McCain lies

Obama is not qualified to be CIC so no matter what "visits" he makes, will not change the fact he has no/limited foreign policy experience and no/minimal experience regarding matters of defense.

Heres the most interesting part of this whole thing.

The Obama supporters are saying that Obama never planned to take the press with him.
They know this because Obama says so.
That still doesnt explain why Obama cancelled the visit.
If it was already planned into the trip, there was no reason for him to cancel it.If it was a spur of the moment thing, there was still no reason to cancel it.

But what strikes me as odd is the fact that the Obama devotees are saying that since Obama said it, it has to be true.
They totally discount the possibility that Obama is just covering his ass and that McCain may be correct.
After all, Obama is a politician and he isnt going to admit to anything that would make him look bad.

mysteryman wrote:

Heres the most interesting part of this whole thing.

The Obama supporters are saying that Obama never planned to take the press with him.
They know this because Obama says so.
That still doesnt explain why Obama cancelled the visit.
If it was already planned into the trip, there was no reason for him to cancel it.If it was a spur of the moment thing, there was still no reason to cancel it.

But what strikes me as odd is the fact that the Obama devotees are saying that since Obama said it, it has to be true.
They totally discount the possibility that Obama is just covering his ass and that McCain may be correct.
After all, Obama is a politician and he isnt going to admit to anything that would make him look bad.

I think the independent news reports by those such as Andrea Mitchell, which say that Obama never was going to take the press in the first place and the press wasn't given plans that they were going to go, have a bit more to do with it.

Cycloptichorn

Well, he gave a reason, but in order to accept it you would have to take his word for it. I think the bigger question is why does it matter that he canceled a trip?

The Obama campaign has denied that was the reason he called off the visit. In fact, there is no evidence that he planned to take anyone to the American hospital other than a military adviser, whose status as a campaign staff member sparked last-minute concern among Pentagon officials that the visit would be an improper political event. [..]

The plan was to go with his military aide, retired General Scott Gration. The Pentagon said Gration was off-limits because he had joined the campaign -- violating rules that it not be a political stop.

Of course he didn't....

MM, what makes you think Obama has any reason to lie on this non-issue?

I wonder if you guys have any clue how ridiculous you sound. Can't attack Obama on anything meaningful, so let's imply... that he doesn't support the troops! Yeah, that's what will get people to hate him!

Cycloptichorn

Later that night, after Obama gave a speech in Berlin, a campaign source spoke about the canceled stop on the condition of anonymity. The official said that the trip was canceled after the Pentagon informed a campaign official that the visit would be considered a campaign event.


Overnight, the Obama team issued two statements, one from senior campaign official Robert Gibbs and the other from retired Air Force Maj. Gen. J. Scott Gration, an Obama foreign policy adviser who was on the trip.

Gibbs's statement said the hospital visit, which had been on the internal schedule for several weeks, was canceled because Obama decided it would be inappropriate to go there as part of a trip paid for by his campaign. Gration said the Pentagon had told the campaign that the visit would be seen as a political trip.

He was told by the Pentagon that taking Gen. Gration would be wrong, because the military is supposed to be nonpolitical.
That does not mean that Obama couldnt go on his own.

And that is what I am wondering, why didnt he go on his own.

McCain's camp, accused in the New York Times and the Washington Post this morning of distorting Obama's canceled trip to a military hospital in German, seems to have backed off the core of the charge: That he canceled the trip because "the Pentagon wouldn't allow him to bring cameras."

"It does now seem that Barack Obama snubbed the troops for reasons other than a lack of photo-op potential," writes McCain blogger Michael Goldfarb this morning, contradicting his campaign's televised ads and his candidate's statements.

But as the media swings around to contradict McCain's story, the campaign is trying to stay on offense, blaming the press for the confusion:

When you don't know the facts about something, but present it as if you do, you are lying.

Cycloptichorn wrote:

When you don't know the facts about something, but present it as if you do, you are lying.

Wrong.

I'm not digging myself any deeper. I merely pointed out that you were wrong. Yet again.

Ticomaya wrote:

Cycloptichorn wrote:

When you don't know the facts about something, but present it as if you do, you are lying.

Wrong.

In what way?

Oh, I see - if you can say you believed it was true. That's crap. It's a construction carefully designed to allow anyone to lie at any time with no recourse. And you and other Republicans have been using it to excuse falsehoods uttered by your leaders for years.

You should be able to show which facts led you to that belief, though, and when asked, the McCain camp was unable to actually show any facts which would have led to that belief.

You are digging yourself in deeper, as I showed above, McCain has already admitted they were wrong, how much longer are you going to push this foolish bullshit?

McCain is a liar. His campaign is full of liars. They consciously lied on this issue for political gain, and it has now blown up in their faces, as the media actually called them on it for once.

Cycloptichorn

So then Obama is also a liar.
Remember, he stated as FACT that the surge wouldnt work.

I suspect you accuse the local weatherman of lying if he predicts rain and then fails to produce.

Cycloptichorn wrote:

Ticomaya wrote:

Cycloptichorn wrote:

When you don't know the facts about something, but present it as if you do, you are lying.

Wrong.

In what way?

Oh, I see - if you can say you believed it was true. That's crap. It's a construction carefully designed to allow anyone to lie at any time with no recourse. And you and other Republicans have been using it to excuse falsehoods uttered by your leaders for years.

You should be able to show which facts led you to that belief, though, and when asked, the McCain camp was unable to actually show any facts which would have led to that belief.

You are digging yourself in deeper, as I showed above, McCain has already admitted they were wrong, how much longer are you going to push this foolish bullshit?

McCain is a liar. His campaign is full of liars. They consciously lied on this issue for political gain, and it has now blown up in their faces, as the media actually called them on it for once.

Cycloptichorn

So then Obama is also a liar.
Remember, he stated as FACT that the surge wouldnt work.
He presented no evidence to support that, except to say thats what he believed.

So, using your own definition, Obama is also a liar.

Ticomaya wrote:

I'm not digging myself any deeper. I merely pointed out that you were wrong. Yet again.

You asserted it, but provided no evidence to back up your assertion. A meaningless thing to do. And generally a sign that you know your argument is hosed.

Cycloptichorn