Obama '08?

@Advocate,

Quote:

Obama plans to eventually install a pay-go system that is basically the same one used by Clinton to generate the large surpluses

Eventually being after his watch, which he knows will likely be overturned by whom ever sits in the chair next, and thus will never happen. Promises for tomorrow are worth not a thing. It is a rationalization for making a bad choice today, this promise that it will be fixed later.....by someone else....and is completely dishonest because Obama knows he cant control the next president.

1 Reply

@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

From Wiki:

Quote:
Year Gross Debt in Billions [10] as % of GDP
1950 257.4 94.1
1960 290.5 56.1
1970 380.9 37.6
1980 909.0 33.3
1990 3,206.3 55.9
2000 5,628.7 58.0
2001 5,769.9 57.4
2002 6,198.4 59.7
2003 6,760.0 62.6
2004 7,354.7 63.9
2005 7,905.3 64.6
2006 8,451.4 65.0
2007 8,950.7 65.6
2008 9,985.8 70.2

From the same source, C.I. are estimates:

2009: Debt 12868 % of GDP: 90.4
2010: 14456 98.1
2011: 15674 101.0

I waded through the data today for awhile and discovered that there are at least 2 different ways of measuring debt.
I think, I say I think, I understand how it is defined above. But it is far more complicated than I imagined.
Anyone want to take a whack at explaining it?

0 Replies

@Advocate,

ANNUAL DATA

Quote:

ftp://ftp.bls.gov/pub/suppl/empsit.cpseea1.txt
Year................USA Civil Population......USA Total Civil Employed
1980...................... 167,745,000.................99,302,000 [CARTER 1977-1981]
1981...................... 170,130,000………….....100,397,000 [REAGAN 1981-1989]
1982..................... 172,271,000.................99,526,000
1983..................... 174,215,000...............100,834,000
1984..................... 176,383,000...............105,005,000
1985..................... 178,206,000………........107,150,000
1986..................... 180,587,000...............109,597,000
1987..................... 182,753,000...............112,440,000
1988..................... 184,613,000...............114,968,000
1989..................... 186,393,000...............117,342,000 [BUSH 41 1989-1993]
1990..................... 189,164,000...............118,793,000
1991..................... 190,925,000...............117,718,000
1992..................... 192,805,000…….….......118,492,000
1993..................... 194,838,000...............120,259,000 [CLINTON 1993-2001]
1994..................... 196,814,000...............123,060,000
1995..................... 198,584,000………….....124,900,000
1996..................... 200,591,000...............126,708,000
1997..................... 203,133,000………….....129,558,000
1998...................... 205,220,000...............131,463,000
1999..................... 207,753,000...............133,488,000
2000..................... 212,577,000...............136,891,000
2001..................... 215,092,000………………136,933,000 [BUSH 43 2001-2009]
2002...................... 217,570,000...............136,485,000
2003..................... 221,168,000...............137,730,006
2004..................... 223,357,000...............139,252,000
2005..................... 226,082,000………….....141,730,000
2006...................... 228,815,000……..........144,427,000
2007..................... 231,867,000...............146,047,000
2008..................... 233,788,000...............145,362,000
2009..................... 235,810,000...............139,959,000 [OBAMA 2009-?]
===========================================

MONTHLY DATA

2008:
August........................ xxxxxxxxxxx………...145,273,000
September……………... xxxxxxxxxxx…………145,029,000
October....................... 234,612,000…….....144,650,007
November................... 234,828,000..........144,144,000
December.................... 235,035,000.........143,338,000

2009:

January...................... 234,739,000...........142,099,000
February.................... 234,913,000...........141,748,000
March........................ 235,086,000……......140,887,000
April.......................... 235,271,000............141,007,000
May........................... 235,452,000...........140,570,000
June........................... 235,655,000...........140,196,000
July............................ 235,870,000...........140,041,000
August....................... 236,087,000...........139,649,000
September................. 236,322,000..........138,864,000
October..................... 236,550,000...........138,275,000
November ................ 236, 775,000…….……138,381,000
December ................. 237,005,000….…...…137,792,000

