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What do you think about threaded forum software?

 
 
maporsche
 
  1  
Reply Sat 13 Feb, 2010 06:10 pm
@Robert Gentel,
That's better than most I've seen, the toggling is very quick and user friendly.

Given the choice though, I'd stick with the setup now, so I'm glad you'd leave that as an option.

To answer your original question, provided you left an option for 'current view', any other changes you'd make wouldn't bother me at all.
0 Replies
 
Region Philbis
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Feb, 2010 06:08 am
@Robert Gentel,

which format will new questions/discussions be in?

would thread author have the option to choose flat or threaded as the initial format?
Robert Gentel
 
  2  
Reply Sun 14 Feb, 2010 10:11 am
@Region Philbis,
The reader would decide what format it's in, not the author. So new topics would simply display how the reader wants.
hawkeye10
 
  -2  
Reply Sun 14 Feb, 2010 11:26 am
@Robert Gentel,
Quote:
The reader would decide what format it's in, not the author. So new topics would simply display how the reader wants.


Considering that you are tinkering with a conversation website how about you do us all a favor and pick up a book on the dynamics of conversation and consensus building. You might learn something.
Robert Gentel
 
  2  
Reply Sun 14 Feb, 2010 11:30 am
@hawkeye10,
I have a strong understanding of the social dynamics of conversations on forums and this thread happens to be consensus building. Makes perfect sense that a social retard would first recommend a book to learn about conversation.
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Feb, 2010 11:30 am
@Robert Gentel,
Robert Gentel wrote:
but in practice the threading makes it a bit more conversational and increases the prevalence of replying directly to an individual.



my experience is that threading creates dialogues, not conversations
hawkeye10
 
  -2  
Reply Sun 14 Feb, 2010 11:39 am
@ehBeth,
Quote:

my experience is that threading creates dialogues, not conversations

dialog is a conversation. The problem with what Robert plans to do is that it is important in group dynamics for each person to know what each of the other people in the group is aware of, has heard. This is already negatively impacted by the ignore function, and now it will be further degraded.
Robert Gentel
 
  3  
Reply Sun 14 Feb, 2010 11:46 am
@hawkeye10,
Your poor understanding of humans is ever evident when you make sweeping claims like that, saying that a feature like the ignore feature degrades the quality of the conversations. Different strokes for different folks, while you may not appreciate being ignored it's often bliss for those doing it and represents an improvement in the conversation for them. People should have the freedom to ignore you. That is how people deal with obnoxious people, and that you want to preclude them from doing so is itself part and parcel of being obnoxious.
hawkeye10
 
  -3  
Reply Sun 14 Feb, 2010 11:50 am
@Robert Gentel,
Quote:

I have a strong understanding of the social dynamics of conversations


Really? So why then all of the popularity BS? Anyone who has a basic understanding of conversation knows that it is often the most unpopular of opinions that the group most needs to hear and take seriously in order to reach a proper understanding of the subject. You went the other way. You try to bury the unpopular, and drive the unpopular people away.
Robert Gentel
 
  4  
Reply Sun 14 Feb, 2010 11:55 am
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:
Really? So why then all of the popularity BS?


Popularity is an inherent part of social dynamics. You would have the site fail to recognize and employ popularity but it's always there. Removing the number on the screen won't change that you are unpopular.

Quote:
Anyone who has a basic understanding of conversation knows that it is often the most unpopular of opinions that the group most needs to hear and take seriously in order to reach a proper understanding of the subject.


And they can see it just fine here if they want to, and it's not our job to shove your posts down anyone's throat. What is happening is that an unpopular person wants more of a platform than he deserves and doesn't want people who find him obnoxious to be able to express that through their votes or avoid him through ignoring.

Quote:
You went the other way. You try to bury the unpopular, and drive the unpopular people away.


Nonsense. I want to give people the tools to drive the people they want to away, and if they choose you your first instinct shouldn't be to blame the tools they have.

It's just like life, they can hang up the phone on you. You would have me build you a direct line that they can't turn off, but thankfully you don't get what you (regardless of this "we" and "consensus" bullshit) want.
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  -3  
Reply Sun 14 Feb, 2010 11:57 am
@Robert Gentel,
Quote:
Your poor understanding of humans is ever evident when you make sweeping claims like that


How about you get out of the gutter, deal with the subject rather than launching into character assassination??

In your opinion, is it important for the individuals in a group to be aware of what the other individuals in the group have heard, when discussion and consensus building rather than jacking off is the goal??
Robert Gentel
 
  3  
Reply Sun 14 Feb, 2010 12:04 pm
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:
How about you get out of the gutter, deal with the subject rather than launching into character assassination??


Don't be a hypocrite, you came here telling me I need a better understanding of social dynamics and told me to go read a book on it so don't go crying about "character assassination" if I tell you that I don't find your own grasp of social dynamics to be all that you think it is.

If this is the "gutter" then why did you start by playing from this deck?

Quote:
In your opinion, is it important for the individuals in a group to be aware of what the other individuals in the group have heard, when discussion and consensus building rather than jacking off is the goal??


As much as they are willing to be, they shouldn't be forced to read everything posted just for the ideal of being "aware". Their personal freedom of deciding what to read trumps your ideals for what they should read. Furthermore, the threaded option can actually serve to make users more aware of the context of the conversations and what is being talked about (i.e. they are more immediately aware of the immediate parent to a post) and not less so you, as usual, aren't making much sense.
0 Replies
 
Rockhead
 
  2  
Reply Sun 14 Feb, 2010 01:14 pm
I hate to step in the middle of this **** storm, and I am not part of hackey's we...

I miss being able to search for tags from the main screen.

and see no real purpose in having my tags there instead.

