Bad celebrities

@philosopherqueen,

Because as humans, we'd rather see someone walk into a wall than watch someone walk around one safely.

Have you ever driven by a car accident without stopping or slowing to see if you could see a dead body?
Probably not.

Human nature is a disgusting thing sometimes.
Plus, watching Britney shave her head was funny.

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@philosopherqueen,

Yeah, I agree with Ari. Television and media focus more on the negative stuff because people like it. Misery loves company type of thing. It's really too bad that so many people get so wrapped up in the garbage and problems of others.

On the other hand, you take some of the famous celebrities and place yourself in their shoes... My self, I couldn't stand people following me around with cameras all of the time. It would not only get annoying but I'd imagine it pushes some over the edge. It's probably not the bad celebrities as much as it is the people following them around trying to get a snapshot of their every move so they can turn in something juicy.

People idolize other people. The weak look up to those with money and status quo like it's something special. We're too wrapped up in possessions. Money is the dominating God. It's really a pity.

1 Reply

@Justin,

Aristoddler and Justin already said it; because everyone likes to see it. That's why you've got so many disgusting shows on TV that get high ratings.

Anyhow calling Madonna a good rolemodel is a bit of a paradox, she might be less provocative then Paris, Britney and Lindsay, but still ain't a saint either.

People like Natalie Portman, Scarlet Johanson don't ever make the news with flashing their privates and anything. Natalie Portman even has an university degree. I'd rather call them role models.

1 Reply

@Vasska,

God I hate Paris Hilton...

Well, it's not really the person Paris Hilton I hate (and not the hotel either), it's the hype around her, how young women look up to her etc. that I hate... Why would anybody want to be like her? She's not smart (I'm way to nice), she's not pretty (I don't think she is atleast, I mean, she's not ugly but she sure isn't beutifull), she hasn't done anything with her life apart from beeing in two porn movies, made a fool of herself and happend to be born rich...

We all love to see people screw up don't we? I love AFV because I get a chance to see people hurt themselves Wink

It's just our nature, we love to see other people fail, screw up and get hurt but hate to do it ourselves..

1 Reply

@Wizzy,

Now, now Wizzy!... be nice!

In case you weren't aware, Paris Hilton's career is officially the 8th wonder of the world. Smile

Before we slam that gavel, it's really difficult to understand why people do what they do and why they are like they are. I mean, she could simply be a product of her surroundings. It's difficult to understand without empathy. Paris, raised in a different family under different circumstances would be very much different.

On thing though, Paris is in a unique position to influence a lot of people. Hopefully she grows up someday to realize something very positive out of her life and use it to influence others in a very positive way. She's not a bad person, she's just lost like many of the rest of the world... difference is, she has the media following her around with cameras every time she does anything.

We've all done things we weren't necessarily proud of. It may not have been publicized like that of Paris Hilton however, everyone has done things that weren't necessarily kosher. No sense throwing stones whilst living in glass houses. When we judge someone else, we are really only judging ourselves.

1 Reply

@Justin,

I'd like to see what some celebrities would have to say about this topic.
Ones like Calista Flockhart, Uma Thurman, Steve Martin, Robin Williams and Goldie Hawn who are all reported to be members of Mensa and have exceptionally high IQs...I'd like to hear what they have to say about celebrity madness and its' attractiveness to the nation.

Something I've always wanted to know...are there any Hollywood stars that hail from Holland?

1 Reply

@Aristoddler,

Aristoddler wrote:

I'd like to see what some celebrities would have to say about this topic.
Ones like Calista Flockhart, Uma Thurman, Steve Martin, Robin Williams and Goldie Hawn who are all reported to be members of Mensa and have exceptionally high IQs...I'd like to hear what they have to say about celebrity madness and its' attractiveness to the nation.

Something I've always wanted to know...are there any Hollywood stars that hail from Holland?

