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Sat 24 Apr, 2010 07:30 pm
My mother aquired a whole life insurance policy on myself and my three brothers when we were very young and always, sometimes with great effort, paid the required premiums on time. Well, she did so until we were all grown men. I suspect she would still be paying our premiums today, had she lived long enough. Our adoring mother departed this world some eleven and half years ago, following a very complicated surgery she underwent. It was, perhaps, a month after the death our mother, that one of our elder sisters began calling asking us guys if we would sign some form giving her approval to assume the whole life policies our mother had taken out on us years earlier. I am not completely sure if my brothers ever signed the form, but I never did. Nevertheless, she began paying the premiums, thus somehow, becoming our new beneficiary.
Fast forward to the present, it has been almost twelve years since she (our sister) assumed the policies becoming the current policyholder. She is, one assumes, my beneficiary even though, I gave NO consent in writing or otherwise, for her to obtain the policy my loving mother had retained through the years. Moreover, she has NOTHING with our mother's signature on it granting her approval to seize the policies. Recently, I suggested to her the notion of allowing me to cash-in the policy for its cash value. She goes BALLISTIC! Repetatively shaking her head, signifiying a no answer and saying "I can't let you do that" over and over again. I expressed to her that I had aquired for myself, through my employment and an outside agency, enough life insurance, so that when I do need it, there will be a sufficiency. Still, she was unwavering in her descision not to permit it. To me, this suggests something that is very disturbing, and that is, my sister, the person I thought I knew, is adamantly against my cashing-in the policy because it would nullify her opportunity to one day, perhaps, recieve the face-value amount of the policy. In otherwords, she view our life insurance policies as future investments and she doesn’t want to part with them.
My questions, can my sister assume the role of policyholder of the life insurance my mother took out on me long ago, thereby, becoming my beneficiary without my consent, subsequently refusing to allow me to cash it in? Unless she has a forged form with my name on it, I don't think she can. Professional help here, what do you think?
contact the insurance company. Find out exactly what has been going on.
You will probably need the policy number.
@dadpad,
Thank you dadpad, but she is now refusing to cooperate entirely. So getting the policy number will be problematic. I've resolve to contacting an attorney as soon as possible.
@rcooper6,
Without written instructions as to the disposal of the policies, wouldn't they have been part of the estate? Who was the executor?
@engineer,
Engineer, my mother left no will, no written instructions of any kind. The executor you speak of didn't exist.
Listening. I've no advice, except maybe to call a reputable lawyers' office and ask. I'm not sure, but an original consult fee may be doable. (Others here will know more than I do.)
@rcooper6,
My sister continuously mention, every so often, about being a person of limited resources. And yet, when I suggest she allow me to cash in the insurance policy and relieve her of this added expense, she vehemently opposes it. The sinister reason she does, can only be because she look forward to the future pay-off.
@rcooper6,
Regardless of the outcome of my investigation in the matter, from this point forward, I wipe my hands of THIS sister.
@rcooper6,
Do you at least know for how long the life insurance was originally set up?
20/30 years? Regardless of the policy number, if you know the insurance
carrier, you can contact them to get the necessary info. After all, you are the
beneficiary of the life insurance your mother set up. It is part of your inheritance. Of course you might have to pay estate taxes, depending on the
amount of the insurance.
@rcooper6,
The policy is on your life but it was never your policy and you never put one dime into it cash value from my understanding of your story.
It was your mother and then a sister who build up this cash value with their payments not you.
Now you desire to seize the cash value you had no part in building up correct?
Interesting and something that any law school class would have fun with indeed.
Let see your mother could take out an insurance policy on her children because she had an insurable interest in your life and the cash value build up to the point of her death would belong to her estate not to you.
Afterward it get strange indeed as somehow your sister become the owner by default of the policy and place her name on the insurance policy as the owner and beneficiary of the policy.
Hmm I would love to see what a lawyer will tell you about this interesting mess but off hand, I do not think you have a default claim on the cash value because it is your life that is being insurance.
It would be nice if you let us know what a lawyer tell you about this mess.
