Atom Smasher - Death of Us All

@TickTockMan,

TickTockMan;99341 wrote:

but in general, I'm interested to see what their findings might reveal about our universe, and any possible discoveries that could lead to the development of new technologies, some of which I understand might be in the field of quantum computing.

The science fiction fan in me was always fascinated by the idea of multiple dimensions posited by string theory, and I understand that the LHC may provide information relative to that particular branch of study as well.

The ATLAS experiment is designed to test, amongst other things, the idea of higher dimensions. We wait and see.

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@Victor Eremita,

I don't know if this has been stated or not (I read page 1 but didn't read through every other post), but the particle collider won't cause the end of the world, the universe, create a black hole, or do anything else besides help scientists understand some questions that have been previously elusive.

The collider operates by, in general terms, having particles smash into each other at extremely high speeds.

Now, consider the fact particles constantly collide into each other throughout the universe, throughout our galaxy, our solar system, and even against, for example, the surface of the Moon, at speeds far greater than the collider can possibly achieve.

I hope the logic is understood.

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@Baltar,

But their searching for a theoretical particle(or lack there of)and if found,there is no blueprint or guideline to carry out any further experiments.Im not saying the world will end,or suggesting a black hole(whatever that is)all im saying is we might screw the preferable pooch if science is wrong and(take your pick)religion is right.It's a legitimate argument.

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@manfred,

manfred;99426 wrote:

But their searching for a theoretical particle(or lack there of)and if found,there is no blueprint or guideline to carry out any further experiments.Im not saying the world will end,or suggesting a black hole(whatever that is)all im saying is we might screw the preferable pooch if science is wrong and(take your pick)religion is right.It's a legitimate argument.

Can't think of any religion that mentions a Higgs boson particle. Most Stone Age/Bronze Age religions today, like Islam and Christianity have scriptures which teach that the earth is the center of the universe.

Skepticism over the Hadron collider, as I said before, rests upon the nature of the experiment itself: colliding subatomic particles into each other. However, as I mentioned, this happens on a constant basis in our solar system at speeds far greater than we can hope to achieve. Add the probability of the collider achieving what the universe doesn't every second of every day all throughout our corner of reality, and you have yourself an incredible waste of money.

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@Victor Eremita,

I think behind every high interest scientific experiment lies some tension or apprehension to what results will happen. My example, the mach tests to break the sound barrier, which many people worried would create a shockwave that would destroy either a large area or the entire planet. There is a shockwave as the sound barrier is broken but it is not as big as it was anticipated.

People seem to love these dooms day stories and of course the media cant resist increasing everyone's anxiety either. Just look at all the 2012 stuff on the net. For me it is simply going to be another usual day and the day after. Nothing different than the y2k bug hype.

People love and hate technology. They fear advancements but cant resist their use after they arrive. If you ever listened to the pre-cell phone invention talk about how harmful it would be to your health or environment, no one would use their cell phone. But now most people cant be farther than 10 feet from their cell without freaking out.

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@Victor Eremita,

manfred wrote:

But their searching for a theoretical particle(or lack there of)and if found,there is no blueprint or guideline to carry out any further experiments.Im not saying the world will end,or suggesting a black hole(whatever that is)all im saying is we might screw the preferable pooch if science is wrong and(take your pick)religion is right.It's a legitimate argument.

What legitimate argument? What would science be wrong about, and what would religion be right about? Which religion posits that the Higgs boson particle doesn't exist?

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@Baltar,

The god particle,kind of has a religious undertone,wouldn't you agree?
Have you ever seen subatomic particles collide into each other,or felt the effect of this occurrence?I know it happens because the scientist tell me this happens....you know what,this isn't going anywhere,i dont know enough about science to contribute to this thread.Sorry for the intrusion.

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@manfred,

Actually the fact that the Higgs boson has been called 'the God particle' is interesting in its own right. My understanding of the reason for that is because it is the one remaining component in the 'particle zoo' which makes sense of the whole menagerie. Although someone with a lot more knowledge than I might correct me.

I still reckon they will never find it, but that might just be my prejudices talking.

1 Reply

@jeeprs,

jeeprs;99451 wrote:

Actually the fact that the Higgs boson has been called 'the God particle' is interesting in its own right. My understanding of the reason for that is because it is the one remaining component in the 'particle zoo' which makes sense of the whole menagerie. Although someone with a lot more knowledge than I might correct me.

I still reckon they will never find it, but that might just be my prejudices talking.

The reason we are looking is because the math points to it's existence. This is the way to discover if the math is correct.

I laugh every time someone mentions the hb being the god particle. They get all excited as if it gives some credit to the concept but as far as I am concerned it's just a play on words.

I find it more fascinating that people still hold so strongly to this superstition we call religion.

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@Krumple,

Recently, NY Times ran a piece on the LHC and some "proposals" for why the machine has been breaking down and all the "bad luck" encompassing it.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/13/science/space/13lhc.html?_r=1&ref=space

Needless to say, I laughed till I cried... I cant believe some physicists are actually taking this idea seriously.

