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Oz Election Thread #4 - Gillard's Labor

 
 
hingehead
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Aug, 2011 05:13 pm
@msolga,
Not really - she's always been pro gay marriage while acknowledging the party platform isn't. Yet. Should be an interesting ALP conf this year. Still trying to figure out if raising a child out of wedlock is worse than same sex parents in the wowser mentality.

The most intriguing bit of gossip was that Penny is a former lover/girlfriend of the SA premier in waiting.
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Aug, 2011 05:29 pm
@hingehead,
Boy, you certainly know lots of stuff, hinge!
More gossip, please! Razz

I recall, fairly early in the piece, when Labor had just formed government, that there was speculation about whether we could expect to see changes to the party's policy on same sex marriage. (a Liberal beat-up to discredit the new government) Julia declared that there would be no change to the existing policy. And Penny (no doubt under pressure) made a public statement saying that this was her position, too.
I recall feeling really sorry for her at the time. Clearly that was not what she actually believed.
Conscience vote on such issues, I say!
hingehead
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Aug, 2011 06:27 pm
@msolga,
Yeah, Julia has done that a few times on issues of conscience (asylum speakers springs to mind) perhaps thinking that she can win over Tony's heartland. It's not going to happen, but I guess it lowers the intensity of the vitriol coming out of shock jocks and their listeners.
hingehead
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Aug, 2011 06:29 pm
@msolga,
PS my gossip is all either from Q&A or Insiders. Rarely watch any other news or current affairs on telly. Thank FSM for A2K and Twitter hey?
0 Replies
 
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Aug, 2011 06:44 pm
@hingehead,
Oh I can fully understand where she was coming from, hinge! Especially really early in the piece.
Anything for a bit of (government) credibility & stability when Abbott & co where running around the place hysterically screaming "We wuz robbed!".
With the full support of the Murdoch media.
(while they ferociously attacked the greens & the independents at the same time.)

But .... sometimes, on the very important issues, it's important to stand your ground. Or a government could risk standing for very little & alienating it's own supporters.
I'm becoming a strong supporter of conscience votes, on issues like asylum seekers, same sex marriage, live animal exports, etc ....
For starters, I think the debates we'd hear in parliament would be a lot more real if members could speak openly about their real positions on such policies.
For seconds, there must be many members of the opposition (say nothing of the party in government) who have little opportunity to do much but rubber stamp policies that they don't actually believe in.
Thirdly, it would make parliament a damn sight more interesting! Smile
hingehead
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Aug, 2011 07:01 pm
@msolga,
Tom Ballard 0n Miranda Devine on Penny Wong

msolga
 
  2  
Reply Sun 14 Aug, 2011 07:19 pm
@hingehead,
Oh those poor, downtrodden married heterosexual couples, who must apologise humbly for their very existence! It's a gay plot & a conspiracy, I say! To make all of us gay! Smile

Does Miranda Devine actually write such stuff?
For some strange reason I don't read her column. Neutral Wink


... and if you believe what the polls tell you, here's Michelle Grattan's analysis of the latest findings:

Quote:
Labor freefall stops as Abbott loses ground:

LABOR has picked up support over the past month and Julia Gillard has substantially cut back Tony Abbott's lead as preferred PM, but the government would still be defeated in a landslide at an election held now.

http://www.theage.com.au/national/labor-freefall-stops-as-abbott-loses-ground-20110814-1it5a.html


0 Replies
 
hingehead
 
  1  
Reply Mon 15 Aug, 2011 10:05 pm
Greg Jericho most amusing tweeting from the crowd at the #noctrally at parliament today.

I am deeply concerned about the people who stridently proclaim that rising C02 is a good thing because makes the plants grow. To those people I say:

Please move to Venus and stop voting in our elections.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atmosphere_of_Venus
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Tue 16 Aug, 2011 02:05 am
@hingehead,
Amen to that, hinge.
Alan Jones hasn't explained it to them properly. Obviously. Rolling Eyes

Quote:
Opposition Leader Tony Abbott has addressed a large crowd of anti-carbon tax protesters outside Parliament House, telling them the carbon scheme is "based on a lie" and will not work.

