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Women Aren't Very Bright --- Wash Post's Charlotte Allen

 
 
aidan
 
  1  
Reply Fri 7 Mar, 2008 04:48 pm
I don't know what's wrong with me - but I can see Pollitt's point too
This was my favorite part Laughing

Quote:
Oh, but I was forgetting driving, a crucial skill. Allen claims that the misogynist canard is true: thanks to their superior visuospatial abilities, men (although maybe not gay men?) are better drivers, with 5.1 accidents per million miles compared to women's 5.7. "The only good news," she adds, is that because they take fewer risks, women's accidents are only a third as likely to be fatal. That's a very interesting definition of ability behind the wheel: the better drivers are the ones who take more risks and are three times as likely to end up dead.


I also liked this part:

Quote:
Women read more than men, too, especially fiction, which men tend to avoid. (A story about things that didn't happen? How does that work?) Women even read fiction by men and about men, further evidence of their imaginative powers -- while men, if they do pick up a novel, make sure it's estrogen-free. Who's really the dim bulb, the woman who doesn't see the beauty of "Grand Theft Auto," or the man who thinks Tom Clancy is a great writer?


That's so TRUE!!! I have the most well-read and educated friend who says he can't see the point in reading fiction - any fiction- even great works of literature that are considered classics by almost every person on the planet. He asks me why that is pretty much all the I read, (aside from biography and history) and when I say, "I just like stories" he always snorts. I always thought it was because he was smarter than me - now I know it's because men have lesser imaginative powers (thanks to Katha Pollitt).


I'm confused at why everyone is taking it so seriously.

I truly thought Charlotte Allen was kidding in her piece in terms of the intelligence issue. So she was serious when she said she could just about add 2 plus 2 but didn't know what to do next ? That's just sad....Could she really believe all that stuff? And if she really does- how does that affect me adversely unless I let it?

I think if you have confidence in yourself as a woman - you can read stuff like Charlotte Allen's piece with a grain of salt. I found it interesting to hear what the popular feminine pasttimes are now- I had no idea Gray's Anatomy was that big of a deal...now I know.

So she thinks women are silly and stupid - I know I'm not. As far as I'm concerned that's the end of my concern with the matter.

It's all just opinion. I say let them have their opinions. How does it impact me unless I let it?
0 Replies
 
Slappy Doo Hoo
 
  1  
Reply Fri 7 Mar, 2008 05:03 pm
I don't read fiction either, however you definitely can't say I don't have an imagination. When I read a book, I prefer to learn something from it I can apply to my life, not "imagine" I met a lover on the beach. Women eat up romance novels, those aren't exactly intellectually stimulating. I understand works of fiction can be, but how can you say in general non-fiction books aren't?

You know, just to prove women can be really smart too, I'm going to get a sex change. Just kidding.
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Butrflynet
 
  1  
Reply Fri 7 Mar, 2008 05:07 pm
Must be why Playboy Magazine has been such an popular magazine for so many decades. Laughing :wink:
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ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Fri 7 Mar, 2008 05:10 pm
Yes, I can be bitchy, Aidan..Very Happy, and I know that isn't useful as a good argument.

Brava, Katha Pollitt. (thnx for link, BL).
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aidan
 
  1  
Reply Fri 7 Mar, 2008 05:14 pm
My smartest female friend DID get a sex change operation. I knew her from the age of five- she was my kindergarten buddy- while everyone else was making happy valentine's cards - she was busily making "happy groundhog day cards." I loved her.

She hung in there with all us silly girls until she was about 22 and then she made the change. But I think she was just as smart before as she was after....now that'd be an interesting study to do:

Perception of intelligence by gender using transgender people. When they were women, how smart were they judged to be- and after they become men- does the perception of their level of intelligence by other people change. Are they treated as if they're smarter as men or women? Fascinating.

I don't think reading anything makes anyone anyone more or less intelligent. I think it's all a matter of individual taste and should be left at that.
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aidan
 
  1  
Reply Fri 7 Mar, 2008 05:28 pm
I just reread what I wrote about reading. What I meant was that I don't think what you choose to read (in terms of fiction or nonfiction) means you are or are not intelligent.

Definitely, reading can increase your fund of knowledge and vocabulary- and yes, I can definitely see the argument that nonfiction plays more of a role in increasing your fund of general or technically specific knowledge about a subject than fiction does. I guess that's why I always felt a little sheepish about admitting I only read fiction around people who don't and seem really, really smart.
0 Replies
 
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Fri 7 Mar, 2008 05:39 pm
Fiction clues one in to the way the world works in other ways than non fiction does, and can provide additional pleasures in the sounds of the flowing words, the interplay of those word structures, and much imagery, not that that is news to one who appreciates fiction. Personally, I switch back and forth, considering neither mode to be the palate refresher. Does this mean...



My ex never read fiction, not that that was a matter of contention between us. He is a playwright, with a solid background in various classics. People kept giving him novels for christmas presents... but he reads in his adulthood for data.
0 Replies
 
Roxxxanne
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 Mar, 2008 05:41 am
blatham wrote:
aidan said
Quote:
Well, I still think her observations hold a kernel of truth. And I don't think truth is partisan or liberal or conservative.


It is the "kernal of truth" that catches us in so many of these arguments. The neoconservative notion that we ought to feel some moral obligation towards alleviating injustice or oppression in the world outside our borders (thus inside someone else's sovereign borders) tempts any of us with a moral conscience. The Bush administration notion that we'd be imprudent to avoid opening anyone's mail or electronic communications is equally compelling.

What we have to be alert to are the clods of bullshit that can surround that precious kernal.


