Gary Slusser
 
  1  
Reply Fri 12 Dec, 2008 10:20 pm
@richierich,
I suggest you mix the solution every two weeks instead of 4. That will help to provide a stronger solution. Then increase the dose some after noting what it is now. And see how that works. I you present solution is two weeks or older, Id dump it and mix new as above. Use water for 2-3 days and then put the filter into backwash and when you have a good flow of water through the drain line, unplug the control valve for 15 minutes, then plug it in and let it finish on its own. You should set the time correctly when the valve is back in the Service position. The Rinse is the last position and then you can rotate the knob back to Service. If you don't, it will usually take three hours from the time you start the backwash plus the 15 minutes you had it unplugged.

It sounds as if your carbon is loaded with rust and if you have regular carbon, it probably will have to be replaced but, the filter may be too small and it is probably using the wrong type of carbon.

I believe you have a Fleck control valve, probably a 5600 12 day backwash only version.

0 Replies
 
H2O MAN
 
  1  
Reply Sat 13 Dec, 2008 09:06 am
@richierich,
richierich wrote:

The water comes from the well. The feeder line from chlorine pump goes into line. The line then goes into Amtrol retention Tank (size unsure). It says model 282, but, I can't find that on the website. It is six feet tall and 40 inches around. I believe it is 120 gallon. The carbon tank has nothing on it. It has Lasco on the inlet and outlet but, it is generic on the outside. Underneath the timer it has Brookfield, WI. It backwashes everynight at 1am. There are three of us in the house. We tend to use a lot of water. We have a washer, a dishwasher and a child on the way. The discoloration has always been there. It seems mostly when the we have used a lot of water.

Any help is appreciated


Again... it will not work until you correct the low Ph with a back washing acid neutralizer.
Also, as I mentioned before... your carbon filter is probably due for new GAC.
Both the Acid Neutralizer and the GAC filter should be 10x54 tanks with filter valves that backwash automatically.

The strength of your solution is of no consequence if the Ph is not elevated.
Gary Slusser
 
  -1  
Reply Sat 13 Dec, 2008 01:22 pm
@H2O MAN,
Obviously you aren't aware of the fact that when you chlorinate water, it raises the ph somewhat but, he can also use soda ash in the feeder to raise the pH higher if needed after raising the solution strength and dose volume. Richierrich, it's worth a try unless you want to replace the solution feeder with an inline pellet chlorinator.

Also h20man, you don't know how to correctly size equipment. You can't size until you know the peak demand gpm the equipment must treat. Any carbon or other media manufacturers' spec sheet will tell you the SFR of a cubic foot of their product, check it out and then find out what his peak demand gpm is.
H2O MAN
 
  -1  
Reply Sat 13 Dec, 2008 03:30 pm
@Gary Slusser,


Slusser, it is clear that you are out of touch and that you really don't know
how to specify and install the correct equipment to treat problem water.

You are in over your head here and it's obvious that you are only minimally equipped
to blindly sell cheap water softeners to the under educated online consumer.

RR, soda ash is not a reliable method of residential Ph correction - Slusser is setting you up for a fall.
Gary Slusser
 
  -1  
Reply Sun 14 Dec, 2008 04:48 pm
@H2O MAN,
I hear ya Kevin Young of Athens Water Athens Georgia AKA h20man...
H2O MAN
 
  -1  
Reply Sun 14 Dec, 2008 05:10 pm
@Gary Slusser,
It's Athenswater.company AKA H2O MAN...

Slusser, you should learn how to treat problem water before offering online advice.

Maybe you just need to get your hands dirty again and start installing and servicing H2O systems...
Gary Slusser
 
  0  
Reply Mon 15 Dec, 2008 07:11 pm
@H2O MAN,
People, so far Kevin Young, IIRC an ex Rainsoft installer for was it 18 years, of athenswater.com in Athens Georgia, has done nothing to help Richierrich but try to throw new equipment at his problem with his only 8 month old equipment.
H2O MAN
 
  0  
Reply Tue 16 Dec, 2008 03:07 pm
@Gary Slusser,


Slusser states that he has 21 years of experience, but he misses a no brainer, basic rule in water treatment.

This does not bode well for anyone that chooses to buy equipment or accept advice from him.

Treating part of the problem leaves part of the problem untreated - it's just that simple.
0 Replies
 
Andy CWS
 
  2  
Reply Wed 17 Dec, 2008 04:13 pm
@richierich,
richierich,

The discoloration can be caused by other factors. Without actually coming to you house or getting a sample of your water as I personally do for all of my customers, it is very difficult to determine what is causing the discoloration (or odor if you have any).

Have you tested for tannins? The equipment you have will do nothing for that problem. Is your plumbing very old? Galvnized?

We occasionally set up systems similar to yours with a few changes. We use an accelerator between the chem-pump and the retention tank. This helps mix the solution for better blending. Also, a test valve/port after the retention tank to test sample the water before it goes into the carbon filter.

I can't remember if you state how much sulfur in ppm your water has. Do you have that info?

We normally use H2O2 instead of bleach. Not sure if backwashing EVERY day is recommended but it may be necessary. If you are getting odor when you use 'lots of water' then your settings are up to it.

A dual or twin tank softener is what I would recommend.

You still have some hurdles to jump but more info would help.