But he avoided the embarrassment he suffered in March when his speech to a similar rally was in front of a placard reading, "JuLiar, Bob Brown's Bitch".

This time, organisers used a large banner reading "stop carbon lies" as a backdrop to the speakers.

In March, the Government accused the rally of being largely made up of "extremist" elements, including Pauline Hanson and her supporters, as well as far-right groups such as the League of Rights.

At today's rally Mr Abbott, who was greeted with chants of "Tony, Tony" as he took the stage, was quick to distance himself from some of the people and the placards in the gathering.

"I can see a lot of people I agree a very great deal with; I can see some people I don't agree with on everything," he said.

"I can see a lot of signs. Some signs I agree with; some signs I don't necessarily agree with.

"There are two things we all want to say today. First, we don't want a carbon tax. And second, we do want an election."

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2011-08-16/abbott-carbon-tax-rally/2841706

I'd say that that the "election" part of his address is what his participation in this event is all about. Meaning an early election. Which means he won't have to explain his "policies" on this issue & the rest in any detail at all .

For example, how can he support Qld farmers against the mining infringements on their properties, while supporting the miners at the same time? Confused

Once again I say: why don't our so-called political commentators apply the same scrutiny to the Lib's policies as they have to Labor's?

Why don't they demand details of the "lie" (according to Abbott) on which the government's carbon reduction policy is based? And how his party would address the problem better?

And if he does not believe we have a genuine problem here with carbon pollution, then ask him to spell out why, exactly, he holds such beliefs, against all the evidence?

I suspect there would be quite a few members of the Liberal Party, say nothing of quite a few Liberal parliamentarians, who would heave a sigh of relief if our political analysts actually did their job properly.

hingehead
 
  2  
Reply Tue 16 Aug, 2011 03:37 am
@msolga,
Just saw the footage. At least it gets them out of the house. They even fought with each other. Reminds me of a story on the Tea Party - a bunch of splinter groups who are 'angry about stuff' loosely cobbled together. I'd love to see an analysis of intelligence and general knowledge levels.

2GB got a cheer, but they claimed the media was supporting the ALP. All round weird bizarro universe.
0 Replies
 
hingehead
 
  2  
Reply Wed 17 Aug, 2011 10:29 pm
This is relevant to so many threads, but as it's an Australian invention let's start here!

http://media.crikey.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/WhyDontYouJustFactOff.jpg
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Aug, 2011 10:47 pm
@hingehead,
Quote:
This is relevant to so many threads, but as it's an Australian invention let's start here!

I hear you!
0 Replies
 
msolga
 
  3  
Reply Wed 17 Aug, 2011 10:54 pm
I wonder how Nicholson gets away with this sort of cartoon at the Australian?
(he's spot-on, mind! )
I've noticed that Leake's cartoons, which I used to love, have become more & more the Murdoch line.
Very sad to see.
And not at all funny or smart anymore.

http://resources3.news.com.au/images/2011/08/15/1226115/495491-110816-nicholson.jpg
hingehead
 
  3  
Reply Thu 18 Aug, 2011 07:13 am
@msolga,
That is so good. Polls as religion! Yeah baby!
0 Replies
 
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Thu 18 Aug, 2011 06:04 pm
What a weird state affairs.

The future of the Labor government could rest on the findings concerning "irregular spending" of one parliamentarian.


Quote:
Calls to brothel from MP's hotel room leaves Labor on a knife-edge
August 19, 2011/the AGE:

......Mr Thomson already faces allegations that his card was used to pay for escort services in Sydney, as well as to make more than $100,000 in cash withdrawals.

Mr Thomson has denied the allegation of irregular spending, which is still the subject of an investigation by Fair Work Australia.

Should Mr Thomson be forced to resign because of the ongoing controversy, the government would probably lose its parliamentary majority at a by-election.

