engineer
 
  1  
Mon 14 Jul, 2008 10:06 am
okie wrote:
I think it is pretty well established that Obama is well left of center, and I think he is further left than most people suspect. That has been one big reason why many radical left wingers have lined up behind Obama. They did not think Clinton was moving fast enough on their agenda, so they jumped on the Obama bandwagon.

But Obama didn't have a lot of support from the traditional left. His support came from independent voters. Clinton almost always won the closed primaries and had all the big money from the Dem base.
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Mon 14 Jul, 2008 10:08 am
engineer wrote:
okie wrote:
I think it is pretty well established that Obama is well left of center, and I think he is further left than most people suspect. That has been one big reason why many radical left wingers have lined up behind Obama. They did not think Clinton was moving fast enough on their agenda, so they jumped on the Obama bandwagon.

But Obama didn't have a lot of support from the traditional left. His support came from independent voters. Clinton almost always won the closed primaries and had all the big money from the Dem base.


Which is to say, Okie, you are completely making up a narrative which has little to do with the realities of the race.

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
okie
 
  1  
Mon 14 Jul, 2008 10:22 am
Yeah sure, cyclops, I have some swamp land in Florida for sale too.

Not just leftists, but terrorist groups would love to see Obama elected too, so maybe its the nontraditional left?
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Mon 14 Jul, 2008 10:23 am
okie wrote:
Yeah sure, cyclops, I have some swamp land in Florida for sale too.

Not just leftists, but terrorist groups would love to see Obama elected too, so maybe its the nontraditional left?


Rolling Eyes

How do you expect to move forward in conversation from this point?

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
snood
 
  1  
Mon 14 Jul, 2008 11:16 am
He's obviously from the school of thought "When thoroughly entrenched in a ditch of your own making, keep digging."
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  1  
Mon 14 Jul, 2008 01:05 pm
So,...THIS has real potential to derail the Obama campaign.

What do people think?
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Mon 14 Jul, 2008 01:07 pm
Lash wrote:
So,...THIS has real potential to derail the Obama campaign.

What do people think?


I don't think that is anywhere even close to accurate. I doubt Obama is worried in the slightest about it.

I understand that YOU would like that, but c'mon...

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
Brand X
 
  1  
Mon 14 Jul, 2008 01:08 pm
Not the NYer cover....no IMO.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Mon 14 Jul, 2008 01:15 pm
Brand X wrote:
Not the NYer cover....no IMO.


There was a lengthy discussion on that New Yorker cover on Fox News this morning. The Obama campaign has apparently strenuously protested it as unacceptable and offensive even though the article it illustrates is quite complimentary of Obama. The Fox News commentators agreed with Obama that it was offensive.

I think it is another illustration of hypersensitivity on the part of the Obama folks, but that's just me. I still don't think Obama does himself any favors when he continues to demand that people treat him with kid gloves in a way that would be expected for no other candidate.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  1  
Mon 14 Jul, 2008 01:15 pm
Cyclo--

I am observing. I wouldn't like any candidate to be bounced because of something like this.

Brand--

I don't know...I guess I think images like this one are incredibly powerful. It does play to real fears--no thinking necessary--just that image...Actually, it can be explained until the cows come home, but that image is seared...It's sort of like incendiary testimony in a courtroom...and the judge says to the jury...."You are not to consider this information when you deliberate this case..." But they always do.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Mon 14 Jul, 2008 01:17 pm
Lash wrote:
Cyclo--

I am observing. I wouldn't like any candidate to be bounced because of something like this.

Brand--

I don't know...I guess I think images like this one are incredibly powerful. It does play to real fears--no thinking necessary--just that image...Actually, it can be explained until the cows come home, but that image is seared...It's sort of like incendiary testimony in a courtroom...and the judge says to the jury...."You are not to consider this information when you deliberate this case..." But they always do.


There is that too, but I still think Obama should not expect such caricatures in the course of a campaign--especially when there was no offense intended--when no other candidate can expect to avoid them.
0 Replies
 
cjhsa
 
  1  
Mon 14 Jul, 2008 01:17 pm
Barack Obama Calls Immigration Enforcement Agency Terrorists
lashawnbarber.com | July 14, 2008


Future President Barack Hussein Obama makes so many verbal gaffes, it's barely challenging to find and expose the ignorance.

