8
   

$600 car that gets 258 mpg

 
 
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jul, 2009 08:53 am
@Walter Hinteler,
Wlter, Im looking at the VW diesel as another fmily car . ANy feedback over there as to its popularity and serviceability?

My Ford escape Hybrid is a little dream although a bit underpowered.
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jul, 2009 09:07 am
@farmerman,
Well, the Golf Diesel ("TDI") is very popular here (not with me: besides the original Beetle I'm 'anti-VW' Wink ) as is the Passat Diesel ("TDI"), with the

re serviceability: we (Europeans) have a totally different understanding for such; for instance the service intervals (= oil change etc) for all new cars are 30,000 km (= 18,650 miles) ... to maintain the warranty, since more than six (6) years now.
0 Replies
 
roger
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jul, 2009 02:14 pm
@chai2,
Bingo! My Focus has never gotten less than 38 hwy, and has exceeded 40 several times. City (town) runs to 28, and has exceeded 30, though not often. It seats four, and the rear seat folds down to expand trunk space. I once left Home Depot with a couple of 2 x 12 x 8'. The looks I got when I popped the trunk, the looks were nothing short of pity - till I slid the boards in, and secured them to the bike rack on the receiver hitch.

Two more points. It is suitable for highway driving, and I got it new at the end of the '03 model year for under 11,000.00 - including dealer prep, taxes, and registration.

Beat that, Damlier/Benz!
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jul, 2009 02:20 pm
@roger,
roger wrote:


Beat that, Damlier/Benz!



Look for the data of a smart, roger Wink

The Smart Fortwo gets 33mpg city and 40mpg highway ...
roger
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jul, 2009 02:23 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
It costs how much!? Seats how many and carries how much? Suitable for highway - you jest.
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jul, 2009 02:31 pm
@roger,
Not a lot more expensive than a Focus. Seats only two, isn't a racer but 85miles/h easily, and constantly.
roger
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jul, 2009 02:33 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Downhill
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jul, 2009 02:38 pm
@roger,
No, a smart actually can be faster but it's stopped/regulated not to do more (there are websites showing how you can easily get it faster).

And I have had the totally wrong price idea: a basic smart costs nearly exactly half of what you have to pay for a (basic) Focus. Here.



(And when they re-built the smartforfour cdi again ....)
0 Replies
 
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Thu 9 Jul, 2009 05:50 am
@farmerman,
My little Escape gets about 32 mpg and its an SUV. The underpowering is relative. Im used to unlimited "top ending" and having a car that needs a runny to get over 90 is somewhat of a negative. However, the mileage and reliability has been a dream. The sound system is also a nifty thing, it has a bass end that does not wind up buzzing like all other systems do. They developed an exceptional m ounting system for their speakers and the sound is damped so that the vibratuion doesnt carry but a few inches past the woofers.
0 Replies
 
chai2
 
  1  
Reply Thu 9 Jul, 2009 06:39 am
@Walter Hinteler,
Walter Hinteler wrote:

Not a lot more expensive than a Focus. Seats only two, isn't a racer but 85miles/h easily, and constantly.


The point is, why would you drive something that gets essentially the same mpg as a vehicle that has lots more storage space?

I know one way you'd significantly save gas with a Smart....

If you happen to have more than 1 friend, and you're all going somewhere together, you could say "uh...well, I only have room for 2, and there's 3 (or 4) of us....let's take your car.

100% gas savings for you.

or...
Hi, Larry? I have to go to Home Depot, and I'll never fit 10 bags of garden soil, and a dozen plants in my Smart car....can I borrow your Corolla?

Smart.....you have all sorts of excuses not not use the car for anything besides driving yourself to work, and once there, well, you can be expected to drive when 3 of you go out to lunch together, can you?
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Thu 9 Jul, 2009 07:15 am
@chai2,
The smart is a nice car for driving in town/cities, has enough space for normal shoppin. For two. As the name says.

I personally don't really like it. Design-wise, that is.


But small(er) cars .... I suppose, that's part of the European "culture" versus the USA. We always had and have (generally) driven smaller cars.


(Besides that, I wonder if ever anyone buys here 10 bags of garden soil: you rent a hanger and get double of that amount for 1/10 of the price from the local composting works.)
old europe
 
  1  
Reply Thu 9 Jul, 2009 08:08 am
@chai2,
chai2 wrote:
The point is, why would you drive something that gets essentially the same mpg as a vehicle that has lots more storage space?


Here's one reason I can think of:

http://imgur.com/yGZPk.jpg
0 Replies
 
chai2
 
  1  
Reply Thu 9 Jul, 2009 08:50 am
@Walter Hinteler,
Walter Hinteler wrote:

The smart is a nice car for driving in town/cities, has enough space for normal shoppin. For two. As the name says.

I personally don't really like it. Design-wise, that is.


But small(er) cars .... I suppose, that's part of the European "culture" versus the USA. We always had and have (generally) driven smaller cars.


(Besides that, I wonder if ever anyone buys here 10 bags of garden soil: you rent a hanger and get double of that amount for 1/10 of the price from the local composting works.)


Are you being thick on purpose Walter?

I'm saying it doesn't have room for "normal" shopping.

Perhaps it's the language barrier, but 10 bags of garden soil, 10 bags of mulch, etc. would be a pretty typical load if you planning mulching for the season.

