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Artificial brain 'ten years away'

 
 
xris
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Jul, 2009 10:45 am
@odenskrigare,
Look up what defines life and we aint done it yet bros.
I never said we could prove or not prove the existance of the soul,did i?
I admire scientists and their advances,but i dont worship them nor do exagerate their abilities.
Yes it is good trick but we are humans capable of seing illusions but i can also work out it is a trick.Just like the pilot does not think his gone blind when he looks at a spray painted windscreen.
Caroline
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Jul, 2009 10:54 am
@odenskrigare,
Hang on a minute noone is tossing aside 1000's of years worth of work, for a start dismissing todays scientist is not dismissing yesterdays scientist, I dont think that historically scientists were all geared towards replicating humans, understanding the brain yes but not all were heading toward the frankienstien project, i say frankenstein because that is what it looks like to us lesser mortals and im sorry im with xris i do not believe you understand enough or can even begin to replicate emotions let alone the soul, whether it's existence can be proved or not is besides the point but i dont believe that you fully understand or can completely replicate a human being because you for one have dismissed the existence of the soul purely because it cant be proved, that doesn't mean it doesn't exist, that in itself is close minded because what if it did exist they where would you be but you wont even contemplate it. The human being cannot be entirely explained by science because it is not entirely scientific, we have feelings, emotions, independent thought and a soul, (unexpalined as it may be), and yiu cant replicate them so far all they've managed to do is to replicate a chromosome, I cant see that we're very close to replicating the human condition only the human body which is good for advancing medical science and there it ends or your heading into dangerous waters.
0 Replies
 
odenskrigare
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Jul, 2009 10:54 am
@xris,
xris;79326 wrote:
Look up what defines life and we aint done it yet bros.


M. genitalium is living, so u got some splainin to do

xris;79326 wrote:
Yes it is good trick but we are humans capable of seing illusions but i can also work out it is a trick.Just like the pilot does not think his gone blind when he looks at a spray painted windscreen.


Here are other instances of illusion you may not be so aware of:

Fallacies

You used a few of them in this thread in fact.
0 Replies
 
Caroline
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Jul, 2009 10:57 am
@odenskrigare,
It's just a trick, it doesnt prove anything and will you please stop using links to insult other members it's really really irritating.

---------- Post added 07-24-2009 at 11:57 AM ----------

Where do you find them.
odenskrigare
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Jul, 2009 11:05 am
@Caroline,
Caroline;79327 wrote:
Hang on a minute noone is tossing aside 1000's of years worth of work, for a start dismissing todays scientist is not dismissing yesterdays scientist, I dont think that historically scientists were all geared towards replicating humans, understanding the brain yes but not all were heading toward the frankienstien project, i say frankenstein because that is what it looks like to us lesser mortals and im sorry im with xris i do not believe you understand enough or can even begin to replicate emotions let alone the soul, whether it's existence can be proved or not is besides the point but i dont believe that you fully understand or can completely replicate a human being because you for one have dismissed the existence of the soul purely because it cant be proved, that doesn't mean it doesn't exist


Doesn't mean it does either

But I find the idea of a "soul" to be very inconsistent with what we know now

Caroline;79329 wrote:
that in itself is close minded because what if it did exist they where would you be but you wont even contemplate it.


No, when someone gives me an operational definition of a soul and a means to test for its existence, I'll believe in it

I'm not saying souls don't exist, I just don't see why I should believe in them

Caroline;79329 wrote:
The human being cannot be entirely explained by science because it is not entirely scientific, we have feelings, emotions, independent thought and a soul, (unexpalined as it may be), and yiu cant replicate them so far all they've managed to do is to replicate a chromosome, I cant see that we're very close to replicating the human condition only the human body which is good for advancing medical science and there it ends or your heading into dangerous waters.


Ah ... but ... that's not relevant

Fallacy: Appeal to Consequences of a Belief

Caroline;79329 wrote:
It's just a trick, it doesnt prove anything


It shows that the mind tricks itself

Caroline;79329 wrote:
and will you please stop using links to insult other members it's really really irritating.


When they stop using logical fallacies so openly, I will stop linking them to descriptions of logical fallacies.

Caroline;79329 wrote:
Where do you find them.


Find what
xris
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Jul, 2009 11:14 am
@odenskrigare,
Living systems - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia i think this accepted definition of life is not the same as yours.It needs to sustain itself through its own ability and needs to recreate itself.Life has not been recreated by any stretch of the imagination.
Your attention to silly tricks of the mind is to prove what exactly?
How many times do you need to be told the acceptance of the possibility of a soul is not up for scientific debate,it goes beyond those narrow confines.
0 Replies
 
Caroline
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Jul, 2009 11:15 am
@odenskrigare,
How do you find your links to insult people with. Like you did just there with me, like im going to bother to click on it, why cant you just say why you dont agree instead of expecting the other member to do it for you even look up your insults, jees.
And ofcourse it's relevant, it may not be relevant to what you want or belief but i dont think people would want scientists claiming they can replicate a human actually doing it and then failing with horrible results so it is relevant so there!

---------- Post added 07-24-2009 at 12:17 PM ----------

Oh and thanks for the insult friend!

---------- Post added 07-24-2009 at 12:20 PM ----------

Just because the trick shows the mind tricks itself it doesnt blow the possibilty of the existence of the soul out of the water, i mean you could use that against any argument.:perplexed:
odenskrigare
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Jul, 2009 11:26 am
@Caroline,
xris;79335 wrote:
Living systems - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia i think this accepted definition of life is not the same as yours.It needs to sustain itself through its own ability and needs to recreate itself.Life has not been recreated by any stretch of the imagination.


