19
   

I MAY have won a trip to Florida. What's cool in Florida?

 
 
margo
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Mar, 2010 08:04 pm
Florida!

Well...they have beaches and alligators.

We have beaches and crocs.

History - back to 1565. Ours - back 40,000 years.

Hmmmmm!
chai2
 
  2  
Reply Wed 17 Mar, 2010 08:07 pm
@margo,
hmmm....

I do believe Florida was there before 1565, with real live people living there.
You know, that whole tribal thing.

Team Says Humans Lived In North America Earlier

By Rob Stein
Washington Post Staff Writer
Thursday, November 18, 2004; Page A14

Archaeologists said yesterday they had found evidence that humans lived in North America at least 50,000 years ago, far earlier than has been thought.

The report was immediately met with skepticism by other scientists because the evidence had not gone through the usual process of review by independent researchers, which is especially crucial for something that would so dramatically rewrite human history. If humans migrated to the Western Hemisphere that early, it would force scientists to fundamentally rethink the early migration patterns of the species and the role of Homo sapiens so far back in this hemisphere.

But the researcher who led the team that made the discovery said he was confident the findings would hold up under scrutiny.

"It's really shocking -- we know that. Most archaeologists probably will reject this. We know we have our work cut out for us, to say the least," said Albert C. Goodyear, an archaeologist at the University of South Carolina. "But I believe it, so I have to call it as a I see it."

The findings are pieces of charcoal and shards of stone Goodyear and his colleagues unearthed at the Topper archaeological site along the Savannah River in Allendale County, S.C.

Modern humans are believed to have evolved in Africa between 60,000 and 80,000 years ago. Archaeologists have found evidence modern Homo sapiens migrated to Australia and central Asia about 50,000 years ago, and to Europe perhaps 10,000 years later.

But modern humans are believed to have migrated to the Western Hemisphere much later. For decades, the earliest signs of modern humans in the Western Hemisphere were believed to date back about only 13,000 years to a primitive culture known as Clovis, whose distinctive fluted projectile points have been found across the United States. Archaeologists have, however, begun to challenge the idea that the Clovis were the earliest human inhabitants in the area, citing findings that might push back that date back to about 20,000 years ago.

No one has previously said he has found any evidence that would push the date back 50,000 years.

In the new findings, Goodyear said his team dug down deeper than ever before at the Topper site and found tiny shards of flint that Goodyear believes are clearly the remains of ancient toolmaking. Then, the researchers found pieces of charcoal nearby in what could have been an ancient hearth, and sent the samples to the University of California at Irvine for radiocarbon dating, which is considered the gold standard for determining the age of archaeological artifacts.

The results, released yesterday, concluded the charcoal is at least 50,000 years old.

The researchers plan to submit the findings to a scientific journal for publication but decided to release the results before that because of intense media interest, Goodyear said.

Other scientists said they respected Goodyear's work but found it difficult to evaluate the findings without seeing details.

Although the date of the charcoal may be accurate, the pieces of stone found with it could easily have been created naturally instead of by ancient humans, Michael B. Collins of the University of Texas at Austin said.

"Nothing that I've seen is convincingly an artifact," Collins said. "I don't think the broken stones down there were broken by humans. I just don't see anything that makes me sit up and say, 'Wait a minute. Now he's got something.' "

David G. Anderson, an anthropologist at the University of Tennessee in Knoxville quoted the well-known scientific dictum that "extraordinary claims require extraordinary standards of evidence."

"Evidence of a human presence upwards of 40,000 years old in the New World has been proposed by many previous investigators, and none of these early claims survived careful professional examination," Anderson said.


panzade
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Mar, 2010 08:15 pm
Quote:
oldest continuously occupied European established city(1565) in the continental US.


Never said anything about Cro-Magnon man eking out an existence in the Everglades
0 Replies
 
roger
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Mar, 2010 08:19 pm
@chai2,
I think you are both talking about archaeology, as opposed to what I would call history. In other words, both the ranges include prehistoric ages.
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Mar, 2010 08:43 pm
Would it be illegal to send a check that will definitely bounce to a scammer?
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Mar, 2010 09:56 pm
@chai2,
chai2 wrote:

deb, Fla is the scam capital of the world.

don't even answer your phone.


