Sex Offenders' Homes to Be Marked With Pumpkin Symbol

@Foxfyre,

Foxfyre wrote:

Yup. The Constitution dictates that we shall be a people of laws. It is against the law to sexually molest or assualt children everywhere. And, given the high propensity of child sex offenders to be repeat offenders, any place with any decency protects children from exposure to that danger. If you have never been found guilty of molesting a child, then you have no problem whatsoever.

Indeed, the constitution does dictate that we shall be a nation of laws; that being the case each and every state has a legislature that writes/enacts those laws which prescribe the crimes and punishments. Should your personal views of law prevail over that which is in the statutes? I would suggest that if you are not satisfied with the statutes as they are, you should lobby/vote for legislators that will follow your preferences, at least that's how I read the constituion, perhaps you read it with your own interpretation.

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@dyslexia,

Dys, I'm not sure this argument cuts in your favor, because the pumpkin's inventor is a parole board. Unless you can show that the parole board exceeded it's rightful powers under Maryland law, we have to assume that it acted according to "the statutes as they are".

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@Foxfyre,

foxfyre said

Quote:

If you have EVER had first hand experience dealing with a child who has been brutalized by a sex offender,

My entire career was in state child protection, I have dealt with 100's of children who were brutalized by sex offenders and yet this conversation is going on. Strange innit?

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My own experience is somewhat limited, but what little I've seen made me a fervent believer that it should never be assumed that a child is safe in the presence of a known child sex offender.

So Dys, share your expertise. Do you think child sex offenders should be able to be anonymous and take unrestricted part in Halloween night festivities?

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@Foxfyre,

Foxfyre wrote:

My own experience is somewhat limited, but what little I've seen made me a fervent believer that it should never be assumed that a child is safe in the presence of a known child sex offender.

So Dys, share your expertise. Do you think child sex offenders should be able to be anonymous and take unrestricted part in Halloween night festivities?

Personally I believe that constitutional supported law should be pursued that defends the rights of both children and perps that have completed their penalties, in other words, I believe in a nation of lawI also believe that anyone to wants a different penalty for child abuse should lobby for such changes, that's what I did.

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@Baldimo,

Baldimo wrote:

Why not mark their houses on a night when children are out and about looking for candy from neighbors? I'm not saying mark their houses full time. Now marking their faces so everyone they pass knows to keep away is something that while extreme is still something I support. Can you look at a child rapist and tell who they are? I know I can't so why not make them marked for what they have done. I'm about protecting the children screw these bastards and their right to privacy. If they wanted to keep any sense of privacy then they shouldn't have been raping children who are the true innocent among us.

You're about entirely missing the point of my post, which was to criticise your illogical and frankly stupid, at best, insinuation that Thomas was a supporter of child abuse because he was questioning the reasonableness of this pumpkin thing.

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@Thomas,

Thomas wrote:

Alright. I notice for the record that Foxfyre cannot name a single specific difference between the pumpkin and the burning cross.

That said, I need to back-pedal just a little bit because the specific ordinance Baldimo quoted is strictly limited to Halloween -- when lots of children do knock on lots of strangers' doors. That makes the ordinance a little bit more defensible than the cross-burning.

Although the highly public nature of Hallowe'en and the numbers of children out and about, presumably with parental supervision, even if at a distance, also likely renders it the time of year when stranger perpetrators are least likely to assault children.

Hell, the normal perpetrators, like stepfathers, fathers, grandfathers, uncles, friends' fathers and the local clergy might even let up that night.

Who knows?

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I find the pumpkin sign wrong. And creepy.

I see that it does no good except to point a finger at a person that has already paid for a crime that they may or may not have done.

Parents should be with their childern while trick or treating. A sex offender is not going to "get" the kids while they are being watched over.

Maryland already has a website where you can look to see where the sex offenders live in your neighborhood.
http://www.socem.info/
Also a sex offender is any sex offender, not just a child abuser. So people with any violent sex charge have to post these signs? That has nothing to do with protecting children in my mind.

I'm not on the side of sex offenders either. I have been up close and personal with child abuse.
But there are people who are wrongly accused, there are people who have served time for a crime, there are people who are rehabilated. And I do not believe they should be made to pay over and over again.

Saying child molesters should not be allowed to live in neighborhoods where there are children, is the same, in my mind, as saying murderers should not be allowed to live in neighborhoods with people.

1 Reply

@caribou,

Caribou wrote:

Quote:

Also a sex offender is any sex offender, not just a child abuser.

And there lies the rub. What about the 18 year old boy who was having sex with his 16 year old girlfried. The girl's mother brought the boy up on charges as being a rapist. The daughter tried to intervene, to let the court know that she was a willing participant, but the court wouldn't let her testify.

The real reason the mother accused the boy of rape was the fact that she hated Mexicans--the boy was Mexican. That was his crime. He is now branded as a sex offender and that label will be with him for the rest of his life.