0 Replies

Quote:

http://www.whitehouse.gov/omb/budget/fy2009/pdf/hist.pdf
$TRILLIONS….GDP……..INCREASE….. AVERAGE INCREASE PER YEAR
2001……....….10.0579
2008……....….14.3115………4.2536………………………..0.35447
2009…...........15.0270………0.7155……………………….0.7155

1 Reply

@ican711nm,

OBAMA AND THE DEMOCRAT CONGRESSIONAL MAJORITY DID NOT REDUCE OR RESCIND TARP OR ANY OTHER EXPENDITURES SIGNED BY BUSH. THEREFORE OBAMA AND THE DEMOCRAT CONGRESSIONAL MAJORITY ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR ALL THOSE EXPENDITURES ALLEGEDLY INHERITED BY THEM FROM BUSH.

1 Reply

@Cycloptichorn,

Cycloptichorn wrote:

Quote:

To correct the mis-information here by Advocate, Obama inherited an economy that had a 2008 fiscal year deficit of 459 billion or 3.2% of gdp. Obama's 2009 deficit was 1.4 trillion, more than 3 times the amount in 2008 and equal to around 10% of gdp.

Complete and total bullshit. This is a 100% lie. TARP itself was 350 billion dollars of money straight into the deficit, and that doesn't count 50 billion we lended AIG early in the year, how can you possibly believe your numbers are accurate?

Cycloptichorn

Here are the numbers again for cyclops that is slow to catch on.Obama took office in January 2009. The deficit for the year 2009, ending September 30, 2009 was 1.4 trillion, more than three times the deficit of Bush's last year in office, which was 459 billion. As I have already pointed out, most of the budgetary stuff passed onto Obama was enacted by the Democrats with Obama's blessing and signed by Bush at Obama's behest. 2009 was pretty much all Obama, it was his economy, and still is, he needs to quit blaming Bush.

2 Replies

@hawkeye10,

hawkeye10 wrote:

Quote:
Obama plans to eventually install a pay-go system that is basically the same one used by Clinton to generate the large surpluses

Eventually being after his watch, which he knows will likely be overturned by whom ever sits in the chair next, and thus will never happen. Promises for tomorrow are worth not a thing. It is a rationalization for making a bad choice today, this promise that it will be fixed later.....by someone else....and is completely dishonest because Obama knows he cant control the next president.

The promises are worth something because a prior Dem president did it, and did it with the same leaders. The Reps have never done this (or anything else of any value).

0 Replies

@okie,

Goes to show how ignorant okie is about federal budgets, and who approved the budget that ran till Sept 2009.

0 Replies

@okie,

Quote:

As I have already pointed out, most of the budgetary stuff passed onto Obama was enacted by the Democrats with Obama's blessing and signed by Bush at Obama's behest.

This is the horseshit part. TARP was envisioned by Paulson and Bernake, Bush signed it, Obama had nothing to do with it whatsoever. BUSH and his crew added 350 billion to the debt in September 2008. For you to somehow try and say that this is Obama's fault or his responsibility is so ******* lame, Okie, it's not even funny.

BUSH signed TARP, his people came up with it, and to say that the crash and the response were somehow OBAMA'S fault? Unbelievable, you truly live in a fantasy world where facts don't matter. Nobody agrees with you on this at all.

Cycloptichorn

1 Reply

I just read that 52 percent of the public feel that Obama has, while president, ccomplished nothing, or virtually nothing. Nothing could be further from the truth.

"A week before he was sworn in, Obama jammed part two of the bank bailout down the throat of his own party " a $350 billion accomplishment.

Two days after he was sworn in, Obama banned the use of "harsh interrogation" and ordered the closing of Guantánamo.

A day later, Obama reversed George W. Bush's funding cutoff to overseas family planning organizations " saving millions of lives with the stroke of a pen.

Three days after that, Obama gave a green light to the California car-emissions standards that Bush had been blocking for six years " an important step on the road to cleaner air and a cooler planet.

Two weeks after that, Obama signed the stimulus bill " a $787 billion accomplishment.

Ten days after that, Obama formally announced America's withdrawal from Iraq.

A week later " we're in early March now " Obama erased Bush's decision to restrict federal funding for stem-cell research.

In April and June, Obama forced Chrysler and GM into bankruptcy.

In June, Obama reset the tone of our relations with the entire Arab world with a single speech " an accomplishment that the Bush administration failed to achieve despite a series of desperate PR moves (anyone remember Charlotte Beers?) and a "public diplomacy" budget of $1 billion a year.

