What would you serve in your AMERICAN Restaurant

@margo,

uniquely murrican veggies are around, i guess.

black-eyed peas.

i'm sure there's more.

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@margo,

Just not a lot of unique things you can do about them to make the dish American I guess. But almost any non-fast food meal has salad or vegetables or both. I love the buttery steamed vegetables that is a standard side with a steak in most American restaurants.

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Quote:

Just not a lot of unique things you can do about them to make the dish American I guess

I was kinda expecting that to be the case. It would be the same in most weestnised countires i expect. there were a few though
I saw jersey tomatoes come up, and OKra which is not big here, Pumkin pie.
With a bit of marketing around the edges we could probably Americanise some vegetable dishes. The chinese food i buy (when i buy it) has vegetables that i dont normally associate with China in it.

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@dadpad,

Yeah, well there's stuff like green bean casserole, which is actually pretty damn good. But I always wonder if that is American or just an adaptation. For example, collard greens is very much a Southern American food but it's even more traditional of a Brazilian/Portuguese food. I guess Caesar salad could count, creamed corn I think too. I wonder if the "cream of X" soups are American as well.

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@OmSigDAVID,

David - I'm not claiming the food is American. I'm saying that in my version of an American restaurant there is room for all different types of food- from many different countries - just like there are people - because that's what the whole idea behind America IS!!!
Does he want to know what Americans eat or does he want to know what Americans invented?

If a person came to America and went somewhere where all they sold was buffalo wings and egg creams or McDonalds and thought they were getting a true American eating experience - they'd be misled. That's all I'm saying.

Also - if you've ever been to Mexico and eaten real Mexican food - you'd see that the Mexican food you get in America is totally different. It's as much Americanized as it is truly Mexican. I happen to like both - I like the true Mexican food better - but I like Tex-Mex and Americanized Mexican food too. But it's a whole different animal- changed and adapted by Americans- to the point that Mexican people don't consider it Mexican anymore - so it is an invention of something new and an adaptation and those adaptations can be attributed to Americans.

Same with Italian food. I was just in Italy. The lasagne I ate there is totally different than anything I've ever had in America- they even SPELL it differently. Again, I like both - but the recipe has been changed and adapted by Americans.

Think of it like this - you take an idea, you change or adapt it and reinvent it. You give credit for the original idea - in its origin - but if you've invented something else that is different - can you attribute those changes to something other than the originator?

Anyway - it's not about credit - it's about inclusion (in my book).

Here's an awesome AMERICAN restaurant - if you want to have an American dining experience.
Here's the menu of the vegetables, breads and sides:

Quote:

*indicates vegetables cooked with pork
*Greens (cook's choice)
Yellow Corn
*Black Eyed Peas
*String Beans
*Pinto Beans
Mashed Potatoes & Gravy
Vegetable Casserole
Yams
Fried Okra
Okra & Tomatoes
Baby Lima Beans
Green Peas & Potatoes
Macaroni and Cheese
Rice and Gravy
Baked Apples
Broccoli & Cauliflower Salad
Buttered Broccoli
French Fries
Cole Slaw
Potato Salad
Apple Sauce

Breads & Toppings
Yeast Rolls
Buttermilk Biscuits
Cornbread
Molasses
Chow-chow
Gravy
Hot Peppers
Honey
Onions

http://www.mamadips.com/history.shtml
That's the link. Anyone who visits North Carolina and wants to eat an amazing American meal should go there.

And vegetables are key. Usually when I go there I get the vegetable plate with biscuits and cornbread - so that means four vegetables with bread and butter and honey.

You should also try the banana pudding. Is that an American adaptation - even though there are bananas grown and eaten all over the world? It might be because I think Americans came up with vanilla wafers didn't they? And you can't have banana pudding without REAL vanilla wafers (not the cheap kind).

I get what you're saying David - I just don't agree that what you're positing would be indicative of a truly American restaurant. In fact, I've never seen a restaurant like that in America.

1 Reply

@aidan,

aidan wrote:

David - I'm not claiming the food is American.

but that is the question presented by this thread

aidan wrote:

I'm saying that in my version of an American restaurant there is room for all different
types of food- from many different countries - just like there are people - because that's what the whole idea behind America IS!!!