Think of all the items you regularly put in your car....a large picture frame, gardening stuff, more than 2 people, anything that is more than 4 feet long and 1 foot wide.

Look at this photo....special suitcases made to fit the dimensions of the storage area.

Can anyone honestly say that is all the room you would need to get around this world?
If I was going on a picnic with someone, I'd be able to get a small picnic basket, and a blanket in there. No room for even a lawn chair or 2. You'd be able to get a bathing suit, towel and book in there for going to the beach, but forget maybe a beach umbrella, some recreational stuff, or again, a 3rd person.

Oh sure, parking in the city. That's pretty much a BS sales tactic. Sure, going in the city you may have to spend some time looking for a space, but don't act like it's every time you need to park. People who drive their cars in the city buy things larger than 4' by 1' too.

I don't care for large vehicles, I think the majority of people who drive SUV's don't need them. But, as humans who live commuting lives, we need more space than 2 medium size suitcases. It's just the opposite of how they try to sell SUV's by convincing you that you regularly transport entire soccer teams and their equipment.

This vehicle is just silly to one extreme, because some people can't figure out there's a middle ground.

It costs about the same (no one is going to buy the striped down model, please) doesn't get great mileage, and is fairly useless as far as utility.

http://www.smartsrus.com/images/parts/roadsterbag.jpg
old europe
 
  1  
Reply Thu 9 Jul, 2009 09:30 am
@chai2,
Cultural differences. Most European cities were built centuries ago, for carriages, horsemen and pedestrians, often with small, one-lane roads. Most American cities were built around the car, often with six-lane roads running through the center of the city. In America, you can drive through entire neighborhoods without seeing a sidewalk. In Europe, you can walk through entire inner cities without seeing a car. If you need groceries in Europe, there's often a small store within walking distance. If you need groceries in the States, you often have to drive for miles to some huge mall built in the middle of nowhere.

Not saying that one or the other is better, but it does explain why there's a wide range of people in Europe who would prefer buying a high-quality, small car over getting a cheaper, bigger one. And I don't think it has to do with mileage. It's more about brand and image, and European automakers are marketing those small cars as accordingly. In some cases, the marketing campaigns have even created a market in the United States. See the BMW Mini or the Volkswagen New Beetle. Small cars, and sold pretty much like Apple iPods: expensive, small, high-quality.
chai2
 
  1  
Reply Thu 9 Jul, 2009 10:34 am
@old europe,
BMW minis and VW beetles have storage space comparable to my Toyota Corolla.

You somehow missed the point that I drive a small car, small as any average small car in Europe.
We have cities in the United States. People walk to get their daily needs met.

The smart car is not large enough to do even that.

It's becoming more and more apparent it's just a status symbol...."look how green I am" It's the flavor of the moment.

A little Spider sports car has more storage space.

It's simply not a practical car to meet everyday needs for people....in ANY country.

I'd like to see a Smart car trying to get to a ski resort for the weekend with ski's, ski suits, ski boots, not to mention an extra pair of jeans and a change of underwear.

The only world the this car would be practical in is one where there is seldom if ever an open parking space, one never purchases anything larger than a suitcase, only has one friend, is never asked to run an errand for work where they have to pick up some boxes, never pick up people from the airport who have more than a couple small bags (or pick up more than one person), who only meet people at their destination, never accumulate any miscellaneous stuff, even temporarily, in our car (we all do that, don't say you don't), don't ever go anywhere with more than 1 (small) pet in their car, etc. etc.

you're picking needles out of a haystack with pluses for the Smart car, when I'm looking at all the hay that can't be carried.
Rockhead
 
  1  
Reply Thu 9 Jul, 2009 10:37 am
"expensive, small, high-quality. "

new beetle. 2 out of 3 ain't bad... Sad
old europe
 
  1  
Reply Thu 9 Jul, 2009 10:48 am
@chai2,
I didn't miss that you drive a small car. The point I was trying to make was simply that on average, people drive smaller cars in Europe than in the United States. It's easier to market an even smaller car to an audience that is used to cars that are smaller than to an audience that is used to seeing SUVs and Hummers everywhere.

I certainly agree that the Smart is marketed as a status symbol. That's pretty much what I was trying to say - even though I disagree that fuel economy is the key value for the marketing campaigns; it's really just the small size that makes it stand out, and that the marketing campaigns focus on.
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Thu 9 Jul, 2009 10:55 am
@old europe,
old europe wrote:

I certainly agree that the Smart is marketed as a status symbol. That's pretty much what I was trying to say - even though I disagree that fuel economy is the key value for the marketing campaigns; it's really just the small size that makes it stand out, and that the marketing campaigns focus on.


Ditto. I can't recall that Daimler/smart made adverts related to mileage, at least not primarily like other brands producing small cars.
0 Replies
 
roger
 
  1  
Reply Thu 9 Jul, 2009 02:44 pm
@Rockhead,
As Kieth Bontrager said of bicycles: light, strong, cheap - pick any two.

Maybe it was Greg LeMond that said that.
0 Replies
 
gungasnake
 
  1  
Reply Thu 9 Jul, 2009 06:01 pm
@old europe,
Quote:
Cultural differences. Most European cities were built centuries ago, for carriages, horsemen and pedestrians, often with small, one-lane roads.


That's what I see as the biggest difference. America simply doesn't have any medieval cities and the old cities we do have, have streets wide enough for cars. Baltimore still has hitching rings for horses on many streets...
0 Replies
 
 

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