Also in June, Obama unveiled the "Cash for Clunkers" program, a "socialist" giveaway that reanimated the corpse of our car industry " leading, for example, to the billion-dollar profit that Ford announced on Monday.

I haven't even mentioned Sonia Sotomayor, the Lilly Ledbetter Fair Pay Act, the order to release the torture memos, Obama's push for charter schools, his $288 billion tax cut, or the end of Bush's war on medical marijuana. Or the minor fact that he seems to have " with Bush's help, it must be said " stopped the financial collapse, revived the credit markets, and nudged the economy toward 3.5 percent growth in the last quarter.

Oh, and one more thing: President Obama is now a month or two from accomplishing the awesome and seemingly impossible task that eluded mighty presidents like FDR, LBJ, and WJC " health-care reform. "

Read more: http://www.esquire.com/the-side/richardson-report/obama-timeline-110309#ixzz0cttMEbQY

4 Replies

@Advocate,

Thanks for the update on Obama's accomplishments; we tend to put those on the back-burner when our concentration on health care reform and Haiti takes over our consciousness.

I believe that's one of the problems with our politics; many don't remember the good stuff when the media covers most of the bad repeatedly.

0 Replies

@Advocate,

Quote:

I just read that 52 percent of the public feel that Obama has, while president, ccomplished nothing, or virtually nothing. Nothing could be further from the truth.

so then your argument is that Obama has not sold his accomplishments.....I've got news for you, not accomplishing and not convincing the citizens that you have accomplished nets the same result politically. You lose you political capital, then you lose your job.

0 Replies

@Advocate,

An amusing list of self-contradictory and mostly specious claims. Truly worthy of a post by a non-thinking credulous true believer such as Advocate.

The Bush TARP program was an accomplished fact before Obama took office - "jamming it down the throat" of his party was unnecessary, irrelevant - and simply didn't happen.

Obama has replaced the now banned "harsh interrogations" for members of non-state organizations making war on the American people, with treatment of them as though they were petty criminals - instead of potential killers of hundreds or thousands. Moreover he has done so in the face of centuries of legal precedent governing such crimes.

Obama's "announcement" of our withdrawl from Iraq was just that ... the announcement of an already accomplished fact.

Obama didn't force GM and Chrysler into bankrupcy ... the economic circumstances of both companies did that. What Obama did was to use government power to steal the remaining assets of both companies from bondhoilders and stockholders with legitimate claims and transfer them to the Labor Union that contributed so much to the companys' fgailures.

The benefits of the much-touted "reset" of our relations with the Arab or Moslem world have so far been indetectable. Indeed the effects may have been harmful.

I could go on, but there seems little point.

Believers such as Advocate are impervious to facts.

1 Reply

@georgeob1,

georgeob, Your claim that those accomplishment are self-contradictory needs to be explained, because some of us don't see the contradictions. I'm somewhat familiar with the list, but don't remember if they ended up accomplishing what it claims. It would be interesting to learn the truth, because I'm a skeptic about Obama's first year.

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so, just checking in

obama is still president i see

some of you still hate him, some of you still like him

cool

as you were

3 Replies

@djjd62,

It seems most bad and good presidents last out their term, and sometimes bad ones get a second chance to screwup the whole world.

0 Replies

@djjd62,

And some of us are still not sure about him, but are willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, for now.

0 Replies

@djjd62,

He's not living up to expectations though. Shocking!

1 Reply

@Eorl,

Has any President ever lived up to expectations?

2 Replies

@Advocate,

Advocate, you listed a bunch of "accomplishments" that alot of people would consider total failures, or failed or wrong policies. For example, wasting over 700 billion as a stimulus plan that did not stimulate the economy, that is hilarious if it wasn't so ridiculous that you actually might list it as an accomplishment. You list another great accomplishment as "jamming" another $350 billion bailout down the throats of his own party and the entire country, good grief, are you sane? And we the taxpayers are supposed to support abortion in foreign countries, good grief, now you consider paying for the murder of the unborn in othe parts of the world an accomplishment?

I have only scratched the surface in regard to what could be said in response to your very bizarre idea of what an "accomplishment" might be.

0 Replies

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