cjhsa
 
  1  
Tue 2 Oct, 2007 11:14 am
cicerone imposter wrote:
Some have even visited the US, and said they wished they could live here.


They should have gone to Mexico instead of the U.S. and just jumped the border....
0 Replies
 
dagmaraka
 
  1  
Tue 2 Oct, 2007 11:20 am
I guess I should go 'jump the border', too, cjhsa?
0 Replies
 
cjhsa
 
  1  
Tue 2 Oct, 2007 11:27 am
That's up to you.
0 Replies
 
dagmaraka
 
  1  
Tue 2 Oct, 2007 11:28 am
thankgod.
0 Replies
 
cjhsa
 
  1  
Tue 2 Oct, 2007 11:31 am
Dag, I don't really know your 411 but I'm assuming you came over here on a student or work visa which has expired. That is nobody's problem but your own. At least you didn't run across our southern border and then demand equal rights with citizens. For that I and most others give you a lot of credit. Use it wisely.
0 Replies
 
dagmaraka
 
  1  
Tue 2 Oct, 2007 11:53 am
you assume too much, that may be part of your problem. i work full time, with work visa. but you are right, that IS none of your business.
c.i. was writing about russian tourists, also with perfectly valid tourist visa. perhaps read more carefully before you post?
0 Replies
 
cjhsa
 
  1  
Tue 2 Oct, 2007 11:55 am
Sounds like I made a perfectly good assumption in both cases.
0 Replies
 
dagmaraka
 
  1  
Tue 2 Oct, 2007 11:56 am
perhaps that is so, in your head. just not outside of it.
0 Replies
 
cjhsa
 
  1  
Tue 2 Oct, 2007 11:58 am
Dag, I don't like liars.
0 Replies
 
dagmaraka
 
  1  
Tue 2 Oct, 2007 11:58 am
well, me neither. that makes two of us.
0 Replies
 
dagmaraka
 
  1  
Tue 2 Oct, 2007 12:00 pm
...though i have no clue what you're talking about. care to be a little more "straightforward, honest and truthful" - or whatever it was you suggested about your writing here on a2k?
0 Replies
 
cjhsa
 
  1  
Tue 2 Oct, 2007 12:12 pm
Question
0 Replies
 
dagmaraka
 
  1  
Tue 2 Oct, 2007 12:30 pm
cjhsa wrote:
Dag, I don't like liars.


this above - i've no clue what that was related to. perhaps you'd care to explain it rather than talk in code?
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  1  
Wed 3 Oct, 2007 08:49 am
I like this very much...
Quote:
Adam Smith and the Village's Amusement at War
(updated below)

As Greg Sargent notes, Barack Obama delivered a speech yesterday which echoed many of the most common critiques made by bloggers of the political establishment. In particular, Obama empashized that the fault for the Iraq War does not lie -- certainly not exclusively -- with George Bush and Dick Cheney, but rather with the Washington establishment as a whole. And particularly as the war has dragged on with no end in sight, the culpability of the Beltway Establishment generally has grown and become much more dispersed:

There are those who offer up easy answers. They will assert that Iraq is George Bush's war, it's all his fault. Or that Iraq was botched by the arrogance and incompetence of Donald Rumsfeld and Dick Cheney. Or that we would have gotten Iraq right if we went in with more troops, or if we had a different proconsul instead of Paul Bremer, or if only there were a stronger Iraqi Prime Minister.

These are the easy answers. And like most easy answers, they are partially true. But they don't tell the whole truth, because they overlook a harder and more fundamental truth. The hard truth is that the war in Iraq is not about a catalog of many mistakes -- it is about one big mistake. The war in Iraq should never have been fought. . . .

[T]he American people weren't just failed by a President -- they were failed by much of Washington. By a media that too often reported spin instead of facts. By a foreign policy elite that largely boarded the bandwagon for war. And most of all by the majority of a Congress -- a coequal branch of government -- that voted to give the President the open-ended authority to wage war that he uses to this day.

Obama proceeded to identify virtually every other Beltway branch that bears responsibility for what has become of our country: "conventional thinking in Washington" -- "Some leading Democrats" - "the most experienced voices in Washington [who counseled] that the only way for Democrats to look tough was to talk, act and vote like a Republican" - "much of Washington."

This speech simultaneously highlights both the promise of Obama's candidacy -- he is the only viable candidate both willing and able to make this critique convincingly -- and also its disappointment thus far, due to what Michael Crowley, in a quite good article in The New Republic, describes as "the disappointingly conventional Obama campaign."
source with internal links http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/?last_story=/opinion/greenwald/2007/10/03/smith/
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Wed 3 Oct, 2007 04:23 pm
Blacks split between Clinton, Obama

By ALAN FRAM, Associated Press Writer 32 minutes ago

WASHINGTON - Blacks are split down the middle over Barack Obama and Hillary Rodham Clinton in the presidential race, seeing both as on their side, a new poll says.