Andy Christensen, CWS-II
Gary Slusser
 
  0  
Reply Mon 22 Dec, 2008 11:32 am
@Andy CWS,
Andy CWS wrote:
The discoloration can be caused by other factors. Without actually coming to you house or getting a sample of your water as I personally do for all of my customers, it is very difficult to determine what is causing the discoloration (or odor if you have any). ... Have you tested for tannins? The equipment you have will do nothing for that problem. Is your plumbing very old? Galvnized?

Really? Then why are you here?

Andy CWS wrote:
We occasionally set up systems similar to yours with a few changes. We use an accelerator between the chem-pump and the retention tank. This helps mix the solution for better blending.

But I see on another forum that you claim the same "accelerator" in my mixing tank can block up with rust.

Andy CWS wrote:
A dual or twin tank softener is what I would recommend.

You still have some hurdles to jump but more info would help.

Andy Christensen, CWS-II

Andy what hurdles, and obviously he doesn't have tannins but how does your accelerator or a twin tank softener, or Kevin Young's AN filter, help Richierich's 8 month old equipment solve this problem (note the equipment works most of the time): "I am on well water in FL. I am having a few problems with my water system. I currently have a chlorinator and a carbon tank. Water, at times is coming inside smelling like sulfur. Occaisionaly and sometime discolored."
0 Replies
 
H2O MAN
 
  1  
Reply Mon 22 Dec, 2008 12:25 pm


H2O MAN recommends that you install an Acid Neutralizer Cool
Andy CWS
 
  1  
Reply Mon 22 Dec, 2008 09:11 pm
@H2O MAN,
H2O MAN, ever notice how when you try to help someone, someone else just comes on to argue and only serves to drive the OP off the forum? Seen it before?

Oh well...
H2O MAN
 
  1  
Reply Tue 23 Dec, 2008 06:11 am
@Andy CWS,
Andy CWS wrote:

H2O MAN, ever notice how when you try to help someone, someone else just comes on to argue and only serves to drive the OP off the forum? Seen it before?

Oh well...


Yep, someone just comes on the 'net and helps people help themselves right off their own topic.

Totally self serving and no help at all...
0 Replies
 
John J CWS VI CI
 
  2  
Reply Sun 28 Dec, 2008 12:08 pm
You are in Florida. Chlorine only lasts a couple of months in the heat, perhaps 30 days in a hot shed. If your chlorine is depleted from the heat, it will not work.
The FIRST thing I would try before ripping everything out and starting over would be to try some new chlorine.
If the system worked once before, it might be something as simple as that. If that works, don't stockpile the chlorine. Store what you have in a cool place.

John
0 Replies
 
Joethewaterguy
 
  1  
Reply Wed 11 Mar, 2009 01:18 pm
@richierich,
I think that the biggest problem with the smell is that all the water coming into the "holding tank" isn't 100% treated. The injector should be before the "bladder tank" or a flow switch installed inline, so that the injection pump runs everytime that they use water. Think about it, depending on the size of his bladder/presure tank,they could run water for 10 minutes untreated, befure the pump kicks on. This would lower the chlorine level in the retention tank and allow untreated or partially treated water to the carbon, if it's a bacteria issue the carbon won't help out with the smell. It's a time thing. I've seen this problem a few times and the best solution was the injector before the bladder,that way all the water has chlorine in it. Moving the bladder close to the injector is the best option, if he has room. Storage shed outside with all the equiptment is nice. The flow switch works better that none, but touchy getting it right. Oh well good luck
Joe
Andy CWS
 
  1  
Reply Wed 11 Mar, 2009 09:04 pm
@Joethewaterguy,
I don't really care injecting chlorine before th pressure tank because the bleach can affect the rubber bladder in a negative way. Bleach will stay on that rubber virtually 100% of the time at rather high concentrations.

If the retention tank is of adequate size, there should be a thorough mixture. Should allow for a 20-minute contact tine.

Andy Christensen, CWS-II

H2O MAN
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Mar, 2009 08:10 am
@Andy CWS,
Andy CWS wrote:

I don't really care injecting chlorine before th pressure tank because the bleach can affect the rubber bladder in a negative way.
Bleach will stay on that rubber virtually 100% of the time at rather high concentrations.



I agree.
0 Replies
 
Andy CWS
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Mar, 2009 03:10 pm
A few weeks ago, I went on a call and found a system that did that. Yes, it took out the sulfur smell but the bladder in the tank was shot. It had to replace and then the system adapted so that wouldn't happen again. Left alone, the pump can also be overworked and fail.

If an installer want to do that, that's OK but just tell the owner of the consequences and let him decide.

Sodium hydroxide or some other chemicals won't have that effect.
Joethewaterguy
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 Mar, 2009 09:51 am
@Andy CWS,
like I said, there is two ways. the other option is the flow switch inline so that the chem feed pump is turning on when the well pump is on. this at least keeps the chlorine concentration consistant in the retention tank.
Joe
0 Replies
 
Gary Slusser
 
  1  
Reply Wed 18 Mar, 2009 10:13 am
@Andy CWS,
Andy CWS wrote:

A few weeks ago, I went on a call and found a system that did that. Yes, it took out the sulfur smell but the bladder in the tank was shot. It had to replace and then the system adapted so that wouldn't happen again. Left alone, the pump can also be overworked and fail.

I am against using a pressure tank as retention because they don't provide enough retention but really, how did you test the bladder to be able to prove your claim that it was shot because of chlorine?

And how is the pump "overworked" leading to failure because the pressure tank is used for retention?
 

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