M. genitalium can't sustain and reproduce itself?

That is news to me.

xris;79335 wrote:
How many times do you need to be told the acceptance of the possibility of a soul is not up for scientific debate,it goes beyond those narrow confines.


I never said the idea of a soul is scientific, indeed it isn't, so I have no reason to believe in it for the time being.

Caroline;79336 wrote:
How do you find your links to insult people with. Like you did just there with me, like im going to bother to click on it, why cant you just say why you dont agree instead of expecting the other member to do it for you even look up your insults, jees.


It's more economical to respond with a link because I don't want to explain every logical fallacy I come across "manually"

I'll give you the short version though, and say that the consequences of a belief have nothing to do with the truth or falsehood of the assertion believed.

e.g., whether projects like Blue Brain create Frankenstein or Skynet has nothing to do with whether they're conscious agents
xris
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Jul, 2009 11:37 am
@odenskrigare,
odenskrigare;79340 wrote:
M. genitalium can't sustain and reproduce itself?

That is news to me.



I never said the idea of a soul is scientific, indeed it isn't, so I have no reason to believe in it for the time being.



It's more economical to respond with a link because I don't want to explain every logical fallacy I come across "manually"

I'll give you the short version though, and say that the consequences of a belief have nothing to do with the truth or falsehood of the assertion believed.

e.g., whether projects like Blue Brain create Frankenstein or Skynet has nothing to do with whether they're conscious agents
When i first read your posts you impressed me but you dont anymore..Your reference and link to life being recreated is for the umpteenth time not as you would like it to be.They have created a new species, not life as we know it JIM.NO ONE HAS RECREATED LIFE...do you understand this?
odenskrigare
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Jul, 2009 11:41 am
@xris,
xris;79342 wrote:
When i first read your posts you impressed me but you dont anymore..Your reference and link to life being recreated is for the umpteenth time not as you would like it to be.They have created a new species, not life as we know it JIM.NO ONE HAS RECREATED LIFE...do you understand this?


No, and my obstinacy probably has something to do with the fact that I've actually studied biology
Caroline
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Jul, 2009 11:44 am
@odenskrigare,
Ok tell me why they couldn't have produced HIV? Because they cant create life.
0 Replies
 
odenskrigare
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Jul, 2009 11:49 am
@odenskrigare,
Viri such as HIV aren't living things to begin with

Regardless, that's irrelevant to the question of whether the researchers who synthesized the single-celled organism in question effectively created life: they did
0 Replies
 
Caroline
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Jul, 2009 11:52 am
@odenskrigare,
I agree in that they've synthesized the single-cell organism and progression is good. But what I dont agree with is scientists going ahead with experiments that they do not know enough of such as implanting an artificial brain in a human, if they do then I would accept it was right.

---------- Post added 07-24-2009 at 12:53 PM ----------

And what is a virus if it is not living, (excuse my ignorance).
odenskrigare
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Jul, 2009 11:58 am
@Caroline,
Caroline;79348 wrote:
I agree in that they've synthesized the single-cell organism and progression is good. But what I dont agree with is scientists going ahead with experiments that they do not know enough of such as implanting an artificial brain in a human, if they do then I would accept it was right.


Hold the boat, no one is putting artificial brains into people, although various neural implants are now under testing

Caroline;79348 wrote:
And what is a virus if it is not living, (excuse my ignorance).


It's a thing in some nether region between living and non-living, because it needs to hijack a cell's machinery in order to propagate itself.

Well opinions differ on this one

Regardless, viri have been synthesized before
0 Replies
 
xris
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Jul, 2009 12:02 pm
@odenskrigare,
odenskrigare;79344 wrote:
No, and my obstinacy probably has something to do with the fact that I've actually studied biology
Then you know you are telling porkies and you know they have not reproduced life...
odenskrigare
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Jul, 2009 12:07 pm
@xris,
xris;79353 wrote:
Then you know you are telling porkies and you know they have not reproduced life...


Except that M. genitalium is a form of life

Even if it hadn't been replicated in the lab by now, there would still be no reason to assume it could not be done in the future

But that's not terribly relevant

(Because it already has been done)

And what the hell are "porkies"
Caroline
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Jul, 2009 12:12 pm
@odenskrigare,
Porky pies-lies me cockney sparrah
Yes but that's what they'll eventually want to do right, brain implants? Interesting, neural implants eh? Its ok I'll find my own link, (sorry). Smile
0 Replies
 
odenskrigare
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Jul, 2009 12:14 pm
@odenskrigare,
Yes these are being tested quite successfully in a variety of animals

Including us
0 Replies
 
xris
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Jul, 2009 12:30 pm
@odenskrigare,
odenskrigare;79354 wrote:
Except that M. genitalium is a form of life

Even if it hadn't been replicated in the lab by now, there would still be no reason to assume it could not be done in the future

But that's not terribly relevant

(Because it already has been done)

And what the hell are "porkies"
Your irish rose will never stop growing if you dont stop telling these porkies.If they had created life it would be scientific headline news and you know it my little tinker.Read your link its not new life and whats this... it could be?is that half an admission of your guilt?
odenskrigare
 
  1  
Reply Fri 24 Jul, 2009 12:43 pm
@xris,
xris;79360 wrote:
Your irish rose will never stop growing if you dont stop telling these porkies.If they had created life it would be scientific headline news


What should be headline material is crowded out for celebrity blather and whatnot, be serious

xris;79360 wrote:
Read your link its not new life and whats this... it could be?is that half an admission of your guilt?


OH MAN I'VE BEEN CALLED OUT I'M SWEATING BULLETS

Actually no

But I think synthesizing an entire genome from scratch and putting it in a cell could be considered creation of life

Whatever criteria you have for creating life will almost inevitably be met in the future, so I guess now's a good time to criticize idly before you have to start backpedaling

(Anyway this is really off-topic now)
 

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