Famke Janssen (Actress; X-Men Nip/Tuck)
Paul Verhoeven (Director; RoboCop, Basic Instinct)

Can't think of any others at the moment, but there were a few others.

1 Reply

@Vasska,

Yes back in the day Madonna wasn't the greatest role model but at this point in her life she has become a better role model.

Reese Witherspoon is one of my favorite role models for the fact that she has always talked against the dumb blonde persona (jessica simpson). Yeah she was in legally blonde, but it was the fact that she showed that a "dumb blonde" could be a lawyer and bust that stereotype. I remember what she once said (may not be quoted to a tee),"Women in the past have tried so hard to get the right to vote, have equal opportunity, and to have the male population respect us as equals. Why should some women who think it is cool to act stupid, screw all that up for the women who really care about it."

Now, she was never in the lime light until her divorce to Ryan Phillipe.

That really upsets me.

1 Reply

@philosopherqueen,

philosopherqueen wrote:

Yes back in the day Madonna wasn't the greatest role model but at this point in her life she has become a better role model.

Someone who is almost 50 and has had so much cosmetic surgery, has had lesbian relationships, openly advocated against the catholic church, wearing fur at times and has joined the Kabbalah cult would not be someone I'd describe as a role model in contrast to Reese Witherspoon or Natalie Portman. Who are to our morals better rolemodels for boys and girls alike.

3 Replies

@Vasska,

Vasska wrote:

has had lesbian relationships, openly advocated against the catholic church, wearing fur at times

^ is any of that moraly wrong? I'm not promoting madonna here, I'd say she's a bad role model too, but those things aren't moraly wrong according to me..

Sexiual orientation can never be moraly wrong according to me, I'm not pro-gay in any way but that doesn't mean it's moraly wrong..

Alot of smart, amazing, etc. etc. people who have spoken out against the catholic church, christianity and religion but should still all be counted as good role models despite their views on religion shouldn't they?
"Religion is comparable to a childhood neurosis."
- Dr. Sigmund Freud

"I have found Christian dogma unintelligible. Early in life, I absenteed myself from Christian assemblies."
"Lighthouses are more helpful then churches."
- Benjamin Franklin

"Christianity is the most ridiculous, the most absurd and bloody religion that has ever infected the world."
- Francois Marie Arouet AKA "Voltaire"

And the best one:
"The Christian god can easily be pictured as virtually the same god as the many ancient gods of past civilizations. The Christian god is a three headed monster; cruel, vengeful and capricious. If one wishes to know more of this raging, three headed beast-like god, one only needs to look at the caliber of people who say they serve him. They are always of two classes: fools and hypocrites."
- Thomas Jefferson, U.S. President
(read more at wizzyofsweden.com! Very Happy

)

And for fur.. I wouldn't wear fur simply because I'm a guy, it would look stupid.. But if I found a nice fur coat that I liked, I'd buy it and never regret it. To me it isn't moraly wrong atleast... I can understand how people see it that way but I don't agree with it...

1 Reply

@Wizzy,

Don't take it the wrong way Wizzy. I have always supported the right for sexual preference and will always support this, but consider;

Lindy a 12 year old girl listens to Madonna and gets brainwashed by all the magazines about the lesbian relationships by Madonna. A kid this age has girlfriends, all very impressible. What I've noticed a few years back when i was around a lot of 15 years old (hea! i was 15 too) that kids during their 13 and 17 are always bisexual, gay or lesbian and can change any minute. Mostly due to their exposure to *role models* like Madonna.

The mass attention to someone like Madonna, her lesbian relationship can screw up kids sexual orientation by being exposed to it to someone she adores and listens to every day, and of course has posters of.

My point was that when PhilosopherQueen said she found Madonna and Reese Witherspoon rolemodels. I can agree with the Reese Witherspoone argument but not the Madonna one.