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@Victor Eremita,

There are no atoms. Atom means 'indivisible'. No indivisible particle has been found. So - what is everything made of? What is real? Aren't we back at square one? And isn't that why this has been called 'God Particle'?

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@Victor Eremita,

I think it is absurd that people expect a piece of machinery to never have any problems. It is so big and has so many parts there is bound to have the weekest part fail since there is absolutely no QA testing prior to installation. I watched a show all about it. They won't know what parts will fail until they are installed and the system is ran. But people seem to forget just how large it is and how the whole thing works. The only other way I can explain my point is to say. Go built a thousand cars and have none of them have any problems what-so-ever. Simply does not happen.

1 Reply

@Krumple,

Krumple;99469 wrote:

The reason we are looking is because the math points to it's existence. This is the way to discover if the math is correct.

I laugh every time someone mentions the hb being the god particle. They get all excited as if it gives some credit to the concept but as far as I am concerned it's just a play on words.

I find it more fascinating that people still hold so strongly to this superstition we call religion.

Religion has nothing to do with common sense,and your right,it is a play on word...A very prominent word even in your community.Show me the equation that proves it's existance.I forgot how to spell rhetorical,you mind giving me a hand?Now if you will excuse me,my mommy is calling me for dinner...umm,smell them gravitons.

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@Victor Eremita,

yes but that is not the point I was interested in. Of course it is an amazing machine - actually the biggest most expensive machine ever made is it not? What interests me is the ontological question of what is the basis of reality, if it is not a particle?

Is there such a thing as a 'fundamental particle', and, if there is not, then what is fundamental? (Of course the boffins at Cern have got it all over me, I have a BA in arts subjects.)

I know I am massively oversimplifying in saying that but it is stilll and interesting question. (Incidentally, 'God Particle' was introduced in a book about philosophical cosmology, I believe).

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@Krumple,

Krumple;99502 wrote:

It is so big and has so many parts there is bound to have the weekest part fail since there is absolutely no QA testing prior to installation. I watched a show all about it. They won't know what parts will fail until they are installed and the system is ran.

The performance of the entire machine can not be tested prior to completion, if it could one complete machine would be built already. The components would have been QA'd prior release for sale, qualified prior to descision to purchase and again at point of use.

What show did you watch?

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@Victor Eremita,

Atom smasher sabotaged by bird

Baguette Crumb Halts Large Hadron Collider

1 Reply

@jeeprs,

jeeprs;102498 wrote:

Atom smasher sabotaged by bird

Baguette Crumb Halts Large Hadron Collider

While we are waiting for Murphy's law to run its course

Falling Sand Game - hosted by Chirag Mehta @ chir.ag

or perhaps

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@Victor Eremita,

man makes me wish I had never given up dope (or wonder whether I actually did...)

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@Victor Eremita,

In the past these experiments have suggest that there are 37 fields that make up the universe. I think they have misinterpreted what their eyes see. In string theory it is thought that tiny vibrating strings of energy are about the size of a tree if the atom where around the size of the solar system. As we have learnt energy increases the closer to the center of the atom/proton/neutron. I had a thought inspired by a dream that suggested that they was only one force and that what we see as various forces are correlations of the tiniest of frequencies. Magnetism having a high rate of correlation while gravity a possibly low correlation. I have email cern with these ideas together with what i think could happen. They have not written back, however i found a term they have coined admitting that something unexpected might happen. This term was called exotic phenomena. If enough people speak and write directly to them (cern) they might back down, because i see no useful purpose for this experiment. Insulting these people will not work, one must learn the aspects of the science to see if there is anything this machine can do to feed the billion or so people on this planet that regularly go hungry.
:shocked::brickwall: :surrender:

1 Reply

@Matthew phil,

Matthew;111457 wrote:

In the past these experiments have suggest that there are 37 fields that make up the universe. I think they have misinterpreted what their eyes see. In string theory it is thought that tiny vibrating strings of energy are about the size of a tree if the atom where around the size of the solar system. As we have learnt energy increases the closer to the center of the atom/proton/neutron. I had a thought inspired by a dream that suggested that they was only one force and that what we see as various forces are correlations of the tiniest of frequencies. Magnetism having a high rate of correlation while gravity a possibly low correlation. I have email cern with these ideas together with what i think could happen. They have not written back, however i found a term they have coined admitting that something unexpected might happen. This term was called exotic phenomena. If enough people speak and write directly to them (cern) they might back down, because i see no useful purpose for this experiment. Insulting these people will not work, one must learn the aspects of the science to see if there is anything this machine can do to feed the billion or so people on this planet that regularly go hungry.

Uhhh..... So you read some pop physics books(by Brian Greene or Kaku or Penrose any number of others), know nothing about physics besides what you read in said books (though I'm sure you think that knowledge ammounts to something more than an enjoyable, but rough, approximation to what physicists actually consider and do) and had a dream and decided to harass the people at CERN because you think they should be making a magic food machine? :brickwall::brickwall::brickwall: Right back atcha.

1 Reply

Atom Smasher - Death of Us All

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