Race-pandering before the hispanic racialist group La Raza, BHO equated Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE), the government agency charged with carrying out our nations immigration laws, with terrorism. He said:

"When communities are terrorized by ICE immigration raidsÂ…when all that is happening, the system just isn't working, and we need to change it."
0 Replies
 
echi
 
  1  
Mon 14 Jul, 2008 01:22 pm
Every person who runs for office objects to negative press. Obama is no different, he just objects better.

And there is no article related to the New Yorker cover... apparently, there never is.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Mon 14 Jul, 2008 01:27 pm
There's an old Asian saying "picture worth a thousand words."
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Mon 14 Jul, 2008 01:28 pm
echi wrote:
Every person who runs for office objects to negative press. Obama is no different, he just objects better.

And there is no article related to the New Yorker cover... apparently, there never is.


The article doesn't explain the cover, no, but there is an article.

New Yorker mag's 'satire' cover draws Team Obama's ire
BY STEPHANIE GASKELL
DAILY NEWS STAFF WRITER
Updated Monday, July 14th 2008, 10:33 AM


Cover of July 21 issue of The New Yorker depicts Barack and Michelle Obama in extremist roles.
Barack Obama's campaign lashed out Sunday at the editors of The New Yorker magazine for a cartoon cover that depicts the Democratic candidate and his wife as fist-bumping terrorists.

The magazine's editor described the cartoon, called "The Politics of Fear," as satire. The Obama campaign called it "tasteless and offensive."

The Illinois senator is depicted in traditional Muslim garb in the Barry Blitt illustration set in the Oval Office.

His wife, Michelle, is in fatigues, sporting an Angela Davis-style sky-high Afro, an AK-47 slung over her shoulder.

A portrait of terror kingpin Osama Bin Laden hangs above the fireplace, in which an American flag is set ablaze.

"The New Yorker may think, as one of their staff explained to us, that their cover is a satirical lampoon of the caricature Sen. Obama's right-wing critics have tried to create. But most readers will see it as tasteless and offensive. And we agree," Obama campaign spokesman Bill Burton said.

New Yorker editor David Remnick seemed shocked by the backlash.

"Our cover ... combines a number of fantastical images about the Obamas and shows them for the obvious distortions they are," he said in a statement.

"The burning flag, the nationalist-radical and Islamic outfits, the fist-bump, the portrait on the wall - all of them echo one attack or another. Satire is part of what we do, and it is meant to bring things out into the open, to hold up a mirror to the absurd. And that's the spirit of this cover," Remnick said.

The magazine does not explain the cover. Inside are lengthy stories that look at how Chicago politics shaped the candidate and at allegations that he flip-flops on major issues.

Obama brushed off the brouhaha. "I have no response to that," he told reporters when asked about the cover, but his supporters are infuriated.

The McCain campaign joined in piling on The New Yorker. "We completely agree with the Obama campaign that it's tasteless and offensive," said campaign spokesman Tucker Bounds.

[email protected]
LINK

http://www.nydailynews.com/img/2008/07/14/amd_newyorker-cover.jpg

I wonder if Obama has ever pubicly agreed that some of the inflammatory and/or unattractive characatures of McCain are offensive?
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Mon 14 Jul, 2008 01:31 pm
The swift boaters have started!
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  1  
Mon 14 Jul, 2008 01:35 pm
Fox, hi.

To me, this type of "caricature" feels like Condi Rice as Aunt Jemima.

But, I have to admit, I'm questioning my feelings about the Dutch paper's use of Mohammad---my feelings then---and this.

Hmmm.
0 Replies
 
echi
 
  1  
Mon 14 Jul, 2008 01:38 pm
Foxfyre wrote:
echi wrote:

And there is no article related to the New Yorker cover... apparently, there never is.


The article doesn't explain the cover, no, but there is an article.


Did I miss something? What article?
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Mon 14 Jul, 2008 01:40 pm
echi wrote:
Foxfyre wrote:
echi wrote:

And there is no article related to the New Yorker cover... apparently, there never is.


The article doesn't explain the cover, no, but there is an article.


Did I miss something? What article?


The piece I just posted refers to it. I haven't read it because I don't have a current issue of the New Yorker.
Quote:
The magazine does not explain the cover. Inside are lengthy stories that look at how Chicago politics shaped the candidate and at allegations that he flip-flops on major issues.


The Fox News commentators described the article as 'mostly favorable and complimentary of Obama' while they objected to the cover.
0 Replies
 
echi
 
  1  
Mon 14 Jul, 2008 01:43 pm
oh...alright.
0 Replies
 
 

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