I find you a bit puzzling by saying your do not support it, but don't think it's morally wrong either. Get a opinion on the matter; saying "It's okay to be gay" does not make you gay too. Of course you don't like 2 man kissing in public space, but i don't like a man and a woman kissing in public space either. Their sexual orientation stays at their side, yours stay at yours.

The problem with fur is that beside being a hot issue, it often has been done in unmoral way. I can understand we kill cows, pigs, chickens and cows for their meat. It's morally acceptable unless the filthy downright hideous religious slaughter which should be banned and everyone who promotes it to be shot a sight - and needed for our survival. However killing a fox because of it's skin is like killing you because i like your hair. We don't really need it and should net kill 40 million animals a year because of it. To me it's morally wrong.

The Catholic Church thing; i don't care about it being good or bad anymore. But someone who is famous saying she hates something always gets reactions. Here a local comedian has single handedly killed of a beer brand just by saying he did not like it. Same has happened by tv-stations who destroyed company's by broadcasting lies. The point here is that celebrities often have more power than they can handle and should not inject their personal opinions to much for other people start idolizing it.

1 Reply

@Vasska,

whats so wrong with lesbian relationships???

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@Vasska,

Vasska wrote:

Don't take it the wrong way Wizzy. I have always supported the right for sexual preference and will always support this, but consider;

Lindy a 12 year old girl listens to Madonna and gets brainwashed by all the magazines about the lesbian relationships by Madonna. A kid this age has girlfriends, all very impressible. What I've noticed a few years back when i was around a lot of 15 years old (hea! i was 15 too) that kids during their 13 and 17 are always bisexual, gay or lesbian and can change any minute. Mostly due to their exposure to *role models* like Madonna.

The mass attention to someone like Madonna, her lesbian relationship can screw up kids sexual orientation by being exposed to it to someone she adores and listens to every day, and of course has posters of.

My point was that when PhilosopherQueen said she found Madonna and Reese Witherspoon rolemodels. I can agree with the Reese Witherspoone argument but not the Madonna one.

I find you a bit puzzling by saying your do not support it, but don't think it's morally wrong either. Get a opinion on the matter; saying "It's okay to be gay" does not make you gay too. Of course you don't like 2 man kissing in public space, but i don't like a man and a woman kissing in public space either. Their sexual orientation stays at their side, yours stay at yours.

The problem with fur is that beside being a hot issue, it often has been done in unmoral way. I can understand we kill cows, pigs, chickens and cows for their meat. It's morally acceptable unless the filthy downright hideous religious slaughter which should be banned and everyone who promotes it to be shot a sight - and needed for our survival. However killing a fox because of it's skin is like killing you because i like your hair. We don't really need it and should net kill 40 million animals a year because of it. To me it's morally wrong.

The Catholic Church thing; i don't care about it being good or bad anymore. But someone who is famous saying she hates something always gets reactions. Here a local comedian has single handedly killed of a beer brand just by saying he did not like it. Same has happened by tv-stations who destroyed company's by broadcasting lies. The point here is that celebrities often have more power than they can handle and should not inject their personal opinions to much for other people start idolizing it.

Vasska
I have a opinion on the matter, and I'll say it: It's okey to be gay... I'm not and will never be, but I don't care if somebody is or not really (unless it's a girl I'm trying to pick up..) I have gay firend and so on, I find it a bit puzzeling though, since our attraction to others is about sex and sex is about reproducing, since two of the same gender can't have kids, should they really wish to have sex and if they don't really wish to have sex, can they really be attracted to each other? Somebody probably have a great answer to this but I'm not that interested as it's a subject I know I can't beat... It's only fun if you can beat it Wink

And: You should never have to hide your sexual orientation, famous or not.. I don't care what the effects are, nobody should have to be "in the closet"..

Same thing goes for ones oppinions, if you happen to be famous, you have just as much right to freedom of speach as anybody els.. If you don't like religion, somebody els, milk, the simpsons or coca-cola, you should always be allowed to say so, if asked...