One thing that conservative spin artists have mastered (and since the ends justifies the means, they have no problem doing it) is to take something that has a kernel of truth and spin it inot The Big Lie and something that easy to for even the dumbest of us to understand. e.g. Al Gore is a liar because

Al Gore


Quote:
Exhibit A is Al Gore. People eager to lie about him continue to portray him as a liar. First lie, that he claims to have "invented" the Internet. Second lie, that he claims to have "discovered" the pollution of Love Canal. Third lie, that he falsely claims to be the model for Oliver Barrett IV, hero of Love Story.

Gore never claimed that he "invented" the Internet, which implies that he engineered the technology. The invention occurred in the seventies and allowed scientists in the Defense Department to communicate with each other. In a March 1999 interview with Wolf Blitzer, Gore said, "During my service in the United States Congress, I took the initiative in creating the Internet."

Taken in context, the sentence, despite some initial ambiguity, means that as a congressman Gore promoted the system we enjoy today, not that he could patent the science, though that's how the quotation has been manipulated. Hence the disingenuous substitution of "inventing" for the actual language.

For a heady while we hoped that the Bush campaign would prove their man to be the champion of honesty and integrity that he pretends to be, especially for those looking for a squeaky clean new White House. A couple of weeks ago the campaign rejected a shoddy commercial showing Gore saying that Clinton never told a lie. Problem was that the clip showed an interview from 1994, long before Clinton ever heard of Monica Lewinsky.

To his credit, Bush scrapped the commercial before it aired. But as I write, his campaign is unloading a new commercial, featuring a sneer at the fragment from the Internet claim, again implying that Gore had nothing to do with the Internet's creation. At least they got the words right; it would be dangerous to doctor the tape.

But the real question is what, if anything, did Gore actually do to create the modern Internet? According to Vincent Cerf, a senior vice president with MCI Worldcom who's been called the Father of the Internet, "The Internet would not be where it is in the United States without the strong support given to it and related research areas by the Vice President in his current role and in his earlier role as Senator."

The inventor of the Mosaic Browser, Marc Andreesen, credits Gore with making his work possible. He received a federal grant through Gore's High Performance Computing Act. The University of Pennsylvania's Dave Ferber says that without Gore the Internet "would not be where it is today."

Joseph E. Traub, a computer science professor at Columbia University, claims that Gore "was perhaps the first political leader to grasp the importance of networking the country. Could we perhaps see an end to cheap shots from politicians and pundits about inventing the Internet?"

The Love Canal canard distorts a story Gore told to a high school class in Concord, New Hampshire. In answer to a question about how students could get involved in politics, Gore described a letter he'd received from a girl in West Tennessee while he was a congressman. Based on the girl's complaint about a poisoned well, he organized an investigation, which in turn led to other pollution sites, culminating in the expose of Love Canal. Referring to the well in Toone, Tennessee, Gore said, "That was the one you didn't hear of--but that was the one that started it all."

The media was quick to misquote the line as "I was the one that started it all." Seemingly dissatisfied with Gore's style, the Republican National Committee improved the line thus: "I was the one who started it all." When the Concord Monitor and the Boston Globe exposed what had really been said in that high school class, the New York Times, the Washington Post and U.S. News offered grudging corrections of their reportorial errors.

Some of the media's stars had rare fun with the idea that Al Gore was the kernel for Ryan O'Neal's most famous role; but no one seemed interested in finding out whether Gore was telling the truth or not. CNBC's Chris Matthews chortled. "It reminds me of Snoopy thinking he's the Red Baron." But in this case Snoopy really is the Red Baron. Erich Segal, author of Love Story, corroborated that Gore and his Harvard roommate, Tommy Lee Jones, were indeed the models for the story's main character.

Given that Gore was telling the truth, what's the issue? We have an odd bit of trivia of no relevance to the election--except to those liars who want to portray Gore as a liar.

All of these malicious whoppers have been exposed for over a year and have received pusillanimous apologies, often mean-spirited and grudging, from the so-called "liberal" press that promoted them. But like a corrupting disease the lies simply refuse to go away.



So, in these three examples, we see that there is a kernel of truth in all three of Gore's alleged lies. The fact is that most lies and untruths have some kernel of truth in them, but the end result is still a lie or an untruth.

Anyway, I am catching up on this thread, I never did see the threads that "were talked to death" BTW.

I spent the lasat day and a half trying to get out of Dallas during the weird winter storm, I finally made it back...
0 Replies
 
Roxxxanne
 
  1  
Reply Sat 8 Mar, 2008 06:02 am
blatham wrote:
Here's Katha Pollitt on Allen's piece...

Quote:

Dumb and Dumber: An Essay and Its Editors
The question is not why Charlotte Allen wrote her silly piece -- it's why The Post published it.

By Katha Pollitt
Friday, March 7, 2008; 6:30 AM

I've never watched Oprah Winfrey's show, bought a Celine Dion CD, read "Eat, Pray, Love," or fainted at an Obama rally, although he is my preferred candidate.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/03/06/AR20080

30603240.html



Great opinion piece, Bernie. Thanks for posting it. With Obama and Hillary, there has been a lot of talk about whether racism or misogynism is more acceptable in our culture. IMO, misogynism is a lot more prevalent acceptable. Imagine, if you will, if a balck person took all the negative steretypes and composed a comparable "tongue in cheek" piece about how stupid black people are. What chance would it have of being published ? in the Washington Post Well, of course you know the answer.

I will always remember that when the Civil Rights Act was being composed , the idea of protecting women's rights was first proposed by a Southern Congressman as A "poison pill" He joked that "well, if we give rights to blacks, we will have to give them to women too!"
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