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seventh day adventists vs mormons

 
 
tinygiraffe
 
  1  
Reply Fri 9 Nov, 2007 03:40 am
Quote:
Chai, it is misleading because many, if not the majority of SDA's drink coffee. They don't drink alcohol.

I'm not certain what Mormons do/believe in relation to such.


mormons are forbidden to drink coffee, tea, and alcohol, or to use tobacco. the law refers to "hot drinks" but this was officially interpreted as referring to the above. cocoa is fine, because it contains none of the above. cola is also fine, although some mormons choose to abstain from caffiene even though it's not required of them.

anything with tea leaves is unacceptable, including green tea. i imagine that most mormons stay away from all tea, but if cocoa is okay, i imagine they can take some bits of fruit and boil it, as long as there are no tea leaves. although these things are forbidden, some mormons drink coffee or tea anyway. they can lose certain levels of official status for this.
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Fri 9 Nov, 2007 06:09 am
While in the Navy, I served with both a Mormon and a SDA. I lived with the Mormon's sister in law in his home for a time. The one time I went to a Mormon event with them was to a dance. We were made to quit doing the Twist. My friend would not touch coffe, alcohol, etc. But, when we headed out to Japan, he immediately found alcohol on board the ship. He stayed drunk, pretty much until we came home. That's no indictment of his fath, but an observation of his personal weakness.

My SDA friend remains a friend to this day. The one time I went with him to his church, I couldn't tell much difference in the sermon and procedings from most other churches I had been in. My friend is a dentist. He has a pilot's license and is building a plane from a kit. He goes motorcycle riding, too. We trade emails, but I haven't seen him since 1968.
0 Replies
 
acbandnerd
 
  1  
Reply Sat 10 Nov, 2007 07:40 pm
mormon vs sda
Mormons have the doctrine and covents of the church... which contains a bit of scurpture called the 'Words of Wisdom' whcih states that hot drinks are not for the belly... meaning hot tea and coffee... there is more to the words of wisdom than just that, but that covers the 'hot drinks' part i guess... if you want to know more about mormons you can ask me or visit lds.org, mormon.org
0 Replies
 
tinygiraffe
 
  1  
Reply Sun 11 Nov, 2007 05:46 am
Quote:
doctrine and covents


covenants. Wink http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doctrine_and_Covenants
0 Replies
 
mrcolj
 
  2  
Reply Tue 20 Nov, 2007 07:43 am
Just some quick reference points on coffee, since that's the only thing people seem to want to talk about about Mormons... Laughing :
  • The Wikipedia has a decent article on The Word of Wisdom.
  • Here is the full text from lds.org
  • Mormons aren't prevented from drinking caffeine, but again coffee, tea, and alcohol. And of course no drugs or smoking.
  • This does not include herbal tea, which most Mormons drink.
  • Some don't drink caffeinated sodas, but that's in the minority.
  • Oh, and the last thing which should be first, the majority of the Word of Wisdom contains positive prescriptions, not prohibitions. It's all about health, and talks about eating fruit as much as it talks about abstaining from bongs.
Second, in answer to your first question, some observations on doctrinal differences:
  • SDAs are pretty mainline protestants; they just believe that the Sabbath was never officially changed to Sunday. Most Christians believe that one of the fulfillments of Mosaic law at the death of Christ was the change of the day of worship.
  • This shows SDAs' Biblical literalism, their sola scriptura paradigm, who can't find the change of day literally stated in the New Testament, so won't bank on it. Mormons are fundamentally, at their core, not sola scriptura. They believe in revelation, in modern prophets (equal in gravitas therefore to Moses or Peter), and consequently that all canon is open; that God can give us more scripture and at times the earth has had scripture which we do not now have. That's the whole Book of Mormon thing--that while the Bible is a record of God's dealings with a small group of people in Israel, he would therefore logically have other records of other dealings with other people--it's just a matter of finding those records. That's a huge difference.
  • Sola scriptura also presupposes that God wants his church reverse engineered from reading the Bible. The problem is the New Testament was a post facto collection of church letters and was never written to even be a book let alone a church-building manual; so various religions choose to call its 1500 years later publication in its present 66-book form divine foresight. The LDS on the other hand say that man's role is to live righteously and to pray for direct revelation as to God's will, which is again, a huge huge difference. For Mormons, it's always about the internal journey.
  • For the same literalism, SDAs don't believe in ignoring the Old Testament like frankly most Christian religions do. Most Christian religions believe that all the requirements in the Old Testament were "fulfilled" (no longer necessary) after Christ--thus The New Testament (read: the new covenant.) Again, since what was no longer necessary and what was still necessary isn't overt, SDAs error on the side of safety and keep all the commandments. That means they believe the Ten Commandments are still the governing code of the universe. (Everyone else believes they're a neat ethics metaphor at this point.)
  • Size-wise, there are about an equal number of members of the Seventh Day Adventist Church as the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, but the SDA have splinter groups, so those 15ish million aren't all the same branch. That's why most charts have Mormons as the 3rd or 4th largest religion in the US, because everyone you would think would be higher is non-coagulated...
  • SDAs are Trinitarian, meaning they believe God, Jesus, and the Holy Ghost are one person with no physical form. Mormons believe they are 3 separate and tangible beings.
  • Like Jehovah's Witnesses, SDAs believe that only the righteous are resurrected spiritually, that spirits die unless resurrected. Mormons believe that spirits don't die and that everyone is physically resurrected--that everyone gets their body reunited with their spirit after death.
I'll stop now 'cause I've gotta' get to work, but really the bottom line is that Mormons and SDAs are no more connected than any other two Christian religions. Perhaps more academically similar are Seventh Day Adventists and Jehovah's Witnesses, since they're both sprung from biblical literalism.
vikorr
 
