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[answered] Why is H20_MAN allowed to sh*t all over A2K?

 
 
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Sat 9 Aug, 2008 03:16 pm
DrewDad wrote:
hawkeye10 wrote:
What I don't understand is this; if there are no enforced community standards for behaviour and if technology will be used to ensure that there is no common experience of a2k, then the community ceases to exist....so what is a2k supposed to become?

Craven has always maintained that the community aspect is not the primary reason for the site.


Makes sense, given the name of the space ...able to know....

However, when we have a thread about what a2k means to the members what is mentioned is the community aspect as well as the wide range of viewpoints to be found here. And many people feel strongly enough about the community aspect to not only contact each other in real life but to also hold "get togethers".

it will be interesting to see if Craven is right that the new technology + non moderation = multible self made communities. I tend to think that lack of policing has as the end result of the criminals terrorizing all, that any new people who happen this way will get a whiff of the rampant personal attack that now goes on here and decide that this is not a good place to spend time. I thought that we (Americans) all wised up a few years back and realized that the price of no competent oversight of institutions is always disaster. We let state fail thinking that states were no longer needed only to have the failed states become havens for malcontents angling to bring down civilization. We freed up the US energy sector and the companies promply price gouged. We freed up the airline industry and the managers pandered to the stock holders and ran the industry into the ground. We freed up the financial sector and now look at what a mess we have. We freed up the retail market place and now we have no clue if our food is safe to eat or if the products are toxic. The internet, that alleged great leveler of inhibiting boundaries, is under constant attack by the criminals who try to use the boundary eliminating technology to assist them in theft or to otherwise cause harm... the protectors of the net are never more than a few steps ahead of those who are trying to destroy it.

the concept of "Self moderation" seems so archaic....like it belongs in the 1990's.
0 Replies
 
Craven de Kere
 
  1  
Reply Sat 9 Aug, 2008 03:16 pm
TTH wrote:
Craven de Kere wrote:
We have a policy against official public reprimands....
Oh really? What do you call this then?

"Edit (Moderator): URL Removed. Note: Jusme and hustlers are the same user, and along with other user accounts he is spamming the forum with his image sharing URLs."


Imperfection on the part of the moderators I guess. Timberland (RIP) used to do that a bit. The official policy is to post ONLY "Edit (Moderator): URL removed" verbatim. But I'm not going to pile on any of the few moderators I am fortunate to have over something small like that. I'm going to make tools so that mistakes are lessened (e.g. redaction will use automatic messages on the new site).

I'm sure there are a lot of examples of moderator imperfection, but I stand by their work both because they do a great job with few resources (a forum this size usually has a moderator population orders of magnitude above ours) and because I think they strive for a level of objectivity that I've never seen anyone reach. Sure, there are mistakes, but I have nothing bad to say about the moderators and am not going to feed public criticism of their jobs because that only makes their job harder and stretches their resources even thinner.

Anywho, I also don't want to feed an anti-member thread, so here's my first topic on the culture shifts. Please continue any community culture discussion there so that I can ignore the lynching part of this one.

http://www.able2know.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=120671
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High Seas
 
  1  
Reply Sat 9 Aug, 2008 03:17 pm
Craven de Kere wrote:
.......... it sometimes seems moderators die faster than we can replace them too these days..


Biased, hypocritical, ham-handed meddlers (and that distinctly excludes the4 late Kevin) might be allowed to resign - waiting for natural attrition to do its job seems far too slow in some cases Smile
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Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Sat 9 Aug, 2008 03:21 pm
caribou wrote:
Have I said, "Thanks, Craven!" lately?

Thanks, Craven!


Ditto
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Craven de Kere
 
  1  
Reply Sat 9 Aug, 2008 03:25 pm
Lash wrote:
I think we're damn lucky to have this place--I'm sure there are plenty of other members who feel the same way. I thank you sincerely for all you do to provide it, Craven. What a **** headache it must be sometimes.


Speaking for myself, I honestly dislike the appreciation as much as the criticism. The criticism doesn't bother me because of the critique, it bothers me because unless I spend time responding I am portrayed as not caring about the community. So for example this thread means I let it fester or I take time out of my vacation. I chose the latter because I do care about the community but obviously would have rather done other stuff like hang out with more friends with my time.

That is my choice, nobody made me miss seeing friends in San Diego to get online and participate here but that's the choice I tend to make and why I will sometimes seem frustrated with it. I'm frustrated with the demand on my time. I'd planned on addressing it all at my leisure but was faced with letting it fester if I didn't do so on the members terms.

So my basic qualm with this is that public criticism and complaints are a very strong demand on the site staff's time. Maybe we just didn't want to be on a2k this weekend. I sure don't since it's conflicting with my family life right now to be working.

And for me, the appreciation is the same. I feel bad ignoring it but also don't quite know what to say to it. I do this because I love doing it, and don't feel I deserve any appreciation for it. It's my job now.
0 Replies
 
Craven de Kere
 
  1  
Reply Sat 9 Aug, 2008 03:27 pm
High Seas wrote:
Craven de Kere wrote:
.......... it sometimes seems moderators die faster than we can replace them too these days..


