Miller
 
  1  
Mon 17 Mar, 2008 09:37 pm
Obama will lose to Clinton and then Illinois will eventually dump him.

Maybe he'll become a "minister"... Razz
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  1  
Mon 17 Mar, 2008 09:42 pm
From the Tribune Editorial Board after 92 minute Q and A...

Quote:
U.S. Sen. Barack Obama waited 16 months to attempt the exorcism. But when he finally sat down with the Tribune editorial board Friday, Obama offered a lengthy and, to us, plausible explanation for the presence of now-indicted businessman Tony Rezko in his personal and political lives.
The most remarkable facet of Obama's 92-minute discussion was that, at the outset, he pledged to answer every question the three dozen Tribune journalists crammed into the room would put to him. And he did.
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/opinion/chi-0316edit1mar16,0,2616801.story
0 Replies
 
maporsche
 
  1  
Mon 17 Mar, 2008 09:58 pm
Miller wrote:
Obama will lose to Clinton and then Illinois will eventually dump him.

Maybe he'll become a "minister"... Razz


I hope you're right.....but this seems rather unlikely.
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  1  
Mon 17 Mar, 2008 10:01 pm
Fox coverage of obama follows the Drudge model...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjvNSpsPu1k
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Mon 17 Mar, 2008 10:26 pm
From TNR

Quote:

What Are Those Superdelegates Thinking?

Barack Obama picked up another superdelegate vote today, courtesy of Margie Gavin Woods' endorsement. Woods is the Minority Leader of the Will County Board in Illinois, for those of you wondering how powerful you have to be to help decide this election. According to NBC News, Obama has gained 48 superdelegates since February 5th and Clinton has gained zero.

Perhaps the Clinton campaign has 50 superdelegates in its back pocket, and is waiting for the right time to announce the news (after a big PA win, perhaps). But the fact that everything from Clinton dinners at her NY home, to Harold Ickes (3am?) phone calls, to impassioned pleas from Bill and Chelsea, cannot win the campaign a single superdelegate (especially after two huge wins and a dreadful three weeks for Obama) must mean something beyond Obama's inch-by-inch gains in delegate totals. Either Clinton fatigue (or dislike) is much stronger among the Democratic establishment than previously assumed (and it is assumed to be relatively robust), or the conventional wisdom within the party gives her no chance to win.

--Isaac Chotiner


Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
Miller
 
  1  
Mon 17 Mar, 2008 10:47 pm
How did Rev. Wright come to the conclusion that Jesus was black?
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  1  
Mon 17 Mar, 2008 10:51 pm
Quote:
Smearing Obama

Ari Berman

He's a Muslim. He was sworn into office on the Koran. He doesn't say the Pledge of Allegiance. His pastor is an anti-Semite. He's a tool of Louis Farrakhan. He's anti-Israel. His advisers are anti-Israel. He's friends with terrorists. The terrorists want him to win. He's the Antichrist.

By now you've probably seen at least some of these e-mails and articles about Barack Obama bouncing around the Internet. They distort Obama's religious faith, question his support for Israel, warp the identity and positions of his campaign advisers and defame his friends and allies from Chicago. The purpose of the smear is to paint him as an Arab-loving, Israel-hating, terrorist-coddling, radical black nationalist. That picture couldn't be further from the truth, but you'd be surprised how many people have fallen for it...
http://www.thenation.com/doc/20080331/berman
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  1  
Mon 17 Mar, 2008 10:57 pm
Miller wrote:
How did Rev. Wright come to the conclusion that Jesus was black?


Damned good question.

And how did almost every Protestant and Catholic in America come to the conclusion that jesus was from Denmark?

http://sharpiron.files.wordpress.com/2007/07/classic-jesus.jpg


As opposed to what his actual ethnicity would suggest?

http://http-server.carleton.ca/~zcrook/08%20-%20RealJesus.jpeg
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  1  
Mon 17 Mar, 2008 10:58 pm
Hell, even Lou Dobbs wouldn't want him in your country. And we do know what you think about those sorts, don't we.
0 Replies
 
dyslexia
 
  1  
Tue 18 Mar, 2008 12:39 am
Denmark? that explains a lot; communist bastard!!!!
0 Replies
 
snood
 
  1  
Tue 18 Mar, 2008 03:14 am
Yer a card, mountie.
0 Replies
 
Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Tue 18 Mar, 2008 05:58 am
Denmark is far too cold for wandering around in a sheet.

