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Life On Mars & Religion?

 
 
mesquite
 
  1  
Reply Tue 28 Mar, 2006 11:40 pm
Eorl wrote:
real life wrote:


Often it is implied or stated outright that if one cannot see, feel, hear God etc then obviously He cannot be real.



True. The Flying Spaghetti Monster has so often been maligned in similar fashion.


Yes, very true for the IPU (pbuh) also.
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Chumly
 
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Reply Wed 29 Mar, 2006 12:05 am
Loved the site on IPU, makes you wonder how many people do not believe we have even sent probes to Mars, let alone it's potential for life.
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Treya
 
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Reply Wed 29 Mar, 2006 11:53 am
Have they found life on mars yet? I'm practicing my happy dance... http://www.wackyb.co.nz/yh/wbyim59.gif
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Chumly
 
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Reply Wed 29 Mar, 2006 01:57 pm
No Sad

But I am optimistic they will find some signs at some point. That would just blow me away = we are not alone!
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farmerman
 
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Reply Wed 29 Mar, 2006 03:15 pm
what would be really cool is if it would be based upon Silica or Phosphate with an informational package based upon tetrahedrons in long branching chains. . It could be a Buckyball lifestyle with coded attachments with one buckyball piercing another in a sequence that bears just enough information. What thehell DNA is a crystal
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rosborne979
 
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Reply Wed 29 Mar, 2006 04:44 pm
farmerman wrote:
What the hell DNA is a crystal


DNA is a crystal? Why?
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farmerman
 
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Reply Wed 29 Mar, 2006 08:34 pm
cause when you remove most of its water, its a crystal. Rosalind Franklin discovered DNA by using an xray diffraction camera which is how we do crystal reconstruction . Your used to thinking of it in its hydrated state, but its structure is like any other protein.
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rosborne979
 
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Reply Wed 29 Mar, 2006 09:54 pm
farmerman wrote:
cause when you remove most of its water, its a crystal.


What does DNA look like when you dry it out? Do the crystals retain their double helix structure, or do they break apart and turn into powder?
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Wolf ODonnell
 
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Reply Thu 30 Mar, 2006 08:44 am
Off Topic: Oh dear. I enjoy pineapple and ham pizza and pepperonie and mushroom.

On Topic: To the naked eye, dried DNA looks kinda whitish and powdery. Or at least, it did in the Qiagen DNA extraction kit I used...
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farmerman
 
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Reply Thu 30 Mar, 2006 10:20 am
DNA crystal powder even when fully dry still retains the helical shape and takes on the state of a monoclinic crystal like some fancy gemstones. When Ros Franklin discovered it and Watson and Crick attended her seminar. They knew that the crystal structure was a helix because of its two states in the way it dispersed the x-ray beams. Linus Pauling actually cracked the code of helical structure using vitamin c crystals and Watson was learning by reading Pauling. ("The nature of the chemical bond"--its still a classic)
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Chumly
 
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Reply Thu 30 Mar, 2006 04:18 pm
Neat!
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tycoon
 
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Reply Sat 1 Apr, 2006 12:34 pm
Conversely, don't you think that when we leave this planet in an attempt to populate somewhere else (and I seriously believe we will do so) that we will need to be religion-free at that point? I can't imagine stowing a Bible or Qur'an--whatever--on board, knowing what seeds of discord that would plant.
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Chumly
 
  1  
Reply Sat 1 Apr, 2006 03:26 pm
Hey Tycoon,

A number of the astronauts who went to the moon have professed various religious / theistic / spiritual beliefs, as have a number of the astronauts who have gone into space.

As much as your views as per "need to be religion-free" resonate with me, it's not overly likely to go that way, and I think there would indeed be some chance of sowing the seeds of discord with aliens just like we have done here on earth.

Remember however, that the chances of meeting aliens in which we are on a similar enough level to have a normalized exchange is very remote. The chances are much higher that the intelligent aliens will be much more advanced than us, at least if we were to meet in the near future.

Without going into all the argument as to why this is the case, witness the vastness of the universe and how quickly man has advanced in the last 5000 years and you should see my point about the unlikelyhood of meeting intelligent aliens on a level playing field.

A fair amount of the popular science fiction that is based on intelligent aliens posits at least a somewhat level playing field with the aliens, otherwise the story can lose it's human interest theme.


Check the "the overview effect":
http://www.bookrags.com/sciences/astronomy/religion-spsc-04.html

Wherever human beings travel, we bring our religions with us. "Godspeed, John Glenn," the farewell words spoken to the first American astronaut into orbit, exemplifies the characteristic human drive to carry faith into space.