Yesterday Prime Minister Julia Gillard faced another day of grilling about Mr Thomson's alleged past misuse of credit cards, making it clear that she would not force the embattled MP to account to parliament for his conduct .....


You'd think Abbott would take full advantage of this situation. A by-election might well deliver government to the Liberals.
But no ....


Quote:
Opposition Leader Tony Abbott declared that given the political stakes for the government, Mr Thomson was a ''protected species''. But he declined to say whether he would sack one of his own MPs if they faced similar allegations.

''The one thing I don't want to do is, you know, set myself up as a moral paragon because you never know what tests you might face, you just never know these things,'' the Opposition Leader said.


http://www.theage.com.au/national/calls-to-brothel-from-mps-hotel-room-leaves-labor-on-a-knifeedge-20110818-1j0j9.html
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Thu 18 Aug, 2011 06:36 pm
@msolga,
Comment from Michelle Grattan, from today's AGE:

Quote:
.....While the Coalition is stoking the fire under the Labor MP, Opposition Leader Tony Abbott is being very careful. He is refusing to say Thomson should be sacked. In these cases, best to personally stay on the high ground and leave the messier work to some of your troops. But the opposition knows the affair has caught media attention; it also looks to a Fair Work Australia investigation under way into the union's affairs.

The government (to say nothing of Thomson himself) will remain on tenterhooks. In these sorts of situations, especially where other people are involved, anything can happen at any time. Assuming, however, Thomson survives, what is Labor going to do about his preselection? An exquisite dilemma. If Labor dumps him for the next election, it would be, in effect, conceding he was not a fit candidate. But how could it run him again? That would be extraordinarily disdainful of the people of Dobell, who might have something very sharp to say about it.

Thomson should not be re-endorsed. And the Labor Party, as it weeps for the $90,000 plus it has had to shell out, should reflect on the very important lesson. The scandals that plagued the former NSW Labor government and the Thomson affair show the ALP in that state needs much better vetting procedures for its candidates. That is the least it owes to the voters.


http://www.theage.com.au/opinion/politics/propriety-second-to-survival-as-labor-backs-embattled-mp-20110818-1j01c.html
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Fri 19 Aug, 2011 08:12 am
@msolga,
Hoeing in with that kind issue usually means a similar sinner......at least one....is soon found from your own side.

Maybe Abbott himself?


Still.....where do they FIND these fuckwits?

Oh....in the community. figures.

msolga
 
  1  
Reply Fri 19 Aug, 2011 07:51 pm
@dlowan,
Where do they find them? Who knows, Deb? Confused Rolling Eyes
Maybe the NSW Right can explain that?
What he does in his own time is his business, of course, but I would be VERY pissed off if I was a paying member of any union he was an official of! What an incredible disrespect for the members he was supposed to be representing.
And now some unfortunate electorate is stuck with him as their local member.Poor them!
I absolutely loath this breed of ex-union career politicians who appear to be completely out of touch with anything but their own careers. No wonder the ALP is so out of touch with its traditional values ... say nothing of what used to be its tradition supporters.
Bring back politicians with fire in their bellies, a passion for social justice, I say ...
Now wouldn't that make a nice change?

As to why Abbott is not exploiting the situation in the hope of bringing on an early election ...
My hunch is that the Libs would be totally freaked, totally unprepared to form government so soon. For starters, they'd have to have a few real policies, would have to actually do something about the very things they criticise the government about. My hunch is that at this point in time they wouldn't have a clue, would be totally out of their depth & would would be a huge disappointment to their supporters. It's a big jump from ranting "no big tax!", or being totally destructive & negative, to actually governing.


msolga
 
  1  
Reply Fri 19 Aug, 2011 07:56 pm
@msolga,
Morning rant now over. Wink
0 Replies
 
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Fri 19 Aug, 2011 08:02 pm
@hingehead,
Wink

http://images.theage.com.au/2011/08/19/2567386/565540617-600x400.jpg

Go Greens!:

http://www.theage.com.au/opinion/politics/blogs/gengreens/let-conscience-rule-on-gay-marriage-20110801-1i7u6.html
 

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