On the fur, it's also something I know that I can't win since most people think it's moraly wrong but I don't atleast.. Ofcourse, I probably lack moral in many areas..

1 Reply

@Vasska,

The South Park episode 'britney's new look' suggests that the people 'choose' a celebrity to molest with attention and that the goal is to kill the chosen celebrity, brilliant episode. It is the subtle things like- Britney shoots her brains out with a shotgun but survives Very Happy

, that quietly suggest, underneath the violence, that Britney has no brains to be shot out. She continues her career missing 3/4's of her head and a wonderfully accurate depiction of her MTV awards performance unveils.

Dan.

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@Wizzy,

philosopherqueen wrote:

whats so wrong with lesbian relationships???

I NEVER said anything was wrong with it. But as I described in previous posts someone like Madonna is not the same role model as Reese. I found you argument stating that Reese and Madonna are equal role models lacking, and provided substitutes (Natalie Portman, Scarlett Johanson) that do not have all the disadvantages of Madonna. Including all point I described before.

Wizzy,

When you say, and i quote;

Quote:

Sexiual orientation can never be moraly wrong according to me, I'm not pro-gay in any way but that doesn't mean it's moraly wrong..

You only state that it is morally wrong, BUT you don't really approve of it (Pro-gay). Given this, and only this, argument you are playing the agnostic here. You don't really believe it, but there is chance that it is there.

Sex
===
In this reply you back it up by saying you don't mind it, but don't see the point of it like they do. I'm okay with that, and was only replying to the information you gave in the previous post. But not giving this information at first makes me feel like you are playing the agnostic here; and we all dislike that breed of people.

As far as relations go; humans and animals alike both have the urge to reproduce in order to survive. We don't have eternal life, but we can plant our seed (childeren) on the planet to live on our legacy and ensure our race.
This still happens in the animal kingdom, not so more in the human kingdom.

As humans broke away from the animal kingdom and independently started to create a better concept of the world, we started to perceive things differently. Sex became something of lust and need instead of need alone.
This is why many relationships revolve around sex. The laws of attraction also play their role. You might want to count all the times you had sex, or anything that involves sexuality and put that against how many kids you have brought to the world. The answer we all know for ourself.

You now raise the ethical question "should gay people be allowed to have sex" this one is quite dangerous because you are putting gay people on the bottom of the list by denying them their human rights of free sexuality. I'm not saying you do this, but for the example this is the perfect interpretation.

The fact that between a man and a woman there is the (possibility) of reproducing should not matter because in the pure lust of it their is no reproducing by this group eith

Just a quick jump towards your "come out of the closet" argument; When the 3 hosts of the British Tv Program Top-Gear went to America they had a contest; We each get $1000 buy a car and do a roadtrip across America. At one time they painted each others cars and one of them painted "HOMO" "PROUD TO BE GAY" and "NASCAR SUCKS" on a car, in pink for the record, and they went on. They raced trough the more uneducated parts of America and stopped to tank at a local gas station. The woman there went crazy. She called up "The Boys" and within 5 minutes there were about 30 people who started to trow rocks at them, and hitting their cars. They were even chased for a while, even though he explained he was married, straight and it was a joke.

This might seem a bit of a harsh argument, but many parts of America, as well other countries (America however always has the whole anti-gay debate kept alive for years) have not accepted homosexuality. Just a few months ago to Iranian people were hanged like criminals for being gay.

I'd love to see being gay getting accepted, but really it is hard and often people get total rejection from society for coming out of the closet. This still is everywhere, and real sad. It makes me sad to see people hating gay people because they prefer males over woman.

Opinion
===
Someone who has a lot of influence should speak out their opinion. However we live in a society that loves role models and act accordingly to them. The have great responsibility and should use that for good. Instead of promoting their political agenda. The American Elections are a great example; how many stars does McCain, Obama and Clinton have? I could count many if we include the local American celebrity's as well the worldwide known ones.

