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Jesus and the Stoners ?

 
 
patiodog
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Dec, 2006 01:23 pm
Quote:
Two thieves received a capital sentence and were executed, one on either side of Him as He was crucified.

He didn't stop either one from being executed.


Perhaps he was turning the other cheek.

Or perhaps he was busy dying himself.

Or perhaps he was really stoned and thought they were there for the tan.
0 Replies
 
real life
 
  1  
Reply Wed 20 Dec, 2006 07:56 pm
real life wrote:
hi Lash,

Thanks for your reply. I appreciate your willingness to discuss.

Two thieves received a capital sentence and were executed, one on either side of Him as He was crucified.

He didn't stop either one from being executed.

Why is one instance 'conclusive' , but the other (I assume you would say) is not?
Do you feel he was in a position to stop their executions?


Yes.

He said that He could at any time call upon God to send angels to deliver Himself from the cross, if He desired to do so.

Yes He could also have stopped the execution of the criminals, but He did not do so.

Is that conclusive?

If not, why not?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Lash wrote:
real life wrote:
Also , no answer regarding 'turning the other cheek'?


It strikes me as meaning not to kill people as retribution. What did it mean to you?


I agree that it certainly means that taking personal revenge is wrong.

Individuals do have the right of self defense.

If attacked, I may kill if need be during the attack to protect myself.

I am not required to 'turn the other cheek' and forego self defense.

I am not allowed to hunt down the individual later and attack him however.

Jesus teaching on 'turning the other cheek' does not address the issue of capital punishment by society however.
0 Replies
 
Raul-7
 
  1  
Reply Thu 21 Dec, 2006 02:28 am
What is that the only claim you (unbelievers) can use: turn the other cheek? The reason Jesus (PBUH) said that is to ignore those who were mocking the believers as they have always been doing so, thus a true believer does not engage in conflict with those who take religion as a game - rather they turn away as they know better not to stoop to the level of those who choose to follow Satan instead of God.

As for the punishments, these were ordained by God, thus Jesus (PBUH) had no right to decide when to use or not use them. There is no dispute with the Lord's command.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  1  
Reply Thu 21 Dec, 2006 02:11 pm
Why did he put a stop to the legally justifiable stoning of the adultress? In that instance we have his actual response to CP. Why do you reject his own response?
0 Replies
 
snood
 
  1  
Reply Thu 21 Dec, 2006 02:16 pm
Hey, Lash.
Where you been?

I've been getting allowed much too much latitude to spout my BS around here - you better hang around more...
0 Replies
 
real life
 
  1  
Reply Thu 21 Dec, 2006 07:23 pm
Lash wrote:
Why did he put a stop to the legally justifiable stoning of the adultress? In that instance we have his actual response to CP. Why do you reject his own response?


In the case of the thieves we have an actual response as well, do we not?

I have no quarrel with Christ's mercy in saving the woman.

I have often said that CP is society's right to protect itself from dangerous, criminal predators.

The woman obviously wouldn't fit that.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Dec, 2006 02:07 pm
If you are comfortable supporting CP, it serves to characterize you as you present yourself--so, you should continue. I don't see how anyone who purports to be a follower of the guy called Jesus in the bible can read what he is quoted as having said--and still say CP is a Christian tenet.

Just as I think those who supported CP had a hand in crucifying Jesus and others then, I think those who continue to feel as if they have the right to kill other people in cold blood continue a never-ending, ironic metaphorical crucifixion of him.

Carry on.

Hi, snood.

How do you like LA?
0 Replies
 
acepilot
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Dec, 2006 06:09 pm
I say let's cease all arguments and hug.

Life's about learning, but a lifetime spend trying to understand every reason for this life is well rough. SO! On the rough road we go...
0 Replies
 
snood
 
  1  
Reply Sun 24 Dec, 2006 03:38 am
Lash wrote:
If you are comfortable supporting CP, it serves to characterize you as you present yourself--so, you should continue. I don't see how anyone who purports to be a follower of the guy called Jesus in the bible can read what he is quoted as having said--and still say CP is a Christian tenet.

Just as I think those who supported CP had a hand in crucifying Jesus and others then, I think those who continue to feel as if they have the right to kill other people in cold blood continue a never-ending, ironic metaphorical crucifixion of him.

Carry on.

Hi, snood.

How do you like LA?


In a word, yuck. But I'm trying to keep an open mind...
You been busy with school, etc?
0 Replies
 
plainoldme
 
  1  
Reply Mon 25 Dec, 2006 06:27 pm
Lash wrote:
Why did he put a stop to the legally justifiable stoning of the adultress? In that instance we have his actual response to CP. Why do you reject his own response?


Would he have stopped the stoning of an adulterer?
0 Replies
 
sunlover
 
  1  
Reply Mon 25 Dec, 2006 07:01 pm
Religion has always been hypocritical and, probably, Jesus would be just as distusted today as with those ancient fundamentalists.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  1  
Reply Thu 4 Jan, 2007 04:47 pm
snood wrote:
Lash wrote:
If you are comfortable supporting CP, it serves to characterize you as you present yourself--so, you should continue. I don't see how anyone who purports to be a follower of the guy called Jesus in the bible can read what he is quoted as having said--and still say CP is a Christian tenet.

