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How did the World Trade Center collapse?

 
 
Reply Mon 15 Feb, 2010 10:18 am
I just wanted a place to put this so I'd remember it when some 911-truth nut starts talking to me about how steel couldn't melt at those temperatures and how that means it was an inside job. or how the buildings wouldn't fall straight down like they did unless it was an inside job. This link explains exactly how and why the buildings collapsed in the way they did.

http://www.tms.org/pubs/journals/JOM/0112/Eagar/eagar-0112.html

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Type: Discussion • Score: 13 • Views: 13,550 • Replies: 252

 
djjd62
 
  2  
Reply Mon 15 Feb, 2010 10:29 am
@kickycan,
jesse ventura told me it was because they painted the girders with thermite paint

he spoke to me inside my head (granted i was wearing headphones, and he was on the radio, but still, pretty impressive)
tsarstepan
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Feb, 2010 10:32 am
@djjd62,
You let Jesse Ventura into your head?! Poor thing? Do you ever suffer from flashbacks? Sad
0 Replies
 
Merry Andrew
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Feb, 2010 10:45 am
Pat Robertson told me the WTC collapsed because G*d willed it to collapse. We have committed grave offenses in the sight of the Lord, he said, e.g. eating meat on Fridays and not smearing ashes on our foreheads once a year. G*d is unhappy with us, Robertson said, and if we're not careful, something else might collapse next. He wasn't very specific on that.
rosborne979
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Feb, 2010 10:54 am
@Merry Andrew,
Merry Andrew wrote:

Pat Robertson told me the WTC collapsed because G*d willed it to collapse. We have committed grave offenses in the sight of the Lord, he said, e.g. eating meat on Fridays and not smearing ashes on our foreheads once a year. G*d is unhappy with us, Robertson said, and if we're not careful, something else might collapse next. He wasn't very specific on that.

Pat is a little more specific when it comes to hindsight Smile
0 Replies
 
joefromchicago
 
  4  
Reply Mon 15 Feb, 2010 11:16 am
I would also point out that Barack Obama's original birth certificate (the one that lists his place of birth as "Ulan Bator, Mongolia and his mother's profession as "Hippy") was in the World Trade Center when it was blown up by ACORN at the direction of Bill Ayers.
Amigo
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Feb, 2010 11:50 am
How did building 7 Collapse?
djjd62
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Feb, 2010 11:51 am
@Amigo,
in a pile of rubble
0 Replies
 
parados
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Feb, 2010 12:00 pm
@Amigo,
Amigo wrote:

How did building 7 Collapse?


Similar to the buildings in Haiti.

You shake the ground violently.
You damage it with falling buildings next to it hitting parts of it.
You then add some fire.

Wow.. It collapses....
tsarstepan
 
  0  
Reply Mon 15 Feb, 2010 12:03 pm
@parados,
Nah uh!! Razz
http://www.phyast.pitt.edu/~micheles/scheme/module-system-talk/tower_of_babel.jpg
rosborne979
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Feb, 2010 02:18 pm
@kickycan,
kickycan wrote:
How did the World Trade Center collapse?

Gravity works in mysterious ways.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Feb, 2010 02:50 pm
Gravity is not just a good idea--it's the law.
djjd62
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Feb, 2010 02:56 pm
@Setanta,
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5905022110759872129#

scroll through the screens below the player and play from 6:30 on
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Feb, 2010 03:02 pm
@joefromchicago,
joefromchicago wrote:

I would also point out that Barack Obama's original birth certificate (the one that lists his place of birth as "Ulan Bator, Mongolia and his mother's profession as "Hippy") was in the World Trade Center when it was blown up by ACORN at the direction of Bill Ayers.


Word!
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Tue 16 Feb, 2010 01:22 am
@kickycan,
There aren't many who do tongue in cheek as well as Kicky.

I think that demolition experts are vastly overrated. Why spend all those bucks, waste all those months of preparation when you can just fly a old jet into these buildings, which were specifically designed for such a hit, and bring them down in a neat little pile inside of a couple of hours.

