Empathy

I don't remember details on all this, so much, as a general sense that my husband became more empathetic to others over the decades from when I first knew him, until, well, I still know him even though we're exes and I think, whate're his faults or mine, he is fine with empathy... whereas, I remember being frankly surprised, sort of stunned, in the beginning years, off and on, by his lack of it. I didn't go around harping, that I remember, but I did explain my opinion sometimes.
He also had a bunch of empathy to begin with, not a blank slate. He might have grown in it without my comments, but I think they were contributory, seem to remember him saying so.
Alternately, if you have a basic stock of empathy, natural aging may give one a wider viewpoint, at least sometimes with some people.

On the driving thing, that would drive me nuts, but I haven't really had to deal with it.

Well, J_B, I always considered "empathy" to be something that a person really feels for another by virtue of having been in the same situation themselves. Sympathy is just feeling a degree of sorrow for another who has had a real problem, but one that an individual has not experienced.

This, opinion rules out pathological problems or a social behavior.

In the example given, I've found that pointing it out usually just leads to annoying the other, or giving more opening for spewing of the mouth. Some will even go so far as to do something stupid in defiance.
Bc - the wife in that case is being condenscending imo - trying to 'teach' .
A straight out 'stop screaming like a maniac, please. you're making me nervous' would be a little better route to go, i think.
He won't give a **** about the other driver, but he might give a **** about your feelings/comfort (i hope if he is your partner! lol).

I don't see the point of pointing out those things to a partner, and expecting any sort of change. You're basically doing it for your own sake. Any/most apologies or change of behavior after it being 'pointed out' are just to keep some peace, or get the other to shut up, or very temporary.

Seeing your partner getting hurt in some way by your actions, especially visibly, that can inspire some new levels of empathy if you love the person very much.
That silent 'taking it' can really scorch through the toughie layers at times.

Myself having moments and traits where my empathy could be much better, I feel like any negativity or 'calling' of the insensitivity is prone to activate defensive mechanisms easily. The 'i am being criticized and rejected' buttons can be touchy on those issues. Straight appeals to what i care about works better...

it's not necessarily brutishness, but sometimes it is.

total opinion.

I like to think of it simply.

When you feel empathy towards someone you understand their situation.

When you sympathize you just feel sorry for them.

But I don't know if I'm right.

Re: Empathy


I think we all can learn from each others finer qualities if we so choose.

I'm contributing a comment here because I empathize with Cyracus for being the only male in this thread. You have noticed the gender slant so far?
I like Dlowan's distinction between feeling FOR and feeling WITH. That seems to cut a fine and significant line between two concepts that seem almost synomyous.
But I think we should remember that sympathy and empathy are acts of imagination, not forms of mind-reading. G.B. Shaw once responded to his distorted version of the Golden Rule with: "Do not do unto others as you would have them do unto you; their tastes may be different".
German sociologists (esp. Max Weber) of the late 19th century had the notion of "verstehen" as a mode of social inquiry--to empathize with one's subjects as a way of understanding them. They were criticized for claiming mind-reading powers as a research methodology. But I think their point was that they use all kinds of "objective" modes of inquiry to ARRIVE AT a "subjective", or empathic, understanding for the emotional, conative and intellectual perspective of others. Empathy (verstehen) was an end not a means.
We might learn from this: To understand my wife I should ask, watch, and make inferences subject to test. This way I protect myself from the error of PRESUMPTION--as unsentimental as that may seem.

I don't know why that would seem unsentimental. It's the only way to understand someone, and therefore a necessity of being a respectful listener.

Thanks, Stuh. I agree.

I agree also. With both JL and stuh.

But in my experience, the process of making inferences subject to tests can often be seen as offensive, causing the counterpart to become very defensive. But then there is such a thing as rash inference. Jumping to conclusions. Maybe that's what I'm talking about.

Btw, I didn't notice the gender distribution on this thread at all JL. That issue kind of passes me by on this forum most of the time. Don't know why.

I always assumed JL was a woman because of the cat face

I've always assumed you were dead because of the skull

In a college "cognitive style" test a hundred years ago there was no real "grade" but a word that best described the testee. Mine was "empathy."

So, I would describe that word as meaning I am able to "see where a person is coming from," in that I, not exactly understand them, but can see, or understand fairly quickly, why they did what they just did, why they act they way they do, or speak the way they do most of the time. The result is that I do not judge. Very useful in my life's worth, whatever that was and is - doctor's assistant, RE sales, news reporter/photographer, volunteer caseworker, big sister.

Definitely, at least in me, this little ability was not learned. I don't think. But, I am part Native American, have Pieces in its own house, (just kidding). Definitely do step away from "keep it pithy."


_________________________
I believe that you can reach the point where there is no longer any difference between developing the habit of pretending to believe and developing the habit of believing.
...........Foucault's Pendulum, Umberto Eco

Empathy makes me sick

Ah, Steve. I can empathize with you. I have been sick for the past couple of days.

I've always assumed you were subject to a dark egyptian curse:

dont try and curry favour with me you ...you protoguru

[hope you're feeling better]

Stuh, I thank you for the complement; it is particularly pleasing given that I'm a recovering macho.

Stuh, I thank you for the complement; it is particularly pleasing given that I'm a recovering macho.

That would be a dark egyptian nurse. :wink: