Ruach, regarding your statement:
"Hobitbob, If you say this....."Your beliefs are based on errors. Why not merely try to live a moral life?" And you find it reasonable to say; what is your problem with me saying ......... " Why don't you try giving up mans intelligence, which is far below the standard of God.""
Given that God created man, are we to understand that He is responsible for the creation of sub-standard entities? This would seem to raise the compound question relating to the purpose of such a powerful Designer creating flawed beings. Conversely, if not intentional, how does this mistake reflect upon such an Intelligent Designer?
JM
JM, the flaw in your arguement is that you posit a god who created mankind as a given. Many of us do not. I see reliance on a creator as a crutch to avoid thinking.
You misunderstand his argument.
His argument is actually one that is not supportive of God.
I don't care if my preacher was gay...that's his personal business not mine.
As long as the preacher keeps it the private business of the preacher, all is cool by me, too .. its the prosyltizing that pisses me off.
Ain't met you before, IAN442 ... welcome, if somewhat belatedly, to Able2Know.
As long as it is between her/him and a consenting adult....
i am delighted to see that the self destruct mechanizm(*) is in place and 'functioning' as it should; now if i can just be patient................
[ * might have been made by General Motors!]
If we are speaking of clergy which is a Christian thing which goes by the Bible, then homosexual lifesyles are not acceptable in a clergy.
It would be like having an all boys club then saying why can't girls come in? Nothing except then it wouldn't be an all boy's club.
hobitbob wrote:JM, the flaw in your arguement is that you posit a god who created mankind as a given. Many of us do not. I see reliance on a creator as a crutch to avoid thinking.
Gee, that's strange, I see atheistism the same way.
Love
I try to look at the practical side of it. The church is one of the most family oriented organizations in our society. The people in authority should be good examples of family life.
No matter how you argue about homosexuals, they are not the norm in our society. They do not exhibit normal family behaviour and should not be a leader in a family oriented organization.
I don't believe this is discrimination in any way. A group of engineers would not allow a cook to lead them. A democratic committee would not want a republican leader.
Sure they have rights, the same as all of us. I have no problem with them. When I was in the typesetting business my plant was the only one in town that would set their newsletters. I respect all humans. But let's look at the practical side.
Love
Really, Lekatt? You see atheists as taking comfort in a belief in a no-God?
Lekatt, surely you jest when you say that:
"The church is one of the most family oriented organizations in our society.... No matter how you argue about homosexuals, they are not the norm in our society. They do not exhibit normal family behaviour and should not be a leader in a family oriented organization."
You must be excluding the Catholic church, since celebate men and women are also not the norm in our society. They do not exhibit normal family behavior. If that is so, you are confining your definition of the church to those of Protestants and Jews.
Notice, since you are concerned with statistical norms, how the votes in your survey have gone.
JLNobody wrote:Lekatt, surely you jest when you say that:
"The church is one of the most family oriented organizations in our society.... No matter how you argue about homosexuals, they are not the norm in our society. They do not exhibit normal family behaviour and should not be a leader in a family oriented organization."
You must be excluding the Catholic church, since celebate men and women are also not the norm in our society. They do not exhibit normal family behavior. If that is so, you are confining your definition of the church to those of Protestants and Jews.
Notice, since you are concerned with statistical norms, how the votes in your survey have gone.
On your first post I don't know what you mean or are talking about so I have no answer?
On the second you ask questions then answer them yourself so there is no need for a response from me since you have your answers.
Also I don't know what survey you are talking about, I mentioned none.
I am sorry, but you took the discussion far afield from what I spoke of so I can't help you.
Love
read the bible and find your answers
There is no christian without christ, and there is no Church without christians. Every christian believes in Jesus Christ and he hears God speak to him thorough the Bible - the inspired WORD of GOD. Now if all of you will kindly read your bible's, it is made very very CLEAR that God had constituted the family to be made up of a MAN and a WOMAN. Homosexuality is a curse upon our society and unless this decay is removed, GOD will not be WITH us or FOR us. My email ID is
[email protected] and I CHALLENGE any body out there to contradict me BASED on the BIBILE - which as a matter-of-fact is the guide book of any christian.
Thankyou and TRY to reply if you feel you've got the answer OR ELSE unsderstand that the GUILT that you feel is because "GAY" is GOD - ANGRY - with YOU......!!!!!!!
I would be very surprised if anyone takes you seriously. You are in the wrong century.
I challenge you, jasononline, to contradict, based on Peter Pan, that there are fairies.
it doesnt matter what century or time we live in, GOD's word does not change beacuse GOD does not change. DEAR FRIEND with all due respect, let me tell you; If you feel that the Bible is old fashioned and outdated for this century, THEN, please give me another solution to things that you see and hear like... killing small children, raping infants, man degrading to the level of having disgusting relationships with another man[which by-the-way, even animals do not do such dirty things] ...etc etc...the list continues...... the only change we see over the centuries, is in the methods being used for crime, but the basic priciple's of the BIBLE remain the same[like love,kindness,family{man&woman},eternal life with GOD]...... even if the whole world changes there are some things that dont..and that's... HEAVEN. HELL, and YOUr FURURE [ that depends on what you accept, if you what to rip the bible apart and live as a homo, then soory DEAR friend...you're losing out on GOD's promises for you...
jasononline wrote: ... having disgusting relationships with another man[which by-the-way, even animals do not do such dirty things] ...
That absurd and patently false assertion rather undermines the thrust of your argument. Stick to Leviticus and Paul ... your statement betrays broad misaprehension of biology, zoology, and natural history.
hello again ...for your kind information.. science has never been able to contradict any truth that the bible has proven.... and also if you will know... most scientific discoveries have olny proved the authenticity of the bible time and again... dear friend I dont understand why it is so difficult for people like you [with all due respect], to accept what the bible teaches... the bible does not demand something very hard.. it just tells you that GOD loves you no matter how hard life has been for you and it teaches US [mankind] to live a holy life, a life that bubbles out from a PURE heart, a GOOD consicence and a SINCERE faith...
dear friend WHY..WHY do you find it so difficult to love God [remember time is running out... evry man BORN will DIE one day, and I nor You nor anybody know his last moment... so why dont you trust in the HOLY God who loves you and spend you eternity with HIM........