At the same time, blacks and whites have starkly different perceptions of Obama's credentials, the Associated Press-Ipsos poll said Wednesday. Blacks are significantly more satisfied than whites that the youthful Illinois senator has sufficient experience to be president.

Many blacks seem torn between the two. Obama would be the first black president, while the New York senator and former first lady, along with her husband, is widely popular among blacks.

"I'm a black person, but that's not the only thing I like about him," said Raymond Monroe, 63, a retired production supervisor from Abilene, Texas, who backs Obama but says he might shift. "He's young and has new ideas, but she's pretty sharp, too. Instead of good old boys all the time, I think we need a change."

Blacks make up about a tenth of voters overall. They are reliably loyal Democrats, voting nearly nine-to-one for the party's candidates in the 2004 and 2006 elections. And while blacks are few in New Hampshire and Iowa, they comprise about half the Democratic primary voters in South Carolina, another early voting state.
0 Replies
 
Butrflynet
 
  1  
Wed 3 Oct, 2007 09:29 pm
http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/10/03/obama-talks-about-growing-up-without-his-father/


Quote:
October 3, 2007, 6:27 pm
Obama Talks About Growing Up Without His Father
By Jeff Zeleny

WASHINGTON, Iowa - By now, the stump speeches delivered by presidential candidates have become routine, at least to many of the politically inclined voters of Iowa and New Hampshire. So the most interesting moments at campaign appearances often are inspired from those seated in the audience.

Near the end of a stop here today, Senator Barack Obama was asked this question from a man seated in the crowd at the Washington County fairgrounds: "What would you say is the most painful and character-building experience of your life that puts you in a position to make important decisions of life and death and the well being of our country?"
For a moment or two, Mr. Obama paused. It was far different from the string of questions posed on policies and issues. Finally, he said: "It's a terrific question."

And here, in its entirety, is his answer:

"I would say the fact that I grew up without a father in the home. What that meant was that I had to learn very early on to figure out what was important and what wasn't, and exercise my own judgment and in some ways to raise myself.

My mother was wonderful and was a foundation of love for me, but as a young man growing up, I didn't have a lot of role models and I made a lot of mistakes, but I learned to figure out that there are certain values that were important to me that I had to be true to.

Nobody was going to force me to be honest. Nobody was going to force me to work hard. Nobody was going to force me to have drive and ambition. Nobody was going to force me to have empathy for other people. But if I really thought those values were important, I had to live them out.

That's why it's so important for me now, both as a United States senator and as a president candidate, but also as a father and a husband to wake up every morning and ask myself, am I living up to those values that I say are important? Because if I'm not, then I shouldn't be president."
0 Replies
 
ossobuco
 
  1  
Wed 3 Oct, 2007 10:10 pm
blatham wrote:
I like this very much...
Quote:
Adam Smith and the Village's Amusement at War
(updated below)

etc.


That was useful for me to see. Thanks.
0 Replies
 
Butrflynet
 
  1  
Fri 5 Oct, 2007 07:21 pm
More regarding Mark Penn (the Clinton's Karl Rove), and Blackwater, Burson-Marsteller.




Barack Obama charged today that a private security firm operating in Iraq has acted "with reckless disregard to Iraqi life," as he called his proposals to better monitor such contractors the toughest reforms offered by any candidate in the presidential race.

Although Obama has previously mentioned Blackwater USA, the Illinois Democrat drew greater attention to the firm's actions in an extended discussion on the University of Iowa's campus.

http://weblogs.baltimoresun.com/news/politics/blog/2007/10/obama_goes_after_blackwater.html


Obama outlines policy on private security in Iraq
http://www.press-citizen.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=2007710040326&template=printart



Top Clinton PR Strategist Representing Blackwater at

http://www.barackoblogger.com/2007/10/top-clinton-pr-strategist-representing.html

Blackwater is in the midst of a lot of media and governmental scrutiny right now, and are in need of a major public-relations overhaul. What firm do they call when they want to clean up their media image? Well, no other than PR Giant Burson-Marsteller. Blackwater is one of their latest clients and they will be in charge of selling a cleaned-up Blackwater to the American people. From Associated Press:


Public relations giant Burson-Marsteller has vast experience steering companies through tough times. But there's a limit to how much it can help Blackwater USA, a new client that's been battered by negative publicity.




The State Department, which pays Blackwater hundreds of millions of dollars to protect U.S. diplomats in Iraq, has stringent rules barring the private security contractor from discussing with the media the details of its work, according to those familiar with the arrangement.

Under those limitations, it's difficult to repair a corporate image, said one official close to Blackwater.

The department allows little room for error. On Sept. 16, Blackwater guards were involved in a shoot-out in Baghdad that left 13 Iraqis dead. Blackwater issued a statement to reporters saying its personnel acted lawfully and appropriately to a "hostile attack" from "armed enemies."



As it turns out the president and CEO of the firm is Mark Penn, who is also the chief strategist for Hillary Clinton's campaign. Think of him as Hillary's Karl Rove. From The Nation:

[P]erhaps the most important figure in the [Clinton] campaign is her pollster and chief strategist, Mark Penn, a combative workaholic. Penn is not yet a household name, but perhaps he should be. Inside Hillaryland, he has elaborately managed the centrist image Hillary has cultivated in the Senate. The campaign is polling constantly, and Penn's interpretation of the numbers will in large part decide her political direction.