Added benefits; you can insulate the piles of molten steel left at the bottom of the debris field, caused by those INtense sooty fires and use it to heat the new building after it goes up.



parados
 
  1  
Reply Tue 16 Feb, 2010 08:38 am
@JTT,
You do realize that the design of the towers was different from most buildings, don't you JTT? That design contributed to it's collapse from the fires. The buildings withstood the plane hitting it, just like it was designed to to.
Letty
 
  1  
Reply Tue 16 Feb, 2010 09:06 am
@tsarstepan,
I caught the babel fish. Guess what that's from, tsar.
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Tue 16 Feb, 2010 11:04 am
@parados,
Different from this building, Parados,

http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/venezuela_fire.html

and this one,

http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/spain_fire_2005.html

Quote:
The Windsor Building was of a similar truss design to the twin towers, the fire started 11 storeys from the top of the building, and it burned at temperatures of 800ºC for more than 18 hours [AFP]. The core of the building did not fail.

The fire in WTC 1 is reported to have burned at 800ºC and was located roughly 17 storeys from the top of the building meaning the inner core supported only 6 additional floors of weight above the fire zone in comparison to the Windsor Building. WTC 1 collapsed after only 85 minutes, reportedly through core failure.

Don't you find this odd?

http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/wtc1_core.html







parados
 
  2  
Reply Tue 16 Feb, 2010 05:38 pm
@JTT,
Quote:
The Windsor Building was of a similar truss design to the twin towers, the fire started 11 storeys from the top of the building, and it burned at temperatures of 800ºC for more than 18 hours [AFP]. The core of the building did not fail.

The Windsor Building wasn't hit by an airplane that destroyed some of the uprights causing the others to have to carry more load. The airplane also blew off much of the sprayed on fire protection that would have still existed in the Windsor building.

Are you really this stupid JTT?

Let's see.. steel protected by coating lasts 18 hours. Steel not protected by coating lasts only 45 minutes. That kind of gives you an idea how IMPORTANT fire protection is in a building, doesn't it?

JTT
 
  1  
Reply Tue 16 Feb, 2010 07:08 pm
@parados,
Quote:
The Windsor Building wasn't hit by an airplane that destroyed some of the uprights causing the others to have to carry more load. The airplane also blew off much of the sprayed on fire protection that would have still existed in the Windsor building.

Let's see.. steel protected by coating lasts 18 hours. Steel not protected by coating lasts only 45 minutes. That kind of gives you an idea how IMPORTANT fire protection is in a building, doesn't it?


WTC7 wasn't hit by an airplane yet it went straight down like a stone. How could this happen when there were only fires here and there and nothing even remotely like the raging fires in the Windsor Building?

What are the chances that when a building, [three of them actually, in one day!], in situations like this, reaches the point of failure, that that failure is going to result in a straight drop? Purty damn small considering that the fires were not that hot, nor were they widespread.

In WTC2, there were firemen reporting from the very floors and areas that were supposedly in some kind of a giant conflagation.

"blew off much of the sprayed on fire protection", Parados? Even the NIST says they can't really know how much was "blown off".

Do you happen to know what the insulative material used was?

About those "uprights",

Quote:
In July of 1971, the American Society of Civil Engineers (ASCE) presented a national award judging the buildings to be "the engineering project that demonstrates the greatest engineering skills and represents the greatest contribution to engineering progress and mankind."3 Others noted that "the World Trade Center towers would have an inherent capacity to resist unforeseen calamities." This capacity stemmed from the use of special high-strength steels. In particular, the perimeter columns were designed with tremendous reserve strength whereby "live loads on these columns can be increased more than 2,000% before failure occurs."




Quote:
Additionally this summary states that the perimeter columns softened, yet your findings (NIST) make clear that "most perimeter panels (157 of 160) saw no temperature above 250C".

To soften steel for the purposes of forging, normally temperatures need to be above 1100C (6). However, this new summary report suggests that much lower temperatures were be able to not only soften the steel in a matter of minutes, but lead to rapid structural collapse.


So the vast majority of perimeter columns, just a hair over 98% of them, saw temperatures that were nowhere near the softening point for steel.

How do two buildings go down when nearly all the columns were not subjected to any dangerous temperatures, with or without insulation and there was a 2000% safety factor?
 

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