This is such an impossible question. I know that pedophiles are seldom rehabilitated and, as a mother, I would love to find some way to keep them away from children, but labels tend to bring along violence and a self-righteous hatred that has been resonsible for innumerous murders of innocent victims.

There is no easy or moral answer to this one, but promoting hatred is not the way to go.

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@Thomas,

Keep in mind the principle that anyone on parole is essentially serving the balance of the sentence without confinement. That covers almost any action, including putting them back in prison without judicial process.

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@Baldimo,

How about SCARLET LETTERS ?

Maybe thay coud flash on and off ?

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Remember those exploitive psychologists or psychiatrists
who used drugs and hypnotism to inculcate false memories
into the minds of patients referred to them ?
False memories of parental rape of children ?

Then the psychologists had their patients sue their parents
to finance their professional treatment from the revenues
of sale of the parents' homes, but later some of the children
repudiated the accusations that the psychologists had put them up to ?

That woud be a good joke on those parents
to make them put up ignomineous signs like that.

Maybe make Mr. Baldimo put up a sign in front of his house
saying: " I rape children here. " regardless of whether or not he really does.

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@roger,

roger wrote:

Keep in mind the principle that anyone on parole is essentially serving the balance of the sentence without confinement. That covers almost any action, including putting them back in prison without judicial process.

Yes. The parole thing is why Ialready backpedaled somewhat. But only "somewhat", because I consider the pillory a fundamentally bad thing, and because I expect the benefit to trick-or-treating children to be minimal to nil.

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I still think the only benefit to this pumpkin thing is to excite the lynch mob mentality.

There are many free websites that allow you to look up your exact address and see listed, with photo and description of crime, the sex offenders in your neighborhood. You can get email alerts to when one moves in or out. You can even print out their info and keep it.

I agree that people should know when a perp is in their neighborhood, I just dont think this whole pumpkin thing is really worth it.

It is beginning to feel to me like a scare tactic of sorts as well. A scare tactic for the masses not the perps..

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Has it ever actually happened
that a child who was Trick or Treating
was abducted and dragged inside ?

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@OmSigDAVID,

the odds of that happening , due to the sheer number of people is yes.

B ut, i would think that the story would be splattered across the news stations (?)
By my personal memory alone ,which is no base for fact, my answer is no it has not happened 'in my area'...

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No matter what the judge or jury rules as valid punishment and restitution to society American feel free to punish sex offenders for life, under the excuse "we are protecting potential victims". A bedrock of western law is that we punish a man for what he does wrong, not for what we fear that he will do wrong. It is well past time for the Supremes to outlaw all societal behaviour such as this thread topic, on the grounds that it represents unusual punishment.

those who are under order to have no contact with kids can comply with the law by not answering the door, this public marking of sex offenders is done for reasons other than the claimed reasons.

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@shewolfnm,

Yes,
and what about people who are innocent
but have been intimidated into "copping a plea"
to a lesser offense, upon a promise of no jail time ?
Then thay end up on a sexual pervert list for ever.
Imagine how it 'd feel to be forced to hold yourself
out to the world as a twisted sexual predator, if u were innocent ?

Think about it:
some children have actually murdered their parents;
some children have actually murdered their teachers.
Can we conceive of the possibility
that children who are in a state of anger or indignation
over early bedtimes or refusal to adopt a dog,
or disagreements qua boyfriends/girlfriends
or insufficiently hi test grades or personality conflicts in school,
can perjure themselves in furtherance of their ire ?

Then the victim has to wear a scarlet letter for ever ?

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@shewolfnm,

Quote:

the odds of that happening,
due to the sheer number of people is yes.

I understand your reasoning.
Given an infinite number of monkeys with an infinite number of typewriters
and infinite time, one of them will eventually type out Shakespeare.

Quote:

But, i would think that the story would be splattered across the news stations (?)

Absolutely, it woud. Then there 'd be impassioned debate
as to whether his or her father and mother shoud be criminally prosecuted
for failing to watch him or her while he was Trick or Treating.

Quote:

By my personal memory alone, which is no base for fact,
my answer is no it has not happened 'in my area'...

I have never heard of such a thing.
If it ever happens, I predict that emotional voices will demand
laws against unsupervised Trick or Treating and this will be debated
in state legislatures.

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After doing some further research on this, I am agreeing with the notion that ALL sex offenders should not necessarily be restricted from normal activities on Halloween or other times. The 18 or 19-year-old who is busted for statutory rape with his 16-year-old girlfriend, for instance, is not likely to be a danger to anybody. There are certainly other cases with mitigating circumstances that should not eternally brand somebody with a scarlet letter.

I also could not locate a single case of sex offenders attacking or molesting a child on Halloween.

On the other hand, the high incidence of repeat offenders among those who prey on children cannot be ignored. Does anybody want a Catholic Priest convicted of serial child abuse to be returned to active duty with no restrictions? Does the Scout leader who molests the boys in his care get a free pass to go back to volunteer work with kids after he has served his jail time?

I am sympathizing with those who think the "No candy pumpkin signs" and such to be a bit much. I also am of the opinion that it should be the offender who is inconvenienced rather than parents and children who have committed no crime.