Biased, hypocritical, ham-handed meddlers (and that distinctly excludes the4 late Kevin) might be allowed to resign - waiting for natural attrition to do its job seems far too slow in some cases Smile


That's a disgusting thing to say.
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High Seas
 
  1  
Reply Sat 9 Aug, 2008 03:29 pm
Kevin was a dear friend of mine.

You have obviously failed to understand the simple point I was making, Craven.
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Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Sat 9 Aug, 2008 03:31 pm
Craven de Kere wrote:
And for me, the appreciation is the same. I feel bad ignoring it but also don't quite know what to say to it. I do this because I love doing it, and don't feel I deserve any appreciation for it. It's my job now.


Don't feel bad ignoring it. Just ignore it. No need to reply. You are appreciated, and some just want to point that out every now and then.
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Sat 9 Aug, 2008 03:31 pm
High Seas wrote:
Kevin was a dear friend of mine.

You have obviously failed to understand the simple point I was making, Craven.


Then I did as well.
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snood
 
  1  
Reply Sat 9 Aug, 2008 03:36 pm
I understood what he meant.
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Craven de Kere
 
  1  
Reply Sat 9 Aug, 2008 03:37 pm
High Seas wrote:
Kevin was a dear friend of mine.

You have obviously failed to understand the simple point I was making, Craven.


Perhaps. It sounded to me like you were saying that there are "biased, hypocritical, ham-handed meddlers" for moderators that should be forced out because they don't die fast enough.

And days after a moderator death that's doubly disgusting of a comment.
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TTH
 
  1  
Reply Sat 9 Aug, 2008 03:38 pm
Well, I wasn't criticizing the moderators or their jobs. Only your statement and pointing out the fact that you don't even follow your own policy.
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Bi-Polar Bear
 
  1  
Reply Sat 9 Aug, 2008 03:42 pm
I like a2k and am glad to be here... i've been banned a couple of times and took my medicine.

like everywhere else in the cyber and the real world there are people here I really care for... people I can take or leave... and a small group I really dislike. There's an even tinier group I actually hate and would in real life as well.

I'm sure I'm not unique in this.

So let's just move along you looky lous.... no more to see here.
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Lash
 
  1  
Reply Sat 9 Aug, 2008 03:48 pm
Maybe Jes can kill this thread...
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OCCOM BILL
 
  1  
Reply Sat 9 Aug, 2008 03:52 pm
Mame wrote:
This thread is quite a surprise. We are grown ups here and shouldn't need moderating. If you don't like someone or what someone has written, scroll on by, click out, whatever. Why should banning take place? Those who write offensive things will be dealt with by the community, as it usually does.

Any suggestion that this community is being ruined by a few bad apples is ludicrous. It will only happen if we let it.

There are a few people here who break the TOS on a regular basis. Some of the language is downright foul and some of the sentiments really nasty and repugnant, leaving me shaking my head that someone would actually advertise themselves that way. All I can do is try to avoid them and their posts, but I don't think they are 'ruining' the community.


The problem with the 'we're grown ups who should be able to moderate ourselves like we do in the real world is that we're not in the real world. If the Water-Bigot busted in on EVERY single political conversation he encountered in the real world with the same dimwitted non-contributions, the retribution would be quick and compelling. Online, he seems to enjoy it. The rapist would be lucky to walk out with his teeth in his pocket, rather than leaving in the trunk of someone's car. Too many folks take advantage of their anonymity to wantonly offend in ways they could never get away with in person.

The result is some of our sweetest members hesitating to participate because A-holes like the rapist disgust them to their core each and every time they encounter them. Same with members like the pedophile who very well may use the site to identify like-minded sickos with whom he can trade heinous material. I don't pretend to have a vote, nor do I feel entitled to one. But, as a business man myself, I would never forfeit my right to refuse business to any person for any reason. Were I Craven; it would matter not at all that the rapist follows the TOS. His presence serves only to disgust decent people and encourage likeminded A-holes.

The United States is a country of Laws which often need to supersede the sensibilities of majorities. A2K as a privately owned entity does not. I respect Craven's integrity and I'm not suggesting Craven should pick and choose based on who he likes (hell, I might not even make such a cut), but when the worst scum mankind has to offer show up, and begin scaring off decent people, I see no good reason to keep them around. There is no shortage of hyper partisan non-contributors tolerated to prove this a tolerant community, without catering to misogynistic pieces of garbage and defenders of child porn. Banning the worst of the worst, if you do happen to become aware of them, doesn't require a lot of moderation, nor a clear cut policy. A sense of decency should suffice and in cases like the rapist; you would receive not one single solitary complaint.
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Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Sat 9 Aug, 2008 03:58 pm
I think this thread is far more valuable as a venue for making unwarranted crude remarks about the other people who post here. For example, anyone who has posted here for any length of time knows that O'Bill is a twit.
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Bi-Polar Bear
 
  1  
Reply Sat 9 Aug, 2008 03:59 pm
good dawg...have a treat and a belly rub...
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OCCOM BILL
 
  1  
Reply Sat 9 Aug, 2008 04:01 pm
Good one, Set! Laughing
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Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Sat 9 Aug, 2008 04:05 pm
Thanks, Kids . . .

Try the veal, it's really good tonight . . .

And don't forget to generously tip your servers . . .
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Craven de Kere
 
  1  
Reply Sat 9 Aug, 2008 05:50 pm
TTH wrote:
Well, I wasn't criticizing the moderators or their jobs. Only your statement and pointing out the fact that you don't even follow your own policy.


Given that I didn't do that edit, you aren't pointing out hypocrisy on my part, just the usual desire to be a pain in my ass on yours.
0 Replies
 
 

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