Many astronauts who are religious have spoken of finding their faith strengthened by the experience of traveling in space. The ability to look back on Earth as a small blue planet, and to see the fragility of life and human existence, is an experience that brings many space travelers closer to the creator. The astronauts of the Apollo 8 mission, orbiting the Moon for the very first time in 1968, broadcast back to Earth a reading from the book of Genesis on Christmas day, in the belief that the passage discussing the creation of the world expressed their feelings of the awe and majesty of creation.

While some astronauts are agnostic or atheist, others have been highly religious. Astronauts from most of the major religions on Earth have been represented in space, including representatives of Islam, Christianity, Judaism, and Buddhism. Edwin "Buzz" Aldrin, one of the two astronauts who were the first men to land on the Moon, brought with him a small vial of consecrated wine and a tiny piece of communion wafer, in order to celebrate the holy sacrament on the surface of the Moon.

For other astronauts, the spiritual experience of space is not expressed in the terms of formal religion. After landing on the Moon with Apollo 14, Astronaut Edgar Mitchell founded the Institute of Noetic Sciences to reconcile the spiritual and humanistic values of religious traditions with scientific insights. The spiritual insight granted from spaceflight, and seeing Earth from orbit without political boundaries or petty human conflict, is profound. This insight has been tagged "the overview effect" by author Frank White.
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Ellinas
 
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Reply Sat 1 Apr, 2006 03:29 pm
Re: Life On Mars & Religion?
Chumly wrote:
How are you and your religion going to deal with life on Mars, (assuming we find it) given that the popular creation theologies (that I am aware of) do not encompass Martian life.


Depends the form of life. If Mars is populated by a form of intelligent life, I believe we would know it. Mars is cartographed and NASA has many and detailed photos of the planet. The only possibility of life can be foud there are microorganisms. Even if they discover microbes there, I don't think this will affect the earther religions.

Now if you are talking about remnants of life that probably existed in Mars in the past, this is a big conversation.
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Chumly
 
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Reply Sat 1 Apr, 2006 03:36 pm
Life*, of any kind outside of earth, is clearly contrary to some religion's tenets. I agree however that certain religionists would get more antsy if there was advanced intelligent life on Mars as compared to simple life.

*Alive or dead advanced or simple.
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Kratos
 
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Reply Sat 15 Apr, 2006 02:15 pm
"I am God. Thou art God. And any jerk I remove is God, too."

--Michael Valentine Smith
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Chumly
 
  1  
Reply Sat 15 Apr, 2006 02:44 pm
Quote:
Stranger in a Strange Land tells the story of Valentine Michael Smith, orphaned progeny of the first manned expedition to Mars, who has been raised by Martians and brought back to Earth by a second human expedition. Though he is a man in his twenties, Smith looks at absolutely everything on this new planet through the ignorant eyes of a baby, and faces the job of learning how to be a human being. If the world government of Earth will let him, that is, for Smith, through a legal fluke, not only has sole survivor rights to the space drive that his mother invented, but also to the surface of Mars. In a Byzantine maneuver that makes Watergate seem minor, the government holds Smith hostage while it tries to figure out how to seize his assets. Ben Caxton, a muckraking reporter, suspects the worst and attempts to rescue Smith. The problem is, if you can't fight City Hall, how can you even begin to fight a world government?

Enter Caxton's friend, Jubal Harshaw, attorney, physician, hack writer, bon vivant, curmudgeon, anarchist. He caches Smith in Freedom Hall, his Poconos enclave, and takes on the dual chore of fighting the world federation for Smith's liberty and of educating Smith in the ways of his biological race. The youth is an apt student, a strange admixture of human infant and Martian superman, and as time goes on, he manages to win more and more people over to his own alien viewpoint. He becomes a kind of messiah--with explosive results.

Given that, I leave it to the reader to pick up Stranger in a Strange Land and revel in it. In spite of the movements and religions it has birthed, Stranger is no bible; it is a sprawling satire of human conceits, including marriage, love, sex and--most importantly--religion. Satire usually aims to inform, so if one is looking for any message in Stranger, then one take a good, long look at Heinlein's targets and think. As Heinlein himself said in a letter to an avid fan, ". . .I would never undertake to be a `Prophet,' handing out neatly packaged answers to lazy minds. [. . .] anyone who takes that book as answers is cheating himself. It is an invitation to think--not to believe."

http://www.wegrokit.com/stranger_in_a_strange_land.htm
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