I'll probably have to answer it eventually.

Why do you thik it's the scam capital? I mean this in both senses...why do you think that, and what is it about Florida, do you think, that makes it that?
sozobe
 
  1  
Reply Thu 18 Mar, 2010 07:11 am
@dlowan,
Read Carl Hiassen and all will become clear! (Have you read any of his books? I think you'd like 'em even without the Florida angle, sort of a Douglasadamsesque voice.)
chai2
 
  1  
Reply Thu 18 Mar, 2010 07:11 am
@dlowan,
dlowan wrote:

chai2 wrote:

deb, Fla is the scam capital of the world.

don't even answer your phone.


I'll probably have to answer it eventually.

Why do you thik it's the scam capital? I mean this in both senses...why do you think that, and what is it about Florida, do you think, that makes it that?


Well, in no particular order...

I lived in South Fla. (Boca Raton and Pompano Beach) for 8 or 9 years. Over that time I met so many people who were involved in some type of boiler room operation. Anything from selling people real estate in the middle of the everglades, to those annoying calls selling magazine subscriptions, to credit card scams, etc. etc.

S. Fla is a Mecca for people who want to live the easy life, meaning scraping enough money together to get by, hang out near the beach, live on other peoples couches, and so on.

There's a tremendous amount of prostitution and drug use. Put the 2 together and you've got lots of women offering their services for the price of a hit on the crack pipe.

There's a large population of senior citizens who moved to Florida for retirement, and they are of course, a prime target for con artists.

In addition, even among upstanding citizens, there's just something about the lifestyle I would never want to go back to. I don't have statistics, but if you spend any time there at all you realize that so many people are transplants from the NE U.S.
If these people haven't moved down permanently, the are "snowbirds", there for the winter season.
This makes for an attitude of rush, rush, rush. Hurry up and bring my food, why isn't this done yet, and so on.

I've had at least 4 or 5 friends/relatives that live in that area come to visit me for a few days at a time. At some point during the visit, every single one of them has said the exact same thing to me....."I was just standing there in line, and this person just started TALKING to me!"

Me: Well, yeah, we do that.
Them: They were just so FRIENDLY!
Me: Uh huh, I think most people are.
Them: (blank stare)....wow...that was.....nice, talking to them....

To me, personally, Fla is just a cesspool where all the **** sinks to.

I know others love it, that's just my experience and opinion.
Of course there's good people, I just prefer to live somewhere where there aren't so many bad ones.
chai2
 
  1  
Reply Thu 18 Mar, 2010 07:12 am
@sozobe,
sozobe wrote:

Read Carl Hiassen and all will become clear! (Have you read any of his books? I think you'd like 'em even without the Florida angle, sort of a Douglasadamsesque voice.)


Carl Hiassen?

I'll have to check him out.
chai2
 
  1  
Reply Thu 18 Mar, 2010 07:14 am
@chai2,
he he he...

from wikipedia on Carl....

He said this about Florida: "The Sunshine State is a paradise of scandals teeming with drifters, deadbeats, and misfits drawn here by some dark primordial calling like demented trout. And you'd be surprised how many of them decide to run for public office." [4]

Hiaasen's Florida is a hive of greedy businessmen, corrupt politicians, dumb blondes, apathetic retirees, intellectually challenged tourists, hard-luck redneck cooters, and militant ecoteurs. It is the same Florida of John D. MacDonald and Travis McGee, but aged another 20 years and viewed with a more satiric or sardonic eye.

sozobe
 
  1  
Reply Thu 18 Mar, 2010 07:15 am
@chai2,
Spelled it wrong, Carl Hiaasen.

A blurb:

Quote:
Q. Putnam recently published a second collection of your newspaper columns in a book called Paradise Screwed. Wasn't it weird to look back at columns you wrote so long ago?