All I want to know from you guys is

is obama really the shoe-in for the democratic nomination as the betting odds suggest? Before I waste any money.
0 Replies
 
revel
 
  1  
Tue 18 Mar, 2008 06:26 am
Miller wrote:
How did Rev. Wright come to the conclusion that Jesus was black?


We don't know what color the Jews were who came from that area as the bible really don't talk about color from what I can tell from it. Wright might be wrong or right. I think he injects race a little too much and seems to be racist himself and I can't imagine Obama swallowing all it because his mother is white. Bottom line for me is that I just don't get that impression from Obama inspite of his ties to his former pastor.

If this goes on too long i can see this hurting him.
0 Replies
 
sozobe
 
  1  
Tue 18 Mar, 2008 06:39 am
Yeah, that's the only thing I worry about in terms of his big speech today.

It's possible it would have died down if he'd said nothing. He's going to revitalize the issue today though.

That said, I so understand and sympathize with this:

Quote:


I think he has the right instincts here, and I think this speech might be a humdinger.
0 Replies
 
sozobe
 
  1  
Tue 18 Mar, 2008 06:39 am
Link:

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/18/us/politics/18wright.html
0 Replies
 
maporsche
 
  1  
Tue 18 Mar, 2008 06:53 am


From the article.

Quote:

Because of his own emphasis on powerful oratory, said Todd Harris, a Republican strategist, Mr. Obama cannot dismiss Mr. Wright's words as mere rhetoric.

"At the core of the campaign is the fact that words matter," said Mr. Harris, who is not now affiliated with any campaign. "Central to the idea of his candidacy is the idea that a speech can change the world. You can't have a campaign that has that notion at its core and then point to other people's words and say, those don't really matter."
0 Replies
 
FreeDuck
 
  1  
Tue 18 Mar, 2008 06:56 am
I don't think he's saying those words don't matter -- he's saying those words aren't mine.

Anyhoo, good stuff from Greenwald today. Here's an excerpt.

http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/2008/03/17/wright/index.html

Quote:
The statement of Wright's which seems to be causing the most upset -- and it's one of two singled out by Douthat -- is his suggestion that there is a causal link between (a) America's constant bombings of and other interference with Middle Eastern countries and (b) the willingness of some Middle Eastern fanatics to attack the U.S. Ever since the 9/11 attacks, we've been told that positing any such causal connection is a sign of vicious anti-Americanism and that all decent people find such questions despicable. This week we learned that no respectable person would subject his children to a pastor who espouses such hateful ideas.

But the idea that America deserves terrorist attacks and other horrendous disasters has long been a frequently expressed view among the faction of white evangelical ministers to whom the Republican Party is most inextricably linked. Neither Jerry Falwell nor Pat Robertson ever retracted or denounced their view that America provoked the 9/11 attacks by doing things to anger God. John Hagee continues to believe that the City of New Orleans got what it deserved when Katrina drowned its residents and devastated the lives of thousands of Americans. And James Inhofe -- who happens to still be a Republican U.S. Senator -- blamed America for the 9/11 attacks by arguing in a 2002 Senate floor speech that "the spiritual door was opened for an attack against the United States of America" because we pressured Israel to give away parts of the West Bank.

The phrases "anti-American" and "America-haters" are among the most barren and manipulative in our entire political lexicon, but whatever they happen to mean on any given day, they easily encompass people who believe that the U.S. deserved the 9/11 attacks, devastating hurricanes and the like. Yet when are people like Falwell, Robertson, Hagee, Inhofe and other white Christian radicals ever described as anti-American or America-hating extremists? Never -- because white Christian evangelicals who tie themselves to the political Right are intrinsically patriotic. Does Douthat believe that those individuals are anti-American radicals and that people who allow their children to belong to their churches are exercising grave errors of judgment?
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  1  
Tue 18 Mar, 2008 07:11 am
FreeDuck wrote:
I don't think he's saying those words don't matter -- he's saying those words aren't mine.