  1  
Reply Wed 21 Nov, 2007 06:56 am
Quote:
Like Jehovah's Witnesses, SDAs believe that only the righteous are resurrected spiritually, that spirits die unless resurrected. Mormons believe that spirits don't die and that everyone is physically resurrected--that everyone gets their body reunited with their spirit after death.


I read that as both the righteous and the (ahh evil lot?) a ressurected? What happens to the (evil bunch?)

Quote:
Perhaps more academically similar are Seventh Day Adventists and Jehovah's Witnesses, since they're both sprung from biblical literalism.


By the way, that was a really good post you did, though on this point, I would disagree. As you mentioned, SDA's are fairly maintstream, but rather stringent in their interpretation of the bible. I found JH's beliefs weren't all that mainstream. They for one believe they are the only ones going to heaven, and from their number will be chosen the leaders of the earth (the 144,000 if I remember right), and these people are chosen while they are alive (I found that rather hard to fathom). There was a whole lot of other differences but I don't recall them all now (it was many years back that I last asked).
tinygiraffe
 
  1  
Reply Wed 21 Nov, 2007 07:06 am
Quote:
They for one believe they are the only ones going to heaven,


i thought so too, but neo disputes this.

Quote:
There was a whole lot of other differences but I don't recall them all now (it was many years back that I last asked).


there's always watchtower online, but it can be tiring to page through.
0 Replies
 
lamy
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Oct, 2010 12:21 pm
@vikorr,
The "evil" bunch will be resurrected just as the righteous. Thanks to our Savior, Jesus Christ, we will all be resurrected. However, where WE CHOOSE to go after we are resurrected to spend eternity- that is where the separation between "good" and "evil" will happen.

There are three degrees of glory, and then there is Hell. The Celestial kingdom, where Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ dwell, is reserved for those who have been the most righteous. Then there is the telestial and terrestrial. Those who have been the most wicked on the earth, will dwell with Satan, in eternal misery and anguish.

I say, where we choose to go, because it is utlimately our choice. Even after we have died, we have the ability to repent and follow our Savior. It will be much harder to repent without our bodies (as that will not happen until after Jesus comes again) but we can repent even then. I find it hard to believe that after seeing our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ, face to face- that anyone could choose NOT to follow Him. But the option is still there.
vikorr
 
  0  
Reply Sat 6 Nov, 2010 07:32 pm
@lamy,
That's an interesting take, that doesn't seem to match what I recall of revelations and a heap of people being 'deceived' by Satan to attack the good (after the resurrection)
0 Replies
 
DD208
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Feb, 2011 05:38 pm
@lamy,
dont you think, if people can repent after they die, then why would they try to be good christians or mormons if they can repent after they die or have somebody get baptised for them. If I killed someone and wasnt sorry for it, how could somebody else get baptised for me after I die and save me if I dont want to be saved. thats not what the Lord said. Mormoms have awesome family values but the other things are pure satanic.
DD208
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Feb, 2011 05:49 pm
@tinygiraffe,
I was born and raised SDA. When I was 22yrs old I became Mormom to be with my wife. I was Mormom for about 1-2yrs. Then she decided to go to some SDA meetings. She was seeing the truth in the SDA church and the false that she has been taught in the LDS church. She now knows that she cannot be baptised for her mom or auntie to save them because thats there choice before they die. The Lord didnt say: go be sinners, then when you die have a loved one be baptised for you and your saved. That's trying to be God yourself and theres only one God. When I was going to through discussions with the LDS missionaries I was telling them everything they wanted to hear so I could help my wife get out of the LDS. I asked the Bishop" can I be baptised for someone that's already dead?" He said" Yes, who?" I was just curious to what he'd say and I'd never want to but I said"Hitler" He said "Oh no, you cant be baptised for him" He was telling who I can and cannot be baptised for. Now I already know that we can't save another person who's dead but I was just wanting a response out of him. And I believe that people out of every faith will be saved. Just because I'm SDA, that won't save me. God doesn't hold people accountable if you don't know. He's not a cruel God. He loves us all.
DD208
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Feb, 2011 06:07 pm
You can watch on-line Christianity vs Islam live. The SDA Church is doing a 10 day seminar and is recording it and putting it up on the web for others to watch that can't make it.
0 Replies
 
