15
   

How did the World Trade Center collapse?

 
 
JTT
 
  0  
Reply Mon 29 Nov, 2010 08:17 pm
@parados,
And you are pretty dumb, Parados.

JTT: no steel structure subjected to fire had ever or has ever collapsed, save for WTCs1,2 & 7.

parados replied:
ROFLMAO.. None has collapsed? Perhaps you should start by researching the McCormick fire in Chicago.

You were wrong. But you're not anywhere near man enough to admit it. You really do need a pair a dos.
parados
 
  2  
Reply Mon 29 Nov, 2010 08:46 pm
@JTT,
I am curious as to how much structural steel is required for it to be a steel structure in your mind JTT. WTC1 &2 had concrete cores supporting steel trusses.

Does concrete supporting steel trusses make it a steel structure or not? In the case of McCormick place you want to argue no but you argue yes for WTC 1&2.
JTT
 
  0  
Reply Mon 29 Nov, 2010 11:08 pm
@parados,
McCormick Place was not a building collapse. The roof, supported by unprotected steel trusses, collapsed. It was nowhere even close in design to WTC 1& 2 or WTC 7.

Your example was farcical and now you're trying to "cow barn" it.
JTT
 
  0  
Reply Mon 29 Nov, 2010 11:16 pm
@parados,
Quote:
I am curious what you know about how the modus of elasticity of steel changes when it is heated.


I am curious as to why you would start talking about terms that you can even describe accurately.
parados
 
  2  
Reply Tue 30 Nov, 2010 04:11 pm
@JTT,
It's nice to know the roof of WTC 1, 2 & 7 is still standing.

The failure of steel trusses caused the collapse. Which building are we talking about JTT?
talk72000
 
  0  
Reply Tue 30 Nov, 2010 04:16 pm
I think there is a cover up for the Israeli saboteurs who posed as Arabs and cheering on the roof tops as the Towers were burning. The Israelis were not in the Towers working that day. There was film crew as well and the day before there was a terrorist drill performed. All coincidence? Also the Jews in the Defense department, were they covering up?
parados
 
  2  
Reply Tue 30 Nov, 2010 07:12 pm
@talk72000,
It's a good thing you have said you aren't an anti-Semite talk7200, otherwise one would think you are from reading your posts.
JTT
 
  0  
Reply Tue 30 Nov, 2010 07:15 pm
@parados,
Quote:
The failure of steel trusses caused the collapse.


Did you get that idea from the picture of the McCormick building?
talk72000
 
  1  
Reply Tue 30 Nov, 2010 07:19 pm
@parados,
Just pointing out the preponderance of Jews in this tragedy makes one anti-Semitic? I would say the Muslims are being scape-goated by Jews to incite America into attacking Israel's enemies which doesn't concern us.
Ceili
 
  2  
Reply Tue 30 Nov, 2010 07:24 pm
@talk72000,
Yeah, Afghanistan is real hotbed of anti-semitism..
What an ass.
JTT
 
  0  
Reply Tue 30 Nov, 2010 07:26 pm
@Ceili,
I sawCeili and I immediately thought, "GREAT, finally, she's come back to explain all this."

Major disappointment, Ceili. Crying or Very sad
Ceili
 
  2  
Reply Tue 30 Nov, 2010 07:38 pm
@JTT,
Really? Am I supposed to jump on the bandwagon and hate and blame jews for everything?
No. I won't. Not for you, not for anyone. Sorry to disappoint.
parados
 
  2  
Reply Tue 30 Nov, 2010 07:40 pm
@JTT,
You certainly like to keep yourself ignorant, don't you JTT. If you bothered to read what I linked to, you would know I didn't get the idea from a picture at all.
talk72000
 
  0  
Reply Tue 30 Nov, 2010 07:47 pm
@Ceili,
The attacks on the World Towers indicate some Jewish intrique. The meltdown had many high profile Jews involved. After all Hitler came from Austria. Didn't he blame the Jews?

Quote:
The high-profile role played by Jews on Wall Street has never been a secret. Many of the wheelers and dealers responsible for shaping the current US financial system are Jewish, including former AIG CEO Hank Greenberg, former Citcigroup CEO Sandy Weill, recently-retired Lehman Bros. CEO Richard Fuld, former Fed chairman Alan Greenspan, former Treasury Secretary Bob Rubin, current Fed chairman Ben Bernanke,etc. One of the “weapons of mass destruction” described by the legendary investor Warren Buffet is the Credit Default Swap. Greenberg’s AIG is the biggest purveyor of CDS. In spite of the warnings by Buffet in 2006, Greenspan and his successor Bernanke argued against regulating derivatives such as credit default swaps. Unregulated financial derivatives are now considered the biggest cause of the financial collapse.

