic reality. You will feel much stronger, happier and undamaged if you listen to your higher desires instead of yielding to the lower ones. Humans are animals, and as such we have instincts, but we are also conscious and aware of ourselves and our thoughts. And perhaps even the higher desires are a form of instinct. So the question is which instinct, which desire, higher or lower will you yield to?

I understand what you are saying, but what I do not understand is why you want to teach yourself not to find young girls sexually attractive. They are sexually attractive. Do you fear that unless you think differently you will not be able to control your sexual urges? I very much doubt that is true.

Occasionally I found and still find an under-aged girl attractive. (High-school not grade-school mind you.) When I was younger I admit I indulged in the fantasy once or twice (some variation of the schoolgirl teacher story for example) but I don't really indulge in that fantasy anymore. The change happened when it occurred to me one day to think of her as my little sister or even my daughter i.e. someone I cared for an wanted to grow up strong, happy and undamaged. And though it is true that she isn't actually my daughter or my little sister I feel I still have that sort of responsibility towards a young girl.

Humans are animals, and as such we have instincts, but we are also conscious and aware of ourselves and our thoughts. And perhaps even the higher desires are a form of instinct. So the question is which instinct, which desire, higher or lower will you yield to?

Deckard, I'd be more worried about you if you didn't occasionally find high-school aged girls attractive...



What makes one type of desire "higher" and another type "lower"? Hopefully your meaning has to do with something other than physical location on the human anatomy...

The "lower" functions, while perhaps crude in a sense, and shared in common with all animals, unlike our ability to reason, are still just as important. The desire to reproduce is more vital to mankind's survival than logic or anything else.

Occasionally I found and still find an under-aged girl attractive. (High-school not grade-school mind you.) When I was younger I admit I indulged in the fantasy once or twice (some variation of the schoolgirl teacher story for example) but I don't really indulge in that fantasy anymore. The change happened when it occurred to me one day to think of her as my little sister or even my daughter i.e. someone I cared for an wanted to grow up strong, happy and undamaged. And though it is true that she isn't actually my daughter or my little sister I feel I still have that sort of responsibility towards a young girl.

Nowadays when I see an attractive high-school girl in the bloom of her youth I can still appreciate the beauty and attractiveness but that other idea kicks in - the idea of her being a younger sister or a daughter and my responsibility towards her as a member of society, and this keeps that recognition of beauty from becoming depraved and dipping into something more lustful. It's part of growing up I guess.

I think some variation of this might work for you too. Your sister-in-law is a beautiful woman but don't you want her to be strong, happy and undamaged? There is such a thing as a higher desire trumping a lower desire. Our society is perhaps too permissive when it comes to fantasy because I think that many fantasies do at least some damage to the one who is fantasizing even if this is nothing more than alienating the fantasizer from a more authentic reality. You will feel much stronger, happier and undamaged if you listen to your higher desires instead of yielding to the lower ones. Humans are animals, and as such we have instincts, but we are also conscious and aware of ourselves and our thoughts. And perhaps even the higher desires are a form of instinct. So the question is which instinct, which desire, higher or lower will you yield to?

Well yes, it is often the case that young women under the age of 18 are sexually attractive. There is a difference between recognizing the fact and indulging in fantasy.

Are you familar with Marcuse's concept of repressive desublimation?

What does the sister-in-law think ? What have you to offer these woman ?
What do you think about polygamie ?