DD208
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Feb, 2011 06:11 pm
@tinygiraffe,
God didn't make three different Kingdoms of Heaven. Read your Bible and not the Book of Mormon!! And look up the history of the Masons and the traditions and practices of Mormonism. 100% similiar.
DD208
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Feb, 2011 06:11 pm
@tinygiraffe,
And Mormons are the number 1 investors in Coca Cola too.
0 Replies
 
DD208
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Feb, 2011 06:19 pm
@acthc,
SDA are christians. They believe in one God and Jesus Christ died for our sins and that He'll come in his 2nd coming and save the righteous. Mormons are founded upon Joseph Smith, a freemason. They believe more in the Book in Mormon then the Holy Bible. I used to be Mormon and urge people not to become LDS.
0 Replies
 
DD208
 
  1  
Reply Sun 20 Feb, 2011 06:23 pm
@Chai,
Know what you're talking about before you post it. The SDA's have there own website. Just google SDA and you'll see it. SDA and LDS are completely different religions and people. For one the LDS think that they'll be saved after there so-called prophet is murdered and they have to get to Missouri somehow and that only LDS people are saved. SDA believe that anyone can be saved regardless of there religion or race. I say SDA is the way to go.
denlin
 
  1  
Reply Mon 23 May, 2011 10:34 am
@DD208,

I asked the Bishop" can I be baptised for someone that's already dead?" He said" Yes, who?" I was just curious to what he'd say and I'd never want to but I said"Hitler" He said "Oh no, you cant be baptised for him" He was telling who I can and cannot be baptised for.

URL: http://able2know.org/topic/94507-2

I think you might have misintrepreted the reasoning behind his denial of your request. It is not normal practice to do baptisms by proxy without the express permission of the recipients kin or one who has the express interests of the individual at heart. I'm fairly sure that he felt the intent behind your request was not for the benefit of the individual to be baptized but for your amusement.
0 Replies
 
humpty
 
  1  
Reply Mon 30 May, 2011 02:53 pm
@mrcolj,
This is what adventists believe in regard to the Godhead

I. Deity and Nature of Christ

Christ, the Word, the only begotten of God, was one with the eternal Father,--one in nature, in character, in purpose,--the only being that could enter into all the counsels and purposes of God. "His name shall be called Wonderful, Counselor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of peace" (Isa. 9:6). His "goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting" (Micah 5:2).--Patriarchs and Prophets, p. 34. {7ABC 437.2}

The world was made by him, "and without him was not anything made that was made." If Christ made all things, he existed before all things. The words spoken in regard to this are so decisive that no one need be left in doubt. Christ was God essentially, and in the highest sense. He was with God from all eternity, God over all, blessed forevermore. . . . {7ABC 438.1}


There are three living persons of the heavenly trio; in the name of these three great powers--the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit--those who receive Christ by living faith are baptized, and these powers will co-operate with the obedient subjects of heaven in their efforts to live the new life in Christ.-- Evangelism, p. 615. {7ABC 441.9} RCH
happylds
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Jul, 2011 09:56 am
@DD208,
Latter Day Saints believe one of the greatest gifts we were given is "free agency". We are all free to choose the choices we make - in our premortal existence, in this earth life and in the spirit world where we dwell after we die. Therefore, baptism for those who have already died enables a person to choose to follow Jesus or not - whether alive on this earth or as a spirit after we die, we can still make the choice of where we want to spend eternity. Our personal actions determine where we spend eternity.
Therefore, if someone died and was baptised by proxy, he was simply being given the chance to choose to follow Jesus - he is never forced to follow Jesus. Free agency allows us to choose our actions, and threrefore the conequences of our actions.
0 Replies
 
happylds
 
  0  
Reply Tue 19 Jul, 2011 10:11 am
@DD208,
tinygiraffe:
Please check again in the New Testament:
John 14:2
Jesus said, In my Father’s house are many mansions

1st Corinthians 15:40-41
There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the cterrestrial is another.

41There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars: for one star differeth from another star in glory.

2 Cor. 12:2
Paul was caught up to the third heaven

0 Replies
 
 

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