H2O MAN
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 30 Oct, 2008 08:21 am
@Diest TKO,


Obama is selling the dumbmasses a widget.
He dresses it up and covers it with flowers, but it's still nothing more than a widget.
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Thu 30 Oct, 2008 08:28 am
I guess I have to hand it to either woiyo or H2O Man: The lower income limit for his tax increase has shifted down from $250,000 to $200,000.

Other than that, I'm 10 minutes into the clip, and like what I see so far.
old europe
 
  1  
Reply Thu 30 Oct, 2008 08:33 am
@Thomas,
Well, under the Obama plan there seems to be a bracket where the current tax rates virtually doesn't change at all.

Therefore, the statements "no tax raises if you're making less than $250,000" and "if you make less than $200,000, you'll get a tax cut" don't seem to be mutually exclusive, or reflect a change in policy.
H2O MAN
 
  0  
Reply Thu 30 Oct, 2008 08:56 am
@Thomas,
Thomas wrote:

I guess I have to hand it to either woiyo or H2O Man: The lower income limit for his tax increase has shifted down from $250,000 to $200,000.


Biden dropped it down to $150K...
blatham
 
  1  
Reply Thu 30 Oct, 2008 08:59 am
@Thomas,
Yes, it did.
0 Replies
 
old europe
 
  2  
Reply Thu 30 Oct, 2008 09:01 am
@H2O MAN,
Marc Ambinder noted the silliness of that claim recently:

Quote:
Stunning! Obama Changes Tax Plan Seven Days Out*

28 Oct 2008 01:10 pm

With an appreciable lead in national polls just a week before the election, Barack Obama has radically overhauled his middle class tax cut plan, dropping to $150,000 the cut off for those who'll see a tax cut. What's more, he did so on television in working-class Scranton using a native son, his vice president, Joe Biden.

Can you believe it? What chutzpah. What confidence! Said Biden:

Quote:
"Spreading the wealth was not--he was talking about is all of the tax breaks have gone to the very, very wealthy. For example you have right now, this year, under the old tax policy that was just - that was put in by George Bush, people making an average 1.4 million a year, good people, decent people, patriotic - they're going to get an $87 billion tax break. What we're saying is that $87 billion tax break doesn't need to go to people making an average of 1.4 million, it should go like it used to. It should go to middle class people -- people making under $150,000 a year."


What a gift to Republicans.

* = well, not exactly.

Well, the Obama campaign insists that its plan hasn't changed. Families making $250,000 or less will not see their taxes raised; families making less than $200,000 will see their taxes cut -- and some making more than that will -- depends on other factors, including your outstanding mortgage balance; individuals making less than $200,000 won't pay more and those making $150,000 will pay less.

This comports exactly with what Biden said today.

And it's pretty much what the Obama campaign has been saying all along... most every family making less than $250K would see a cut. None making less than that would see their taxes rise.

(In the second debate, Obama said: "If you make less than a quarter of a million dollars a year, you will not see a single dime of your taxes go up. If you make $200,000 a year or less, your taxes will go down.")

On Obama's tax cut website, I posed as the breadwinner for a family of four making $250,000 a year; I'm older than 65 and I pay child care expenditures. The result: no tax cut for me.

Then I inputed an annual salary of between $150,000 and $200,000 and said I had at least three dependents. My tax cut would be roughly $500.

One can question the wisdom of raising taxes (or letting the Bush tax cuts on the wealthy expire), but it's not accurate to say that Obama has changed his plan.
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  1  
Reply Thu 30 Oct, 2008 09:02 am
@old europe,
There's something at work here, OE. There's no way they'd be unaware this alteration would gain serious attention. But, hating numbers, I'll just wait to see how this sorts out.
0 Replies
 
nicole415
 
  2  
Reply Thu 30 Oct, 2008 09:11 am
@Thomas,
You misunderstood. Under 200k will get a tax cut. Over 250k will lose their Bush tax cut. Of course, these are generalities.

Obama's ad reached a lot of people on an emotional level, (those who possess emotions other than greed and hatred) it was a very powerful production and will sway undecided independents.

While Obama continues to project the image of a strong, calm leader able to take control in times of crisis, McCain continues to flail like a madman. As Bill Clinton pointed out, a US presidential campaign is the most brutal job interview imaginable and Obama has aced his while McCain failed horribly picking serial-liar Palin because he found her sexually appealing.
cjhsa
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 30 Oct, 2008 09:12 am
@H2O MAN,
I bought a widgit and a box of cigars for only three easy payments of $19.99....
0 Replies
 
H2O MAN
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 30 Oct, 2008 09:13 am
@nicole415,

Choosing a president based on how you connect with them on an emotional level is criminal.
cjhsa
 
  0  
Reply Thu 30 Oct, 2008 09:16 am
@H2O MAN,
Exactly. Kinda like hating hunters while you munch down on your double double from In-n-Out.
nicole415
 
  1  
Reply Thu 30 Oct, 2008 09:18 am
@nicole415,
For specifics go to:

http://www.barackobama.com/taxes/
0 Replies
 
Diest TKO
 
  0  
Reply Thu 30 Oct, 2008 09:21 am
@cjhsa,
Except they don't have to hunt the cattle... I think they use a club or one of those pneumatic pistons. They lay tarps down too I think.. It's all very "Good Fellas"...

T
K
O
H2O MAN
 
  -3  
Reply Thu 30 Oct, 2008 09:31 am
@Diest TKO,


It will be more "Broke Back Mountain" with Obama in charge.
0 Replies
 
Diest TKO
 
  1  
Reply Thu 30 Oct, 2008 09:49 am
More civil rights for the LGBT community would be a good thing.

T
K
O
cjhsa
 
  1  
Reply Thu 30 Oct, 2008 10:00 am
@Diest TKO,
They already have the same "civil rights" as everyone else. You have no right to get married in a church. You have no right to receive employer benefits.
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Thu 30 Oct, 2008 10:05 am
@cjhsa,
cjhsa wrote:

They already have the same "civil rights" as everyone else. You have no right to get married in a church. You have no right to receive employer benefits.


You have a right to be treated equally by our government, and gays and lesbians are discriminated against in several ways. I agree that there is no right to be married in any church.

Cycloptichorn
Linkat
 
  1  
Reply Thu 30 Oct, 2008 10:39 am
@Merry Andrew,
I'm anti - informcial too. Why waste a half hour when I can read about the policies - lots of this stuff is fluff.
Butrflynet
 
  1  
Reply Thu 30 Oct, 2008 12:15 pm
@Linkat,
So, have you read all about his policies on his website and read the stories about the struggles of American families he's met along the campaign trail?
DontTreadOnMe
 
  1  
Reply Thu 30 Oct, 2008 12:45 pm
@realjohnboy,
realjohnboy wrote:
Complacency is his worst enemy.


that's the biggest difference between dems and pubbies.

put a republican in a lion's den at 5am on election day and he will kill every lion in the pit with his bare teeth to get to the polling place.

obama's presidency is anything but a done deal.
 

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