Instead of saying they want that America starts again with investing in the country they say "Vote Clinton", "Vote Obama" and all will go well. This should not be the way to go for someone with so much responsibility.

Some stars can act accordingly and are smart as hell and don't just say anything stupid. The Gossip Magazine one's however do say many stupid things, and unfortunately those are the one's we read and hear about (unwillingly) because of the mass media.

1 Reply

@de budding,

de_budding wrote:

The South Park episode 'britney's new look' suggests that the people 'choose' a celebrity to molest with attention and that the goal is to kill the chosen celebrity, brilliant episode. It is the subtle things like- Britney shoots her brains out with a shotgun but survives , that quietly suggest, underneath the violence, that Britney has no brains to be shot out. She continues her career missing 3/4's of her head and a wonderfully accurate depiction of her MTV awards performance unveils.

Dan.

There have been numerous (not all) south park episodes that deal with issues, and gave moral advice. But as always Trey and Matt take highly unusual ways to say so.

The shotgun blast has some other meaning I guess, I'm not sure though. One of the meaning i want to attach to it is that we don't care about the face (the person itself) of who we chose to molest, but more that we drive them to that point for pleasure or (financial) gain.

It should be noted that Britney is not dumb, but she totally lost it. I honestly feel sorry for her. She had been in the business to young and finally cracked under it, had a bad manager and say goodbye to everything you hold dear. Next to that as George Orwell said; A man may take to drink because he feels himself to be a failure, and then fail all the more completely because he drinks. Britney did the same; she cracked and made mistake after mistake (her marriage, no careful thinking about her kids, drug abuse). Linday Lohan and The Olson Twins did the same. Christina Aqulaira however managed well.

0 Replies

@Vasska,

Vasska wrote:

In this reply you back it up by saying you don't mind it, but don't see the point of it like they do. I'm okay with that, and was only replying to the information you gave in the previous post. But not giving this information at first makes me feel like you are playing the agnostic here; and we all dislike that breed of people.

Well I am fairly agnostic on this topic wether you like it or not but it's only because I've gotten my butt kicked in that debate so many times.. Don't get me wrong, I'm not really anti-gay I'm just questioning it.. Is it really the same thing as beeing attracted to somebody of the opposit sex? It's not just some wierd reversed oedipus complex or something of that sort?

Vasska wrote:

As humans broke away from the animal kingdom and independently started to create a better concept of the world, we started to perceive things differently. Sex became something of lust and need instead of need alone.
This is why many relationships revolve around sex. The laws of attraction also play their role.

Yes but you agree that the need is still there, therefor my argument is: shouldn't the need impulses that animals have (reproducing) still be within our brains? Although we acctually enjoy sex too? Therefor beeing heterosexual makes since because both need and lust is represented, while in beeing homosexual, only the lust part is present..

Vasska wrote:

You now raise the ethical question "should gay people be allowed to have sex" this one is quite dangerous because you are putting gay people on the bottom of the list by denying them their human rights of free sexuality. I'm not saying you do this, but for the example this is the perfect interpretation.

Ofcourse everybody should be allowed to have sex with whom ever they please, never claimed anything els either (with the exception of children ofcourse)...

Vasska wrote:

The fact that between a man and a woman there is the (possibility) of reproducing should not matter because in the pure lust of it their is no reproducing by this group eith

Well, yeah it should because nomather how much we try the basic elements in the animal world, their basic needs are still strongly represented within us.. Food, liquid, violence and sex (reproducing) are some if not all of those needs.. The only real difference is that we are less impuslive and can deny our basic needs if we really wish too...

Vasska wrote:

Just a quick jump toward your come out of the closet

What the hell? Razz

Vasska wrote:

I'd love to see being gay getting accepted, but really it is hard and often people get total rejection from society for coming out of the closet. This still is everywhere, and real sad. It makes me sad to see people hating gay people because they prefer males over woman.