Yet Penn is no ordinary pollster. Beyond his connections to the Clintons, he not only polls for America's biggest companies but also runs one of the world's premier PR agencies [Burson-Marsteller]. This creates a dilemma for Hillary: Penn represents many of the interests whose influence candidate Clinton--in an attempt to appeal to an increasingly populist Democratic electorate--has vowed to curtail. Is what's good for Penn and his business good for Hillary's political career? And furthermore, can she convincingly claim to fight for the average American with Penn guiding strategy in her corner?


...Burson-Marsteller is hardly a natural fit for a prominent Democrat. The firm has represented everyone from the Argentine military junta to Union Carbide after the 1984 Bhopal disaster in India, in which thousands were killed when toxic fumes were released by one of its plants, to Royal Dutch Shell, which has been accused of massive human rights violations in Nigeria. B-M pioneered the use of pseudo-grassroots front groups, known as "astroturfing," to wage stealth corporate attacks against environmental and consumer organizations. It set up the National Smokers Alliance on behalf of Philip Morris to fight tobacco regulation in the early 1990s. Its current clients include major players in the finance, pharmaceutical and energy industries. In 2006, with Penn at the helm, the company gave 57 percent of its campaign contributions to Republican candidates.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071005/ap_on_go_ot/blackwater_pr



UPDATE: Since the Associated Press story broke, Penn explains: "It was a temporary
assignment based on a relationship that has concluded."


http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/10/05/clinton-strategist-represents-blackwater/
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Fri 5 Oct, 2007 08:51 pm
Kevin Drum on Obama

Some good points on two that were sounded here before..

Quote:
CHANGE....Andrew Sullivan on Barack Obama:

    He is very, very careful not to get too angry as a black candidate. Perhaps too careful for his core message: real change. What he needs to do is find a way to explain how serious he is about change while explaining that he alone can overcome the boomer polarization that has prevented it.
I hear this a lot, but I wonder if it misreads the American mood at the moment. Sure, the public is ready for "real change," but what kind of change? There are several obvious possibilities:

  • A change from George Bush. Yes, definitely. But all three of the major Democratic candidates offer this.

  • A change from movement conservatism. Ditto.

  • A change from the the bitter polarization of recent years
  • Change from the "I'm on a mission from God" style of leadership. George Bush figured he could change the world by ruling from his gut. The result has been six years of ceaseless tension and drama, from Terry Schiavo to Iraq to Social Security to Katrina. In this sense, I suspect the American public wants less change. They'd like to see someone who can simply govern competently, someone who actually takes policy seriously, and someone who can restore an American consensus on foreign policy overseas. From this perspective, Hillary Clinton is the agent of change, not Obama.
The strengths and weaknesses of the three major Democratic candidates bubble just slightly below the surface, I think. All three are electable, for example, but which one is most likely to help with downballot races? (My guess: Obama.) All three have similar healthcare plans, but which one is most likely to get something decent passed into law? (My guess: Hillary.) All three kinda sorta want to get us out of Iraq, but which one is most likely to do it? (My guess: Edwards.) Take your pick.

I'd definitely echo the 'polarisation' point..
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Fri 5 Oct, 2007 09:11 pm
Al Giordano fact-checks Bill Clinton's condescending dismissal of Obama as too inexperienced a week or so ago, and smacks it down accordingly:

Quote:
In a televised interview with columnist Al Hunt, Bill echoed Hillary Clinton's claim that Obama is too "inexperienced" for the Oval Office. He said:

"I was, in terms of experience, was closer to Senator Obama, I suppose, in 1988 when I came within a day of announcing... I really didn't think I knew enough, and had served enough and done enough to run."

When Clinton did run for president, in 1992, he was the same age as Obama is today.

Oops.

Moreover..

Quote:
[..] the so-far neutral Robert Reich (one of the few cabinet-level veterans of the Clinton White House that is still widely beloved and trusted among Democrats) [..] jumped up from the sidelines and kicked in an extra point for Obama.

Reich said: "While I can understand Bill Clinton's eagerness to undermine his wife's most significant primary opponent, he is not, I believe, completely ingenuous. I happened to talk with him in 1988 before he decided not to run, and also in 1991 before he decided to run the following year. His calculation at both times was decidedly rational and entirely political, based on whether he could win."


And finally:

Quote:
Bill Clinton's attempted put-down offered Obama a clean shot at the rival camp through its surrogate [..].

In an act of political jiu-jitsu, Obama turned Clinton's words about experience from 1992 into a Wayback Machine endorsement of his own 2008 quest. In a 1992 debate with George H. W. Bush, Clinton had said: "The same old experience is not relevant... you can have the right kind of experience and the wrong kind of experience."

"He's exactly right," smiled Obama.

Score!
0 Replies
 
 

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