The world of finance is not unique in the dominant role played by Jews. Other businesses including media and entertainment and professions such as medicine, law and accounting have powerful Jewish presence. American Jews are disproportionately over-represented in the US Congress, the Senate and the Supreme Court as well. US policies in all spheres are heavily influenced by the Jewish minority in the United States. Many significant levers of power are controlled by American Jews, a constant that does not change with election winners or losers in Washington. Both Obama and McCain teams boast of powerful Jews as key policy advisers on foreign affairs, finance and national security. Robert Rubin and Dennis Ross are advising Obama. Joe Lieberman is advising McCain.


http://www.zimbio.com/Ben+Bernanke/articles/324/Jews+Responsible+Financial+Meltdown
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  0  
Reply Tue 30 Nov, 2010 07:49 pm
@Ceili,
Smile

I was talking about explaining the WTC collapse, Ceili. Talking about Jews was the furthest thing from my mind.
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  0  
Reply Tue 30 Nov, 2010 08:00 pm
@parados,
You are so abstruse, Parados, and it's all part of your cow barn mentality, that it's hard to tell most of the time what you are talking about.

I am still curious as to why you would start talking about terms that you can't even describe accurately.
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  0  
Reply Tue 30 Nov, 2010 08:06 pm
"If they were to do real investigations we would see several significant high level criminal prosecutions in this country. And that is something that they are not going to let out. And, believe me; they will do everything to cover this up."

-Sibel Edmonds, former FBI translator


Quote:



INTERVIEW:

Former FBI Translator Sibel Edmonds Calls Current 9/11 Investigation Inadequate

by Jim Hogue

INTRODUCTION: Sibel Edmonds and Behrooz Sarshar, beginning in December of 2001, began filing reports to their superiors at the FBI. These reports could lead to the collapse of a corrupt power structure that has a stranglehold on the very institutions that are obligated to control it. We cannot excuse these institutions, for while they fiddle, they pass death sentences on their own troops, and on the people of Afghanistan and Iraq.
On April 30th, Sibel Edmonds was my guest for 50 minutes on WGDR radio.

What follows is an edited transcript of the interview. The editing is for the sake of a more readable piece.

Sibel Edmonds is a former FBI translator. She blew the whistle on the cover-up of intelligence that names some of the culprits who orchestrated the 9/11 attacks. These culprits are protected by the Justice Department, the State Department, the FBI, the White House and the Senate Judiciary Committee. They are foreign nationals and Americans. Ms. Edmonds is under two gag orders that forbid her to testify in court or mention the names of the people or the countries involved.

THE INTERVIEW
JH: The people who have so far been interviewed on this program have all been authors and researchers, and here we have someone who, for the most part, has first-hand information. Ladies and Gentlemen, your guest is Sibel Edmonds, formerly of the FBI, a translator who joined the FBI shortly after 9/11.
Ms. Edmonds, what I'll do is invite you to tell us whatever you would like--your stint with the FBI--and what the brouhaha with Ashcroft and company is all about.

SE: I started working for the Bureau immediately after 9/11 and I was performing translations for several languages: Farsi, Turkish, and Azerbaijani. And I do have top-secret clearance. And after I started working for the Bureau, most of my translation duties included translations of documents and investigations that actually started way before 9/11. And certain documents were being sent that needed to be re-translated for various reasons, and of course certain documents had to be translated for the first time due to the backlog.

During my work there I came across some very significant issues that I started reporting in December of 2001 to the mid-level management within the FBI. They said to basically leave it alone, because if they were to get into those issues it would end up being a can of worms. And after I didn't see any response from this mid-level bureaucratic management I took it to higher levels all the way up to [assistant director] Dale Watson and Director Mueller. And, again, I was asked not to take this any further and just let it be. And if I didn't do that they would retaliate against me.

At that point, which would be around February 2002, they came and they confiscated my computer, because, they said, they were suspecting that I was communicating with certain Senate members and taking this issue outside the Bureau. And, at that point, I was not. They did not find anything in my computer after they confiscated it. And they asked me to take a polygraph as to the allegations and reports I'd made. I volunteered and I took the polygraph and passed it without a glitch. They have already confirmed this publicly.

In March 2002 I took this issue to the Senate Judiciary Committee and also I filed it with the Department of Justice Inspector General's office. And as per the Senate Judiciary Committee's request the IG started an expedited investigation on these serious issues; and they promised the Senate Judiciary Committee that their report for these investigations would be out by fall 2002 latest. And here we are in April 2004 and this report is not being made public, and they are citing "state privilege" and "national security" for not making this report public.

