Sex Offenders' Homes to Be Marked With Pumpkin Symbol

@Foxfyre,

WoW !
U put a lot of work into your research!

David

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Each time I look at this thread (I plan on not), it seems weirder and weirder, with resonance of Salem, mixed with cartoon... little pumpkins?

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A Nation of FEAR !!!!! wWWHHHOOOOOO

Keep the little terrors terrified, eh?

hey - I think all citizens who are likely to contribute to terrorizing children by making them afraid of just about everyone - should have a sign put in their window - 2 thick planks of wood should do it

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@ossobuco,

Quote:

Each time I look at this thread (I plan on not),
it seems weirder and weirder, with resonance of Salem,
mixed with cartoon... little pumpkins?

and scarlet letters

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@Endymion,

Quote:

A Nation of FEAR !!!!! wWWHHHOOOOOO

Keep the little terrors terrified, eh?

Yeah; that 's what Halloween is for.

Quote:

hey - I think all citizens who are likely to contribute to terrorizing
children by making them afraid of just about everyone -
should have a sign put in their window

Well, u have a right to think whatever u want
( I don 't know whether u need permission from your government
for that -- maybe a license ? )
but here, at least in theory, we have a free country.

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@Baldimo,

One problem I have with the old pumpkin sign and the sex offenders lists is that a large fraction of such people on the list are not and never had been a danger to children.

The young lady we are talking about in another thread who send a naked picture of herself to a boyfriend may end up of such a list for twenty years or so. Then we have cases of late teenage boys having had a sexual relationship with a mid age teenage girlfriend for example.

When we clean up those lists to deal with those who are a danger to children only then I will support marking homes year around if you wish to do so, but not as it stand now.

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@BillRM,

We seem to have lost Mr. Baldimo.

I hope that he has not been arrested
upon the basis of any accusations of sexual aberration,
however meritorious thay may or may not be.

David

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@BillRM,

I agree with you completely. There are people on a sex offender list that shouldn't be there and said as much in one of my first couple of posts. I mentioned a person caught peeing on a post being added to the list and should not be on the list. I do feel sorry for these people being on a sex offender list but that doesn't mean we should not notify neighborhoods about sex offenders living in their neighborhoods. A vast majority of people in a neighborhood are not going to show up at that person’s door with torches and pitch forks. I know we have at least 2 people in my neighborhood that are on a sex offenders and they seem to just live their lives. I don't know what they did to make the list but it’s nice to know they are listed.

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@Baldimo,

How about that pumpkin sticker, anyway? Isn't that kind of like putting up flowers to keep the bees away?

If I haven't posted before, I think the whole thing is wrong, for reasons already listed.

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@Thomas,

Thomas wrote:

Alright. I notice for the record that Foxfyre cannot name a single specific difference between the pumpkin and the burning cross.

Really? How about the simple fact that cross burning represents the targeting of the innocent by the guilty, while pumpkin postings identify the guilty for the benefit of the innocent? They are not even remotely similar.

As Roger pointed out earlier; anyone on Probation or Parole is essentially a ward of the state serving time in ultra-minimum security.

Personally, I think the "pumpkin" makes a poor marker. Both justice and child protection would be better served with a tombstone... with the child molester under it.

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@OCCOM BILL,

Contrary to Hawkeye's demented point of view; punishment in the United States does (or at least is supposed to) take the chances of recidivism into account.
Recidivism rates for these types of offenders present a clear and present danger to children. There is nothing unreasonable about giving the innocent a heads up.

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@OCCOM BILL,

There wouldn't be -- if you could give the innocent a heads-up without giving the wannabe vigilantes and lynchmobs a heads up, too. But you can't. And that's what's wrong with it.

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The principle incorporated in Megan's Law(s) however is this:

Quote:

Sex offenders pose a high risk of re-offending after release from custody;

Protecting the public from sex offenders is a primary governmental interest;

The privacy interests of persons convicted of sex offenses are less important than the government’’s interest in public safety;

And there is the principle that the innocent (parents and kids) should not be the ones inconvenienced in the process.

Again I do have sympathy for those caught in the system that pose no threat to anybody and I do hope we find a way to rectify those kinds of cases so they aren't lumped in with those who are likely to be a danger to others. But does the occasional miscarriage of justice justify putting kids at higher risk?

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@OCCOM BILL,

Occom Bill wrote:

Really? How about the simple fact that cross burning represents the targeting of the innocent by the guilty, while pumpkin postings identify the guilty for the benefit of the innocent? They are not even remotely similar.