Yeah me too, as I've said: I'm not anti-gay, just questioning it.. Seen that Top-Gear episode though, I got angry at the "boyos" too...

Vasska wrote:

Some stars can act accordingly and are smart as hell and don't just say anything stupid. The Gossip Magazine one's however do say many stupid things, and unfortunately those are the one's we read and hear about (unwillingly) because of the mass media.

I don't think that how the public loves celeb gossip should effect how they express their belives and oppinions.. Everybody should be allowed to say what ever they like, famous or not.. If somebody doesn't like it, well they have the right to say that they don't too don't they? See how wounderfull the world would be if nobody could take legal action against anybody for anything they say? The world would be filled with complaining! (Which is kind of what we are doing in this forum isn't it? Wink

)

2 Replies

@Wizzy,

Wizzy,

Britney is shallow and untalented, that's all I need to know to judge her as an 'artist', her personal life is of no interest to me as is her music. Razz

0 Replies

@Wizzy,

de_budding wrote:

Wizzy,

Britney is shallow and untalented, that's all I need to know to judge her as an 'artist', her personal life is of no interest to me as is her music.

I would not say she is untalented ans shallow. She has been made this way. Anyhow, someone who gathers millions by singing generic songs would not be dumb in my opinion.

Wizzy,

Wizzy wrote:

Well I am fairly agnostic on this topic wether you like it or not but it's only because I've gotten my butt kicked in that debate so many times.. Don't get me wrong, I'm not really anti-gay I'm just questioning it.. Is it really the same thing as beeing attracted to somebody of the opposit sex? It's not just some wierd reversed oedipus complex or something of that sort?

Alright, you have the right to question it, but because of all the arguments you've had you should have a more firm opinion than the agnostic i don't know argument. Anyhow we should not discuss this anymore than needed.

Quote:

Yes but you agree that the need is still there, therefor my argument is: shouldn't the need impulses that animals have (reproducing) still be within our brains? Although we acctually enjoy sex too? Therefor beeing heterosexual makes since because both need and lust is represented, while in beeing homosexual, only the lust part is present..

There is something called adoption that many gay people do. This can been seen as another form of need. Lesbians can have artificial insemination if they wish so.

Quote:

Ofcourse everybody should be allowed to have sex with whom ever they please, never claimed anything els either (with the exception of children ofcourse)...

I did note, on purpose, that you did not imply it, but was getting awfully close to saying it.

Quote:

Well, yeah it should because nomather how much we try the basic elements in the animal world, their basic needs are still strongly represented within us.. Food, liquid, violence and sex (reproducing) are some if not all of those needs.. The only real difference is that we are less impuslive and can deny our basic needs if we really wish too...

We are getting of track here.

Quote:

What the hell?

My mistake i meant saying "Just a quick jump towards your "come out of the closet" argument;" but failed. edited in the post.

Quote:

Yeah me too, as I've said: I'm not anti-gay, just questioning it.. Seen that Top-Gear episode though, I got angry at the "boyos" too...

This was brought up because of the prosecution of gays and you saying everyone should get out of the closet.

Quote:

I don't think that how the public loves celeb gossip should effect how they express their belives and oppinions.. Everybody should be allowed to say what ever they like, famous or not.. If somebody doesn't like it, well they have the right to say that they don't too don't they? See how wounderfull the world would be if nobody could take legal action against anybody for anything they say? The world would be filled with complaining! (Which is kind of what we are doing in this forum isn't it? )

Everyone should say what they like if it is based on facts and not just some rambling. Neo-Nazi's, Religious fundamentalists and others are just plain wrong in their ways. So can celebrities like Tom Cruise with his Scientology Craze. If you are a teacher you should not say that Hitler was the best thing that happened to the world. Famous people are unfortunately for many people teachers and should act accordingly

1 Reply

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