(i read what you said as to why there, and see it as a temporary tool)

Izzie
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Feb, 2010 01:48 pm
@Robert Gentel,
Robert Gentel wrote:

In "flat" discussion systems each post to a topic is in chronological order and that is that. The advantages are that it's simple and usually more visually appealing than threaded systems, which can also suffer in terms of usability, requiring more clicks in some implementations.

.... a flat system is that it represents a single unified conversation




obviously, for me personally and the people I talk with daily, this works.



Quote:
So let me hear your thoughts. In practice we can pretty much accommodate both sides and we could keep a flat version for those who prefer it, the only downside for them is that there would not be a "reply all" because for those in the threaded context they won't notice, for example, that you are addressing someone merely by virtue of your post immediately following theirs in chronological order.


glad you will keep the flat system for those of us who can work with this format.

I rarely use "reply all" so... not so much of an issue - unless I feel compelled to throw in my 2 Cents on a subject and do not wish to talk to a poster who I can't tolerate - then I would wish to use "reply all"


with a threaded system it sounds as tho it would accomodate those who debating one on one... which means - someone like me could have a point of view but whose opinion by the ones who "shout a bit louder" is then totally ignored. Maybe I am misunderstanding how this threaded thing works.

Also, it's actually quite good at times for some inane person to come along and "cool" a thread down - some of the disucussions become very heated and end up as just a shouting match - having someone come in and try to inject a little humour or whatever puts a little perspective back into the conversation.

Personally I'd prefer to see the 'whole' conversation/debate/answers, who is responding and how they are responding as opposed to seeking out various peoples posts on different threads on the same topic tho I could see how it work for a lot of opinionated people who don't want any kind of banter or social interaction ...


Also - there are people here on A2K who I wouldn't normally engage in the conversations they are having, like quantum phsyics etc... but it's good to go to a thread, say a hey or wave, and step back out without having to send PM's. You could lose talking to people if everything is "just on topic all the time"...


simple... I like simple, as it is Wink

I reckon the folk who play the trivia games would find flat preferable.


I think it totally depends on what you are using the forum for. Some use it for conversation, some use it for debating, some use simply as using another poster as a battering ram on any given subject ... amongst the million and other reasons people use the internet. Even tho some threads go off topic - you can scroll thru quickly if needs be, and you can ignore if you wish to, but you also find out lots of stuff about people from how they respond to others...

again, this is using the forum more in a social context!
Izzie
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Feb, 2010 02:07 pm
@Izzie,
ha... physics... unless there is a quantum phsycis, psychic, psycho.. blah Rolling Eyes Razz
0 Replies
 
djjd62
 
  -1  
Reply Sun 14 Feb, 2010 02:11 pm
how about beaded forum software

we could all get be-dazzlers

http://www.elaineschmidt.com/yahoo_site_admin/assets/images/BeDazzler.70160814_std.jpg
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  0  
Reply Sun 14 Feb, 2010 02:50 pm
Quote:
Which One to Use?
Threaded is generally seen in two forms. The first is where you can see an entire thread on one HTML page. This is the preferred form. The second form is where you have to click to a separate web page for each message. This is slow and a cost problem when pay per minute. Avoid tools with this configuration!
Threaded forums are excellent for question and answers (Q&A), tasks that have very specific breakdowns of content into fine-but-related categories. Threaded forums can become very fragmented in large groups and unless well managed, difficult for group and team building. We can "bury our jewels" in a thread as people add more posts, requiring a certain amount of stewardship if we are to preserve and reuse those jewels.

Linear forums show all posts in one topic in chronological order, usually showing the most recent post. Linear forums are good for relationship and team building, brainstorming, dialog and social conversations. Linear is less helpful for convergent conversations, fragmented and detailed topics and coming to closure.

Both forms, and even a combination of the two, have their place and usefulness. However, people tend to have strong prefernces for the format they first used. Within a team, there may be some differences of opinions on this.

http://www.fullcirc.com/community/threadedlinear.htm

lots of good stuff here:
http://www.fullcirc.com/community/communitymanual.htm

Trying to do a combination where every person has no idea of how the person they are speaking with is experiencing the conversation is nuts.
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Feb, 2010 03:46 pm
@Izzie,
Well, Luddite that I am, I found the examples that I looked at kind of incomprehensible (but I didn't spend any time trying to figure them out).

However, since there will be choice, I'll not be doing any bitching and moaning.

I'd be sad if it affected the social aspects of the site....but people want different things, and it's fair and reasonable and kind to offer choices, seems to me.

Robert Gentel
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Feb, 2010 03:56 pm
@Rockhead,
I think you may be looking for the thread that talks about those changes then (the "How do I fix..." one), as opposed to this thread about threaded topics.
0 Replies
 
Robert Gentel
 
  2  
Reply Sun 14 Feb, 2010 03:58 pm
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:
Trying to do a combination where every person has no idea of how the person they are speaking with is experiencing the conversation is nuts.


The most widely used forum software titles (you know, the ones you complain we don't use instead of this custom software) have already been doing that for a decade now without the gloom and doom you predict.

Don't you get the theme? How the sky doesn't fall even though you keep saying it is?
 

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