@BillRM,
You're wrong, Bill. Paying for a life insurance for her children was their mother's way of securing an inheritance for them since life insurances are
paid out after a certain amount of time has elapsed.
Let's say, their mother set up the life insurance for 40 years and once the time
has elapsed, each child would receive $ 250,000, then each child would be
entitled to that amount, regardless who paid for the premiums.
@rcooper6,
Quote:My sister continuously mention, every so often, about being a person of limited resources. And yet, when I suggest she allow me to cash in the insurance policy and relieve her of this added expense, she vehemently opposes it. The sinister reason she does, can only be because she look forward to the future pay-off.
I had to laugh here as you place no money into this policy and she did where is it your funds?
If your mother had been still alive you would have had zero right to cash the policy out and any such cashing out by your mother would had belong to her not you.
It real nice that you had offer to take the cash value out that she and you mother had place into it for your benefits but that hardly seem fair!
It a real mess because all the policies could had been ended at the time of your mother death and any cash value would had then gone to her estate and share out among her children.
@BillRM,
Excuse me, but you don't know how life insurances work. Please go and read
up on it before you give advice that is completely wrong and utter nonsense.
@CalamityJane,
Quote:You're wrong, Bill. Paying for a life insurance for her children was their mother's way of securing an inheritance for them since life insurances are
paid out after a certain amount of time has elapsed.
Let's say, their mother set up the life insurance for 40 years and once the time
has elapsed, each child would receive $ 250,000, then each child would be
entitled to that amount, regardless who paid for the premiums.
It would had pay off to the mother not her son assuming she had live long enough.
I had a feeling some sharp life insurance saleman talk her into this but in any case if he had wished to take over the policy after her death it should had been his money going into it not his sister.
I do not see where he had a default claim to these funds however I am not a lawyer and I will love to see what lawyer will said.
@BillRM,
You just don't get it, do you?
The mother took out the life insurance for the children for a certain amount
of time so they can cash in once the time - she originally has set it up for - has
passed. She did not set out a life insurance so she can cash in if one of her
kids would die. In the United States you can set up a life insurance for a certain
amount and for a certain time duration - once the time has elapsed, the beneficiary can cash in the life insurance.
@CalamityJane,
My understanding of the insurance policy is that its a "Whole Life" policy and not a "Short Term" policy. "Whole Life" insurance is one that extends through the duration of the issured person's life-time. However, "Short Term" insurance has a limited existence time. That time would be stipulated within the language of the policy. I'll certainly keep this forum informed of the results that follows.
@CalamityJane,
Yes let say I am in a business partnership with another gentleman and I take out a policy on his life to insurance me against the lost of my partner.
Not uncommon indeed, I own the damn policy and any cash value build by that policy not my partner.
He can not cash it in or have any other benefit from that policy even if he is the one who life is being insurance.
The very fact that this was not settle at the woman death is sad but for him benefiting from the funds his sister had place into it is not morally ok and more likely then not legally ok.
As I said before expert I will be very interest in what the lawyer will said.
@BillRM,
Bill, again very slowly..... HE is the beneficiary of that policy. Whoever the
beneficiary is, will be able to cash in the policy.
If you take a life insurance against your business partner, than YOU are the
beneficiary in case he will die. If he doesn't die, than you are still the beneficiary since you set up the insurance this way.
@rcooper6,
rcooper6 wrote:
My understanding of the insurance policy is that its a "Whole Life" policy and not a "Short Term" policy. "Whole Life" insurance is one that extends through the duration of the issured person's life-time. However, "Short Term" insurance has a limited existence time. That time would be stipulated within the language of the policy. I'll certainly keep this forum informed of the results that follows.
Yes, please keep us informed. Without having the particulars for this insurance it is difficult for anyone to give you sound advice.
@rcooper6,
Please let us know as this is an interesting case if a sad personal mess for you and your family.
For what little it is worth cashing it out and sharing the value in ratio to the cash value that your sister payments had build up seem fair and a way not to destroy a family relationship.
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