I believe every state in the union now has a version of Megan's law and it is not without merit. Perhaps a reasonable compromise that does not reward offenders and/or punish victims and potential victims can be obtained?

Why the fear is reasonable:

Quote:

It began with a frantic midnight call that her 16-year-old daughter was missing. Quickly, Erica Zvaifler was shoved rudely into the netherworld of sex offenders, a place where emotions often blot out reason.
Three days later, Zvaifler learned her only child was dead. On July 16, 2003, Marissa Mathy-Zvaifler was raped and strangled in the Sunshine Theater in Albuquerque, allegedly by a convicted sex offender released on probation and working as a theater custodian. The sensational case triggered public outrage and demands for reform, and sent politicians scrambling to deflect a hailstorm of criticism.
http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1P3-622633351.html

Chavez County New Mexico (video)
http://video.aol.com/video-detail/sex-offenders-under-restrictions-for-halloween-in-chaves-county/407408881

Megan’s Law

Quote:

Washington State’’s 1990 Community Protection Act included America’’s first law authorizing public notification when dangerous sex offenders are released into the community. However, it was the brutal 1994 rape and murder of seven-year-old Megan Kanka that prompted the public demand for broad based community notification. On May 17, 1996, President Clinton signed Megan's Law. Megan's Law requires the following two components:
Sex Offender Registration "" The 1994 Jacob Wetterling Act requires the States to register individuals convicted of sex crimes against children. Sex offender registration laws are necessary because:

Sex offenders pose a high risk of re-offending after release from custody;

Protecting the public from sex offenders is a primary governmental interest;

The privacy interests of persons convicted of sex offenses are less important than the government’’s interest in public safety;

Release of certain information about sex offenders to public agencies and the general public will assist in protecting the public safety.

Community Notification "" Megan’’s Law allows the States discretion to establish criteria for disclosure, but compels them to make private and personal information on registered sex offenders available to the public. Community notification:
Assists law enforcement in investigations;
Establishes legal grounds to hold known offenders;
Deters sex offenders from committing new offenses;
Offers citizens information they can use to protect children from victimization.
http://pajamasmedia.com/blog/obama-supporter-assaults-female-mccain-volunteer-in-new-york/

Just about every state has some version of the pumpkin sign ordinance, along with concerns involved, and resistance to the policies. A sampling:

Kansas

Quote:

Sex offenders are not supposed to pass out candy during Halloween, but as 49 News Reporter Gena Terlizzi explains, they have their own party to attend- whether they like it or not.
Several states have "no candy" laws that prevent registered sex offenders from participating in Halloween Activities.
It's not the law in Kansas, but parolees under the supervision of the Kansas Department of Corrections are expected to follow some guidelines on Halloween night: things like keeping the lights off, and not answering the door, or passing out candy to trick-or-treaters.
Members of the Topeka Parole Office are taking it a step further.
For the second year in a row, the group is gathering high risk sex offenders under their supervision for a "Big Harvest Concert" to keep them off the streets and away from your little ones.
http://www.ktka.com/news/2007/oct/26/sex_offenders_halloween_restrictions

Maryland

Quote:

Sex offenders in Maryland have begun receiving paper signs in the mail that read ““No candy at this residence,”” which they must post on their front doors or possibly face a parole violation. The signs began arriving last week in the mailboxes of the about 1,200 violent and child-sex offenders across Maryland. The signs were accompanied by a letter explaining they must stay at home, turn off outside lights and not answer the door on Halloween.
http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=28316

Las Vegas NV

Quote:

Authorities check up on the whereabouts of sex offenders every year on Halloween. But this year they started early launching "Operation Trick-or-Treat," and it has created some cause for concern.
Eyewitness News went to the part of town near Boulder Highway and East Tropicana, an area with some of the highest concentration of sex offenders in Las Vegas. In fact, at least 50 registered sex offenders live within a mile of that intersection.

The last few days all over the valley police have been checking up on sex offenders. However, what's really scary this Halloween, some of the worst of the worst have vanished.

When officers go knocking on Halloween night to make sure sex offenders are staying away from children things can get unnerving.
One registered sex offender wanted nothing to do with Parole and Probation and he ran during last year's Operation Scarecrow. Others are busted for breaking the rules. Candy and decorations are no-no's and lights must be out on a night of thrills and chills.
http://www.klas-tv.com/Global/story.asp?S=7283274

Missouri

Quote:

The American Civil Liberties Union has filed a lawsuit against Missouri authorities seeking relief on behalf of several registered sex offenders over certain restrictions new state law registration places on their Halloween activities.
The lawsuit challenges a statute that became effective in June requiring registered sex offenders to avoid all "Halloween-related contact" with children, stay inside their residence between 5 and 10:30 p.m. Oct. 31 and post a sign outside stating "no candy or treats at this residence."
http://www.semissourian.com/article/20081016/NEWS01/710169889/-1/news01

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Sex Offenders' Homes to Be Marked With Pumpkin Symbol

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