The weird part is how little things have changed -- Florida is as screwy now as it was in the 70s and 80s. Look at the Elian Gonzalez story, or the presidential recount fiasco. I mean, Florida is the only reason that George W. Bush is in the White House - 16,000 people here managed to vote for the wrong candidate on election day.

My main concern about the anthology is that it exposes me for the sneaky poacher I am -- all those readers who thought I dreamed up the crazy ideas for my novels will now realize that I simply ripped them out of the headlines in The Herald. Nothing that happens in my books, no matter how twisted, transcends the reality of South Florida.


http://www.carlhiaasen.com/faq/faq-otherBooks.shtml

"Flush" (and "Hoot" and "Scat") are for kids. All his other books are for grownups. (Nominally mysteries, actually an excuse to talk about how weird Florida is.)
0 Replies
 
sozobe
 
  1  
Reply Thu 18 Mar, 2010 07:16 am
@chai2,
That's a better quote!

He's awesome. Not Great Litteriture, mind you, but a lot of fun.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Thu 18 Mar, 2010 07:22 am
I agree with Chai . . . i wouldn't live in Florida for a million dollars . . .
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Thu 18 Mar, 2010 07:37 am
One sees that Florida makes people TALK!!!

Fascinating.


Pity I didn't REALLY win anything!
0 Replies
 
mismi
 
  1  
Reply Thu 18 Mar, 2010 07:58 am
@margo,
There were indians there at least 12,000 years ago. Quite a bit further back than 1565 - though certainly nothing like 40,000 years to boast. Just a whipper snapper compared to Autstralia. Wink

I like Florida. Good college (and highschool) football....and they have MLB spring training. That is good stuff.

And they have sugar white beaches on the Gulf side. It's lovely.

Of course once you get past Tallahassee it all starts sounding like you have reversed and moved further north. Yankee transplants. Wink Lovely folks.
0 Replies
 
BorisKitten
 
  1  
Reply Thu 18 Mar, 2010 12:04 pm
Eh... well, I grew up in South Florida, which really is just as scummy and awful as Chai says. But the state isn't all like that.

I've lived in rural Central Florida for 11 years now... after my roughly 10 yrs each in Tampa, then Sarasota.

People in all 3 places are much more ordinary than anyone in Hiaasen's books. They get up in the morning, go to work, send their kids to school, eat some alligator... no, really, they're positively boring compared to most of the images posted here.

I found them less friendly and more hard-working in Tampa, more snotty and I'm-richer-than-you in Sarasota, and more friendly and, well, Redneck here, rural-like. Gun-totin', truck-drivin', muddin', hootin'-hollerin', y'know... "Shoot It, Merle!" kinda folk.

Funny, just yesterday I posted a video with clips about our 2.5-acre yard. Very pretty place.

I love it here. And rural like this, actually, nobody's ever tried to rip me off... except on the Internet.
mismi
 
  1  
Reply Thu 18 Mar, 2010 12:10 pm
@BorisKitten,
I have family in Sarasota BK...I love it down there.
BorisKitten
 
  1  
Reply Thu 18 Mar, 2010 12:12 pm
Here's that video, just uploaded it yesterday:



Just a little walk around the yard.
0 Replies
 
BorisKitten
 
  1  
Reply Thu 18 Mar, 2010 12:17 pm
@mismi,
mismi wrote:

I have family in Sarasota BK...I love it down there.

Yeah, I really liked Sarasota, too. Beautiful beaches, eh? I lived right downtown, where I could walk to the night-life. Eventually we just got tired of all the traffic, noise, and well, people! Much better here, rural.

Oh, and all my neighbors always wave, smile, even stop to chat.

When we first moved here we were shocked at this behavior and hardly knew how to react. Now, well, it's perfectly normal. I like it!
0 Replies
 
Merry Andrew
 
  1  
Reply Thu 18 Mar, 2010 01:05 pm
@sozobe,
I just recently discovered Hiaasen and am now reading everything I can get my hands on. He's kind of like Elmore Leonard on an LSD trip except that he's also (quite obviously) ecology-oriented and mad as hell at what developers are doing to the wilderness that used to be Florida. His villains are always people oblivious to their environment or overtly hostile to it.
 

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