Just as I think those who supported CP had a hand in crucifying Jesus and others then, I think those who continue to feel as if they have the right to kill other people in cold blood continue a never-ending, ironic metaphorical crucifixion of him.

Carry on.

Hi, snood.

How do you like LA?


In a word, yuck. But I'm trying to keep an open mind...
You been busy with school, etc?

As the semester was winding down, I was working two jobs. I just had time to sleep (and not enough of that.) The new semester starts Monday.

Can you characterize your new locale? What size...? What don't you like about it?

POM--

It was the same patriarchal society. The adulterer was awarded a plaque and a bag of stones for the whore he was *******.
0 Replies
 
EpiNirvana
 
  1  
Reply Thu 4 Jan, 2007 05:03 pm
Re: Jesus and the Stoners ?
Mindonfire wrote:
Now, to challenge this hypocrisy and unequal justice, Jesus makes the now famous statement, "He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her."


This was never in the original bible, it was added much later because it was a parable told by the church to show the character of jesus. So this inst exactly the thing i would use to prove your point.
0 Replies
 
Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Sat 6 Jan, 2007 03:41 pm
Re: Jesus and the Stoners ?
EpiNirvana wrote:
Mindonfire wrote:
Now, to challenge this hypocrisy and unequal justice, Jesus makes the now famous statement, "He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her."


This was never in the original bible, it was added much later because it was a parable told by the church to show the character of jesus...


the "original bible" eh? you have access?
0 Replies
 
acepilot
 
  1  
Reply Sat 6 Jan, 2007 09:13 pm
Re: Jesus and the Stoners ?
Steve 41oo wrote:
EpiNirvana wrote:
Mindonfire wrote:
Now, to challenge this hypocrisy and unequal justice, Jesus makes the now famous statement, "He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her."


This was never in the original bible, it was added much later because it was a parable told by the church to show the character of jesus...


the "original bible" eh? you have access?



That's top secret info there...hush hush.
0 Replies
 
Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Jan, 2007 01:16 pm
Re: Jesus and the Stoners ?
acepilot wrote:
Steve 41oo wrote:
EpiNirvana wrote:
Mindonfire wrote:
Now, to challenge this hypocrisy and unequal justice, Jesus makes the now famous statement, "He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her."


This was never in the original bible, it was added much later because it was a parable told by the church to show the character of jesus...


the "original bible" eh? you have access?



That's top secret info there...hush hush.
it might be classified but its been kicking around for 2000 years, its about time the secret was out.
0 Replies
 
sunlover
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Jan, 2007 01:18 pm
Oh golly, oh gee, don't get the evangelists attacking the original Bible again!
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Jan, 2007 03:48 pm
It's ok, Epi. We've all said crazy **** before. Very Happy
0 Replies
 
Joe Nation
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Jan, 2007 04:49 pm
Most folks don't have the guts to believe Jesus when in the Sermon on the Mount in the Gospel of Matthew, He says:

"You have heard that it was said, 'An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth.' But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If someone strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also. And if someone wants to sue you and take your tunic, let him have your cloak as well. If someone forces you to go one mile, go with him two miles. Give to the one who asks you, and do not turn away from the one who wants to borrow from you." (Matthew 5:38-42, NIV)

A parallel version is offered in the Sermon on the Plain in the Gospel of Luke:

"But I say unto you which hear, Love your enemies, do good to them which hate you,"
"Bless them that curse you, and pray for them which despitefully use you. And unto him that smiteth thee on the one cheek offer also the other; and him that taketh away thy cloke forbid not to take thy coat also. Give to every man that asketh of thee; and of him that taketh away thy goods ask them not again. And as ye would that men should do to you, do ye also to them likewise." (Luke 6:28-31. King James Version)


But, but, sluputh slupth, they cry, he didn't really mean that and then they start blathering about self-defense. Jesus said what he said. He was a radical for love and his followers have turned his words into tissue paper.

Quote:
By 'turning the other cheek', did Jesus also oppose jail? Yes, we wouldn't need any.
By 'turning the other cheek', did Jesus also oppose fines? Yes. They wouldn't be needed.
By 'turning the other cheek', is He expecting us to simply ignore it when others do wrong? no. We are told to show love.

When you are assaulted? Yes
When you are raped? Yes
When you are kidnapped? Yes
When you are ripped off? Yes.
Just pretend it didn't happen? No, face life in love.


Any other response shows a lack of faith in what Jesus said. He didn't imply anything, his words are clear. We have allowed a bunch of half-measures to become Christianity to which my believing friends say "Well, we have to be realistic." and I say, "Where did Jesus say that? Next you'll telling me that he didn't really mean it when he said "If you want to be perfect, sell what you own. Give the money to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then follow me!"

Christianity, at least the one that Jesus described, is too tough. Folks ought to call themselves Semi-Christians or Pseudo-Christians or Pretty Much Most, But Not All of That Crazy Stuff Christians.

Joe(I don't believe Jesus was God, but I love him and his ideas.)Nation
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  1  
Reply Sun 7 Jan, 2007 04:54 pm
I love Joe and his ideas.
0 Replies
 
 

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