1) It's for the alleged benefit of the innocent; neither you nor I know if it's a real benefit or not.

2) The common element of both is that people are being pilloried, with potentially lethal consequences. That makes them similar enough for me.

Occom Bill wrote:

As Roger pointed out earlier; anyone on Probation or Parole is essentially a ward of the state serving time in ultra-minimum security.

Yes. That's why I have backpedaled "a little bit", as I said in an earlier post. But just because chicanery is legal, that doesn't make it right. That's why I pedaled back just "a little bit".

Occom Bill wrote:

Personally, I think the "pumpkin" makes a poor marker. Both justice and child protection would be better served with a tombstone... with the child molester under it.

Apparently, many people agree with you. Some of them go one step farther, seek out sex offenders, and lynch them. And that's why I'm against this form of pillorying. See, I'm not just against child abuse -- I'm against pilloriers and lynch mobs, too. To each his own.

1 Reply

@Foxfyre,

Quote:

I do have sympathy for those caught in the system
that pose no threat to anybody and I do hope we find a way to rectify
those kinds of cases so they aren't lumped in
with those who are likely to be a danger to others

With the fullness of respect:
Are the rights of the citizens affected by the state of your emotions ?
( 5th, 8th,10th n 14th Amendments )

Quote:

does the occasional miscarriage of justice justify
putting kids at higher risk?

Does this mean that citizens who are innocent of crime
have a duty to get (jurisprudentially) sodomized,
in order to prevent children from being put at higher risk ?

Did there come a time when government was invested
with jurisdiction to miscarry justice ?
Will u indicate when n where this happened ?

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@Thomas,

Thomas wrote:

Occom Bill wrote:
Really? How about the simple fact that cross burning represents the targeting of the innocent by the guilty, while pumpkin postings identify the guilty for the benefit of the innocent? They are not even remotely similar.

1) It's for the alleged benefit of the innocent; neither you nor I know if it's a real benefit or not.

It doesn't take much imagination to see myself seeing such a marker and instructing my children to always steer clear of mister Jones. This is a benefit. Multiply that experience times 100,000 and I think you would be hard pressed to profess a belief that it wouldn’t make any difference in recidivism rates.

Thomas wrote:

Occom Bill wrote:
Personally, I think the "pumpkin" makes a poor marker. Both justice and child protection would be better served with a tombstone... with the child molester under it.

Apparently, many people agree with you. Some of them go one step farther, seek out sex offenders, and lynch them.

Do they? Can you show even one instance of this happening? Lots of us admire the Charley Bronson like characters, but I don't recall reading of even one such event. Child offender recidivism, on the other hand, takes place constantly. I can see no angle in which to consider the former more compelling than the latter.

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@OCCOM BILL,

Occom Bill wrote:

Do they? Can you show even one instance of this happening?

Yes they do. No, I can't show you an instance of it happening. But a friend of a friend of mine, who is in the sex offender registry and has reason to pay attention to these things, knows of dozens of such occurrences in his hometown. I have no reason to doubt his account. Believe it or not, he's an honest guy.

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@OCCOM BILL,

Quote:

Lots of us admire the Charley Bronson like characters,
but I don't recall reading of even one such event.

I admired his character in the movies.

I even bought the Death Wish videotape,
but u r twisting his character into something that it never was.

Bronson never went out with a gang to run down and round up bad guys
to string them up. He offered himself up as attractive bait.
He flashed cash, in bad areas of the city
and then let the criminals' nature take its course,
and he killed them only DEFENSIVELY, after thay had become violent.

That is different than a posse of vigilantes
chasing down suspected child molesters.

David

1 Reply

@OmSigDAVID,

So if someone sets up their child to get taken by one of these guys and then kills the child molester , that is ok? You know there are people out there crazy enough to do this right? Does that pass the david acceptence for getting rid of child molesters.

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child molesters are sick, the long term solution is to find out why and how child molesters are created, and create fewer of them. Punishing those who are already ill is of limited effectiveness. Perhaps we need to keep the ill away from the healthy, quarantine is sometimes necessary, but we should be honest about what we are doing. Those who favor a bullet to the head for child molesters (that would be Bill and David) need to be consistent, and call for biologically infected people to be treated the same way as mentally infected people.

1 Reply

Sex Offenders' Homes to Be Marked With Pumpkin Symbol

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