Three weeks after I went to the Senate Judiciary Committee the Bureau terminated my contract, and they cited "government's convenience." I started working with the Senate Judiciary Committee that was investigating this case, and I appeared before the Inspector General's office for their investigation several times, and I also requested documents regarding these reports under the Freedom of Information Act; and they blocked this by citing again the "state secret privilege" and "national security" refusing to make these documents public.

On October 18th 2002 Attorney General Ashcroft came out personally, in public, asserted this rare "state secret privilege" on everything that had to do with my case. And they cited "diplomatic relations" and certain "foreign relations" that would be "at stake" if I were to take this issue and make it public. And, since then, this has been acting as a gag on my case.

I testified before the [9/11] commission on February 11th 2004, and as I said, I have been waiting for this report that they [the Attorney General's office] have been blocking for a year and a half from becoming public. The information I requested under the Freedom of Information Act has been blocked for two years. And I have been campaigning for the past three months trying to get the Senate Judiciary Committee that has the oversight authority and responsibility to start its own public hearings. However, this request is again being blocked. Now they [AG] are citing this upcoming election as reason. And here I am.


JH: And it is the Attorney General who is blocking your testimony.

SE: Senator Leahy, on April 8, 2004, sent a very strong letter to Attorney General Ashcroft, citing my case stating that he, Senator Leahy, has been asking questions, and has a lot of issues that have not been addressed, and asking AG Ashcroft to come and provide answers. And AG Ashcroft for the past two years has refused. So he [Leahy] is calling for a public hearing. However, Senator Hatch, who is the Republican Chairman of the Senate, has been a road block. And Senator Grassley [a Republican member of the Senate Judiciary Committee] went on the record with New York Observer's Gail Sheehy and said that Senator Hatch is blocking this investigation from taking place and for this public hearing to be held by the Senate Judiciary Committee.


JH: So Hatch has the power to keep Leahy and Grassley....

SE: Correct. And now it is becoming a partisan issue. However, I keep reminding them that this issue is not a new issue that has come out for this election. This issue has been in the courts for two years and two months now.


JH: I've watched Hatch perform since the Contra Hearings in the mid 1980s, and I can assure you that for Hatch, everything is a partisan issue. You have a tough one.

SE: We have to remind the people: Congress has the constitutional obligation and public responsibility to oversee these issues and the Department of Justice's operations. That's why they are elected. That's why they are there. That's what they are getting paid for.


JH: Do you think that Leahy and Grassley are going to try to plow ahead with this, or do you think that there is a back door deal with Hatch?

SE: Well....as far as I see, Senator Leahy has been trying, and it's a strong letter that he issued a few weeks ago. [Ms. Edmonds refers here to the GPO's PDF (Senate--April 8, 2004; pages s4012-4014) regarding Ashcroft's appearance before the Senate Judiciary Committee in 2003. Senator Leahy describes the inaction of Attorney General Ashcroft since their first meeting on September 19th 2001 as a "flagrant avoidance of accountability."]

However, I'm very disappointed with Senator Grassley's office and his staff members. They initially were very supportive. But what I am getting from their office every time I call is, "Well this issue is under the Inspector General," and that their hands are tied. And then I press further and ask, "Well, what do you mean, 'our hands are tied'? Who's tying your hands? Untie it. Let's get it untied." They don't have any response. They say, "Well, this issue is very complex, and as you know, it is being investigated." And I'm not seeing any issue being investigated. What I'm seeing is that this issue is being covered up, and relentlessly being covered up, in consideration of "state privilege," which people are calling "the neutron bomb of all privilege."


JH: I can assure you that there are probably thirty issues just like yours that are being covered up. And they are allowing reporters, writers, internet contributors, and journalists from around the world to do these investigations, because they know that most Americans will never hear any of that. But as soon as someone like yourself gets too close to actually finding out who did anything, "state privilege" or something....

SE: "National security" as a classification.

[read on at,]

http://baltimorechronicle.com/050704SibelEdmonds.shtml

0 Replies
 
parados
 
  2  
Reply Tue 30 Nov, 2010 08:53 pm
@JTT,
JTT wrote:

Quote:
I am curious what you know about how the modus of elasticity of steel changes when it is heated.


I am curious as to why you would start talking about terms that you can even describe accurately.


But you said I CAN describe them accurately JTT.


Quote:
I am still curious as to why you would start talking about terms that you can't even describe accurately.

I don't quite understand how you can STILL be curious about something you weren't curious about before.
JTT
 
  0  
Reply Tue 30 Nov, 2010 08:55 pm
@parados,
Parados, cow barning again. Whoda thunk?
parados
 
  2  
Reply Tue 30 Nov, 2010 09:15 pm
@JTT,
We were talking about modus of elasticity and your waffling on who knows what about it.

But if you want to shovel **** instead, I think we can all agree you do know how to do that quite well.
0 Replies
 
 

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