That is off topic, so far as I understand. If I am rong, then the author
or anyone, can show that the question is different than my understanding.
So far, it seems to me that everyone who has posted has done so
in conformance with setting forth original AMERICAN cuisine,
as distinct from food that originated anywhere else.

aidan wrote:

Does he want to know what Americans eat

NO.

aidan wrote:

or does he want to know what Americans invented?

YES. Look over the other posts and see whether
thay bear me out or thay contradict me.

aidan wrote:

If a person came to America and went somewhere where all they sold was buffalo wings and egg creams or McDonalds and thought they were getting a true American eating experience - they'd be misled. That's all I'm saying.

I don 't think we r discussing that.

aidan wrote:

Also - if you've ever been to Mexico and eaten real Mexican food - you'd see that the Mexican food you get in America is totally different. It's as much Americanized as it is truly Mexican. I happen to like both - I like the true Mexican food better - but I like Tex-Mex and Americanized Mexican food too. But it's a whole different animal- changed and adapted by Americans- to the point that Mexican people don't consider it Mexican anymore - so it is an invention of something new and an adaptation and those adaptations can be attributed to Americans.

Maybe if the difference is sufficiently RADICAL,
thay can get away with calling it American original; I dunno.

aidan wrote:

Same with Italian food. I was just in Italy. The lasagne I ate there is totally different than anything I've ever had in America- they even SPELL it differently. Again, I like both - but the recipe has been changed and adapted by Americans.

There r different kinds of lasanya; there r different kinds
of lots of things. My Aunt Mary got her recipe from an Italian woman in her neighborhood.

aidan wrote:

Think of it like this - you take an idea, you change or adapt it and reinvent it.
You give credit for the original idea - in its origin - but if you've
invented something else that is different - can you attribute those
changes to something other than the originator?

Yes, if u r clear and non-deceptive.

aidan wrote:

Anyway - it's not about credit - it's about inclusion (in my book).

That 's not this thread. The author gets to
choose what his own thread is about.

aidan wrote:

Here's an awesome AMERICAN restaurant - if you want to have an American dining experience.
Here's the menu of the vegetables, breads and sides:

Quote:
*indicates vegetables cooked with pork
*Greens (cook's choice)
Yellow Corn
*Black Eyed Peas
*String Beans
*Pinto Beans
Mashed Potatoes & Gravy
Vegetable Casserole
Yams
Fried Okra
Okra & Tomatoes
Baby Lima Beans
Green Peas & Potatoes
Macaroni and Cheese
Rice and Gravy
Baked Apples
Broccoli & Cauliflower Salad
Buttered Broccoli
French Fries
Cole Slaw
Potato Salad
Apple Sauce

Breads & Toppings
Yeast Rolls
Buttermilk Biscuits
Cornbread
Molasses
Chow-chow
Gravy
Hot Peppers
Honey
Onions

http://www.mamadips.com/history.shtml
That's the link. Anyone who visits North Carolina and wants to eat an amazing American meal should go there.

And vegetables are key. Usually when I go there I get the vegetable plate with biscuits and cornbread - so that means four vegetables with bread and butter and honey.

You should also try the banana pudding. Is that an American adaptation - even though there are bananas grown and eaten all over the world? It might be because I think Americans came up with vanilla wafers didn't they?

I 'd have thawt English; I dunno.

aidan wrote:

And you can't have banana pudding without REAL vanilla wafers (not the cheap kind).

I get what you're saying David - I just don't agree that what you're positing would be indicative of a truly American restaurant.
In fact, I've never seen a restaurant like that in America.

The question, as I understand it, is what woud u put
on your menu if u were limited to only putting original American
food on it, excluding food of any other national origin.

1 Reply

@OmSigDAVID,

Quote:

Base ingredients are in many cultures the same mention the essential ingredient(s) or presentation that allow the dish to reprent American food.

Okay, well, in order for me to do this, that means that I'd have to research how the originator did it and then compare how Americans do it for every single dish?!