Anyhoo, good stuff from Greenwald today. Here's an excerpt.

http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/2008/03/17/wright/index.html

Quote:
The statement of Wright's which seems to be causing the most upset -- and it's one of two singled out by Douthat -- is his suggestion that there is a causal link between (a) America's constant bombings of and other interference with Middle Eastern countries and (b) the willingness of some Middle Eastern fanatics to attack the U.S. Ever since the 9/11 attacks, we've been told that positing any such causal connection is a sign of vicious anti-Americanism and that all decent people find such questions despicable. This week we learned that no respectable person would subject his children to a pastor who espouses such hateful ideas.

But the idea that America deserves terrorist attacks and other horrendous disasters has long been a frequently expressed view among the faction of white evangelical ministers to whom the Republican Party is most inextricably linked. Neither Jerry Falwell nor Pat Robertson ever retracted or denounced their view that America provoked the 9/11 attacks by doing things to anger God. John Hagee continues to believe that the City of New Orleans got what it deserved when Katrina drowned its residents and devastated the lives of thousands of Americans. And James Inhofe -- who happens to still be a Republican U.S. Senator -- blamed America for the 9/11 attacks by arguing in a 2002 Senate floor speech that "the spiritual door was opened for an attack against the United States of America" because we pressured Israel to give away parts of the West Bank.

The phrases "anti-American" and "America-haters" are among the most barren and manipulative in our entire political lexicon, but whatever they happen to mean on any given day, they easily encompass people who believe that the U.S. deserved the 9/11 attacks, devastating hurricanes and the like. Yet when are people like Falwell, Robertson, Hagee, Inhofe and other white Christian radicals ever described as anti-American or America-hating extremists? Never -- because white Christian evangelicals who tie themselves to the political Right are intrinsically patriotic. Does Douthat believe that those individuals are anti-American radicals and that people who allow their children to belong to their churches are exercising grave errors of judgment?


Greenwald's argument is a sound, rational argument. I doubt it or anything like it will be any help here. When Americans allow profanities like gay pride parades then they 'deserve' to be attacked as on 9-11. When they launch warfare and slaughter a quarter or half million people, that's all a simple extension of God's will and grace. That is 'doing good' in the world and where such results in violence against America, that clearly and only proves the evilness of those who so act.
0 Replies
 
sozobe
 
  1  
Tue 18 Mar, 2008 07:20 am
Anyone know WHEN the big speech will happen? I haven't found that yet.

I'm really thinking this'll be convention speech/Jefferson-Jackson speech big. He's writing it himself. Hoping to see it live.

Nervous.
0 Replies
 
revel
 
  1  
Tue 18 Mar, 2008 07:23 am
Actually going from those I have talked who are Obama's supporters (and myself) what is causing the most upset was not the link to US past actions and 9/11 but the more inflammatory racial remarks and most of all the G_D America which has nothing to do with injecting America in it but just using God's name in a curse word which I admit I can't even spell out (I know it is silly but some words I use here I would never say out loud since I do spell out curse words but that I can't even spell out it is so bad) a sermon and preaching racial divide during a sermon. My father is an Obama supporter but he has a hard time getting over the fact that his pastor (we don't use the word pastor which neither here nor there)used God's name in a curse word in a sermon. He said that he finds it hard to believe Obama didn't hear about it and if he didn't hear about he should have if was really a church going Christian and kept up with his church. (my dad was a past preacher and is still very religious and believes in not forsaking the assembly...) He said if it him he would have walked out or the preacher (pastor) would have waked out one or the other was walking out.

I personally believe Obama that he wasn't there during the G_D sermon and didn't hear about until the start of his presidential compaign and his pastor was going to retire anyway...and that is enough for me.

My point with all this personal stuff is just to point out that it is not really about patriotism for at least the people I know.
0 Replies
 
 

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