Dutch Pedophile Party?

I suspect it's because they have a penchant for the "caboose."

How about the gondolas,
in the canals of Amsterdam ?

Snide remarks prove nothing. Just what is wrong with a person loving his "pet".? Those who are opposed to this kind of love are intolerant and hateful people who do not know what true love really is. Most pet lovers do not go from pet to pet but remain in love with their pet for years.

Only those who have not seen the beautiful play written by Edward Albee named "Who is Sylvia" or "The Goat" will laugh at man/beast love. America is filled with hate and haters. I am sure the Dutch are much more compassionate.

<blinks>

Is that really the first defence of bestiality on this board, or am I reading this wrong?

You are not reading it wrong. You may, of course, reference the great play by Albee, one of the United States' most brilliant playwrites, who wrote the astonishing play--"Who is Sylvia" or "The Goat"( Reviews of this play are available on the web).

Albee excoriates modern society for it heartlessness, its Puritanism, and its lack of compassion.


The plot is simple. A man falls hopelessly in love with his pet Goat, has carnal relations with the Goat which is brutally murdered by the man's wife at the end of the play.

The heart rending sobs of fhe chief actor,upon discovering that his "love" has been murdered is something no one will ever forget.

As the end notes to the play commented--What can we expect in a society in which it is forbidden to love our brothers and sisters, our children and our pets.

The play is nothing more and nothing less than a plea for brotherhood and love. If anyone has any problem with that, it is their difficulty, says Albee's commentator.

"Everything you always wanted to know about sex, but were afraid to ask" includes an episode in which a psychologist (played by Gene Wilder) falls in love with a sheep (played by a sheep).

Wasn't the legal age to marry in the US about 13 many years ago?

When did that change?

Did it change?

And why?

Mr. Dupre- According to Judge Richard A. Posner in his ground breaking book-"Sex and Reason", the Roman age of consent was 12!!

... as was in the USA (for females) until about mid-1800's. (I think, California was the first state to change the age of consent to 14.)

Hey, thanks for the facts.

Why did that age change?

To protect children from adult exploitation. Goats, too. Okay, different law-- but same principle.

I was an anthropology student in college.

Different cultures define "children" and "adults" at different ages.

Many cultures do allow sexual contact at ages that would seem too young or obscene by our standards.

Many cultures define / defined adulthood at 13 years of age.

Our "adolescent" period has no counterpart for many people.

And it is a particularly difficult time. An adult body with absolutely no priviledges.

I wonder if we are holding a whole group of people down for a period of time, and I wonder if the reason isn't economic.

I mean, if we ended compulsory education at 13 years of age, and those students could enter the workforce and have a home of their own, and have full legal rights, that'd be a lot of competition in the workforce, wouldn't it?

A lot of teachers and institutional education facilities would be out of work, too, wouldn't they?

If we educated better and faster, we could tap into this age group for some ROI.

I've just wondered about it for a long time.

It seems unnatural and perhaps unhealthy what we do to and require from our "adolescents."

You don't notice too many college males bringing guns to class.

There is a rage in the junior high and high school age group.

So ... something's not right.

Hey, I'm no anthropologist, but I doubt you'll solve any erstwhile adolescent rage if you allow 13 year olds to get sexually involved with predatory adults.

I realize what I'm saying is "unheard of."

Not every adult who engages in sex is predatory.

Your use of the word "teens" here seems a bit "ageist" to me.

Many cultures do see people from the age of 13 on as adults.

Why are we different?

Could it be economic?

Is it in the 13+ age group's best interest?

I have both dealt with and have personal knowledge of a number of victims of pedophilia and so would answer with an unqualifed "yes!"

It's at times like these when it is hardest to allow everybody the right of free speech and all. As for the question regarding sexual relations. All are fine by me, really, as long as they take place between People who mutually agree, without being forced, to having sexual intercourse. That agreement should take place between people who are declared legally capable of making their own decisions. Their sexual intercourse should, on a further note, not disturb any other party who did not agree to this relationship or had no vote in it.

So, as far as I can tell, this rules out by default bestiality and pedophilia, the latter because the kids are not legally capable of making their own decisions, and the beasts because they cannot agree, period.

Pedophiles are in my book akin to sexual predators, since they seek to satisfy their own needs by (ab)using a minor. I see no need for a party of pedophiles, but by our own laws they have the right to express their opinion and form a party, so I am not opposed to it. It will, however, never receive a vote from me... Ever.

Naj.

I think Dupre was just kinda thinking aloud...

I mean, I know thats unheard of here, you know - you're supposed to only post if you've got some trenchantly opinionated "point" to make, but ... perhaps better to not hack into someone for just asking questions / thinking aloud?

I also have a terminology-kind of question... What's the age of consent in the US? 16 or 18? In the UK it's 16, I'm pretty sure, cos there was this whole thing about the age of consent being higher for gay sex (18) than for straight sex (16) up till the 90s, there were campaigns and such... in Holland also, I suppose, I'm not really sure.

Anyway, 16 sounds logical to me. I am definitely in favour of legal protection of 14- and 15-year olds. But on the other hand, can someone who has sex with a 15-year old really be called a "pedophile"? That sounds off, to me ... Or does it depend on the age of the person? A 35-year old with a 15-year old is just creepy (but pedophile?). And an 18-year old with a 15-year old, you can hardly call a pedophile.. how's all this used / described?

Things are quite complicated there, and usually I'm all in favor of 'grey zones', since I think the law should be applied on a case by case basis, and never to the letter, more to the spirit.
However, for the good of all, be they kids or adults, I for one believe the law should be crystal clear and followed precisely. Determine an age between 16-18, and simply disallow sexual relations involving any person below that age.
Give people the time to grow up and before they are allowed to have sex, since the consequences can be life altering. Whether you get a STD, or an unwanted pregnancy. Is the pleasure worth the price?

Yes, just thinking out loud, jeez!

I don't know how I read the word "teens." It was there, I thought.

An ageist is like a racist, sexist, except with people's ages. Usually, I think, used to describe people who think old people aren't as good as younger people, but the reverse happens, too.

I'm thinking of one of Margaret Meade's early works, where the young people, girls, were allowed to select a partner, usually they selected an older experienced male, to have "sex" with.

There would be a sort of party, and later the couples would sort of couple up "privately" around a circle and cuddle, or possible "pet" with clothes on.

Later, the chaperone would slip off and couples could slip off discreetly for more privacy IF the female wanted to.

Basically, what naj wrote is what is at issue and what would be allowed in the US.



As Dys pointed out when we were discussing this topic, if the crazies were publically known, all the better. They would never receive enough votes to legitimize their cause--just the opposite. Nazi's, Aryan Nation, other over-the-edge groups have tried to become nationally accepted parties, with no success.

A side topic has arisen which addresses legal age of children. There are a few studies out that show that sexual maturity and emotional maturity are quite different and that the brain doesn't reach physical maturity until around 24 or 15. I have a link to an interesting article about brain maturity. I think, though, that this is food for a new topic:

Adolescent Brain Development
http://www.nyas.org/ebriefreps/main.asp?intSubSectionID=570