Quote:

That is off topic, so far as I understand. If I am rong, then the author
or anyone, can show that the question is different than my understanding.
So far, it seems to me that everyone who has posted has done so
in conformance with setting forth original AMERICAN cuisine,
as distinct from food that originated anywhere else.

I can see you're getting impatient with me. I admit, I am not good at conforming. I am more interested in presenting what I believe is a true picture of what an American restaurant is than to work with two or three dishes and try to prove that they're original. What's the point of that? Yes, all the other cuisines of most of the other countries of the world are the starting place for America's pallette of food. How could they not be? Those countries are thousands of years older than America...yeah...okay, and until recently with the introduction of the EU and world-wide immigration- much more homogenized in terms of their racial and nationalistic make-ups- who didn't already know that?

Quote:

Maybe if the difference is sufficiently RADICAL,
thay can get away with calling it American original; I dunno.

All I know is that I've been told by Mexican people in Mexico and Italian people in Italy that what we eat in America and call either Mexican or Italian food is in fact NOT what they consider Mexican or Italian food to be.
I'm just taking them at their word David.

aidan wrote:

Quote:

Does he want to know what Americans eat

David said:

Quote:

NO.

Oh, sorry then. I thought that was the goal.

Quote:

YES. Look over the other posts and see whether
thay bear me out or thay contradict me.

I believe you. I was just answering his initial question which is 'What would you serve in your AMERICAN Restaurant' in my own way. That's what I usually do with threads. I don't usually base my answer on anyone else's.
I said:

Quote:

You should also try the banana pudding. Is that an American adaptation - even though there are bananas grown and eaten all over the world? It might be because I think Americans came up with vanilla wafers didn't they?

David answered:

Quote:

I 'd have thawt English; I dunno.

I don't think so - I've never seen vanilla wafers over here. And I think Nabisco is an American company.

Quote:

The question, as I understand it, is what woud u put
on your menu if u were limited to only putting original American
food on it, excluding food of any other national origin

Without doing a lot of research - I have no idea. I do love Mama Dip's Country Kitchen though. I'd eat there almost every day if I could. I can't testify that none of her recipes originated anywhere else - say Africa or the West Indies- depending on what the experience and cultural background of her forebearers is.

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Okra is African, not American. Pumpkins, of course, are used all over the world, although it may be true that making pie of them is uniquely American--i couldn't say. Pumpkin pie is just one of a range of ingredients used in pies in the South--sweet potato pie, squash pie--all of which are pretty much the same, varying only by the recipe of the pie maker.

When plants were domesticated, most of the domestic plants with which we are now familiar were domesticated in China, the middle east or, to a lesser extent, Africa. The "new world" has given us tomatoes (and the modern tomato hardly resembles their ancestors at all), the chili (which has now become an integral part of so many national cuisines), potatoes (which also have been incorporated into many national cuisines) and maize, which we call corn. If we started claiming that tomato dishes, or potato dishes, or any dish with chilis in it were uniquely American, i suspect there would be a loud outcry at our alleged arrogance.

There are precious few genuinely unique dishes from the Americas which are commonly eaten in the United States, and about the only one i can think of that was eaten in North America when white boys showed up has not been mentioned here, and that's succotash. There are about as many recipes for succotash as there are regions in which it was used when white boys showed up, and about all they have in common is that they are stew-like and contain corn (maize) and beans of some kind. In Virginia, when the whites first arrived, this dish usually included fish, but people from other parts of the country would look at you as though you were loony if you insisted that succotash must have fish in it. During "the Great Depression," succotash, prepared usually as a casserole, was a popular dish because it was cheap, and it doesn't necessarily require meat (although people probably used meat if they could get it). I suspect that it stopped being popular after the end of the Depression, when people no longer had to resort to it, and would have associated it with poverty. The name comes from a Narragansett Indian word (from Massachusetts), so people in New England would probably resent being told that it is a traditional Southern dish, although many people in the South think it is.

So what qualifies as truly American food? Of all the things that have been mentioned, succotash is the only one i can think of which does not require ingredients from any other part of the world--and even today, succotash, if it is made, includes things like tomato, which the aboriginals of what is now the United States did not have when white boys arrived.

I think looking at it from the angle of what foods are popular with Americans, but which are not as commonly served elsewhere would be the best take.

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Now that makes me think of two uniquely American foods, from the South, which have not been mentioned. That is hominy and hominy grits. Hominy is made by taking corn (maize) in it's grain form ("sweet corn," which is usually considered a vegetable, did not exist when Europeans arrived--it is the product of hybridization), and blanching it in water containing lye. The Amerindians had lye, which can be made from wood ash. This causes the grains (the kernels) to swell up to five or six times their normal size. It is then left to soak for a day or two in clear water to leach out the lye.

From there, it can be dried and stored for long periods of time, and it is usually served in one of two ways. It can be soaked overnight, and then fried in a skillet with onions and sausage, which i happen to love (yellow hominy, i don't think much of white hominy). Or, it can be milled to remove the skin (which produces white hominy), and then ground into a meal, which is then served as grits, being boiled as is oatmeal. This is such a commonly served item in the South (or once was) that a bowl of grits usually comprises part of any breakfast you order in a diner in the South. Some folks salt it and eat it as a side dish, others put butter and sugar or honey on it and eat it as a sort of breakfast dessert. Grits are so commonly eaten in the South that you can buy "instant" grits at the store, not unlike instant oatmeal.

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@margo,

margo wrote:

OK - new question - whaat the hell are "home fries""?

"Home fries" are merely fries, just as a "family restaurant" is merely a restaurant. Like the prefix "family", the prefix "home" isn't supposed to describe its root noun in any more detail. It only exists to make you feel more comfortable about it.

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@margo,

margo wrote:

Not too many vegetable (other than potato) suggestions.

Are you meaning to tell me that ketchup is not a vegetable? Evil or Very Mad

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@Thomas,

Thomas wrote:

margo wrote:
OK - new question - whaat the hell are "home fries""?

"Home fries" are merely fries, just as a "family restaurant" is merely a restaurant. Like the prefix "family", the prefix "home" isn't supposed to describe its root noun in any more detail. It only exists to make you feel more comfortable about it.

No, not so. To an American, fries means french fries, but home fries means fried potatoes prepared in a different form, usually sliced, sometimes diced.

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@Thomas,

Thomas wrote:

margo wrote:
OK - new question - whaat the hell are "home fries""?

"Home fries" are merely fries, just as a "family restaurant" is merely a restaurant. Like the prefix "family", the prefix "home" isn't supposed to describe its root noun in any more detail. It only exists to make you feel more comfortable about it.

Yeah, this is incorrect. Home fries are diced potatoes which are usually then lightly fried in a skillet, not deep-fried like a typical French Fry, and often covered with cheese and other stuff. Sort of a deconstructed baked potato if done correctly.

http://simplyrecipes.com/recipes/home_fries/

Cycloptichorn

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@Thomas,

And "family restaurant" can mean "family-friendly" or "family-owned-and-operated".

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Setanta and Cycloptichorn -- I defer to your authority as Americans. Just to be clear though: On the preceding page, what is the common element between the home fries in TsarStepan's picture and those in Setanta's?

2 Replies

Obviously they both show fried potatoes. However, the image i posted is of hash brown potatoes, not home fries.

1 Reply

@Thomas,

Thomas wrote:

Setanta and Cycloptichorn -- I defer to your authority as Americans. Just to be clear though: On the preceding page, what is the common element between the home fries in TsarStepan's picture and those in Setanta's?

Setanta's picture (as he noted in the post) is of a plate of Hash Browns, which are shredded potatoes, then pressed (to get out as much moisture as possible), then fried in a shallow pan. The other is a picture of what we call Home Fries.

Cycloptichorn

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@Thomas,

I have had home fries a lot of different places.

(it's a road thing)

the only thing remains the same everywhere is fried potatoes, and the home label.

itsa kinda my home, my style sorta thing...

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@Setanta,

I see. So home fries are basically Bratkartoffeln, expressed in a word that's simple enough for Americans to pronounce.

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When i make 'em, i like 'em sliced, and i like to fry up some onions first, before i put the taters in the skillet . . .

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What would you serve in your AMERICAN Restaurant

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