Obama '08?

@old europe,

Nothing about Obama can be trusted - by okie.

0 Replies

@old europe,

No, I am not saying that. Where did you get that idea?

2 Replies

@okie,

There's no telling where ci. gets his ideas from.

It's a mystery to me.

0 Replies

@okie,

From your earlier post. See, one would think that you would be happy if the President or the majority party were to distance themselves from the more radical elements on the left side of the political spectrum. Instead you launch a tirade about how "leftists" are institutional liars who merely put on a show for the electorate.

Damned if they do, damned if they don't.

1 Reply

@old europe,

You are too funny, oe. Just because a politician distances himself from a person in no way indicates he will pursue different policies. Just because Obama distanced himself from the Reverend Wright does not indicate he now believes something different and will change his political direction. I thought you would know that? I am constantly surprised by how some people here need explanations.

2 Replies

@okie,

I think the point is, your writing makes it clear that Obama won't get credit from you for anything he does - short of changing his entire political philosophy and becoming a Republican.

This robs some legitimacy from your criticisms of him.

Cycloptichorn

1 Reply

@okie,

Yes, no doubt, a politician can distance himself from someone without changing his policies. The thing is that you don't actually have any examples of the alleged radical policies that you claim Obama is pursuing.

What it comes down to is this:

you know that Obama is pursuing secret extremist policies because of his former radical associations
he has distanced himself from those people, but you don't believe him due to his secret extremist policies
you know that Obama is pursuing secret extremist policies because of his former radical associations
etc.

0 Replies

Good evening. I mentioned numerous pages ago that there are only a couple of elections early next month that could be considered a reflection on sentiment on President Obama's 1st 10 months. One is the governor's race in NJ (where an independent may determine the outcome) and the other is the governor's race in my state of Virginia.
(I write this with full disclosure: I am a liberal Democrat. Caveat emptor).
Repub Bob McDonnell is challenging Dem Creigh Deeds. Governors in VA serve one 4 year term. McDonnell has about a 7-point lead in the polls and I don't see that changing much. Deeds got a bounce when a college thesis from 20 years ago by McDonnell seemed to suggest he had some pretty extreme ideas about gays and unmarried fornicators. I think the Deeds' camp backed off, deeming it to be a non-starter.
In VA the gov has little actual power. The part-time citizen legislature runs things. We switch from a Repub to Dem to Repub gov frequently based, perhaps, on personality. Neither of these guys has one of those.
Turnout on election day will be dismal. Dismal. There is almost no interest in this thing despite all of the money being spent.

Over to the A2K NJ bureau for thoughts on that race.

0 Replies

@Cycloptichorn,

cyclops and oe, just what has Obama done so far that has been good? The economy is tanking, the war in Afghanistan is not going well, but all he cares about is his government power grabbing Obama care, which a minority of voters favor going forward with. Also, the cash for clunker program was a waste, a real loser of a program, the deficit is at an all time high by far, the dollar is tanking, what else. Meanwhile, we have several radicals in the administration with very dubious credentials, the latest being Anita Dunn on record as admiring Chairman Mao, the communist that is responsible for tens of millions of deaths.

But if you think things are going great, I beg to differ, the country is in real trouble if this mess is not turned around.

2 Replies

@cicerone imposter,

Quote:

Also true is the fact that Bush was responsible for the killing of hundreds of thousands of innocent lives (Iraqis)

I think you are exaggerating.
According to this site...http://www.iraqbodycount.org/
the number is between 93,000 and 102,000.

1 Reply

@okie,

If the economy is tanking, it's strange that our stock market (and and world's) have been showing gains.

1 Reply

@cicerone imposter,

Wait, do you really find that strange? That the stock market is the method we should use to determine the strength of the economy?

1 Reply

@maporsche,

It's directly related; not necessarily on a timely basis, but corrections come about from how commerce is performing.

If you have bothered to keep up with the economic news, most economists have said that the recession has hit bottom.

Are you smarter than they are in economics?

1 Reply

@okie,

okie,

The economy isn't tanking. It tanked in the summer of 2008. Now it's just a matter how we reinvent ourselves. The current stock market rally is either a dead cat bouncing or fools rushing in hoping against hope that they can recover some of last year's losses. Any rally is worth being in while the prices are going up but the downside potential of this bear rally (there are no fundamentals to support a bull) is immense. Over the weekend Bernanke, Geithner, and Summers all made statements that the next step is to reign in the deficit. No kidding. Talk is cheap. I'm waiting for some meat.

Afghanistan -- Ask the former Soviet Union about the dilemmas of waging a diluted war in Afghanistan. It's going badly? That's not Obama's doing. It was destined to go badly as soon as we diluted the effort by invading Iraq.

"All he cares about...." is a falsehood. I don't think you have any basis of knowledge to back that statement up in the least. And your assessment that a minority of Americans support it is false.

Quote:

The public is split 40-40 on supporting or opposing the health care legislation, the poll found. An even split is welcome news for Democrats, a sharp improvement from September, when 49 percent of Americans said they opposed the congressional proposals and just 34 percent supported them. AP poll

.

Cash for clunkers, bailouts, and the deficit (driven by Way Too Much public debt) are, imo, mostly responsible for the smoke-and-mirrors that are driving up stock prices. They're creating hope and while we're on the precipice of economic disaster, hope may be the only thing that's keeping us from toppling off.

The dollar --- yep, the days of the dollar being the world's reserve currency are numbered. That's not Obama's sole doing either but he's certainly part of it.

Radicals in the administration. I'd rather have radicals than Bush/Cheney/Rove et al any day. One person's radical is another's crony.

3 Replies

@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

If you have bothered to keep up with the economic news, most economists have said that the recession has hit bottom.

Are you smarter than they are in economics?

I have bothered.

And I think even you're smarter than many of these 'economists'.

0 Replies

@JPB,

JPB wrote:

Cash for clunkers, bailouts, and the deficit (driven by Way Too Much public debt) are, imo, mostly responsible for the smoke-and-mirrors that are driving up stock prices. They're creating hope and while we're on the precipice of economic disaster, hope may be the only thing that's keeping us from toppling off.

The dollar --- yep, the days of the dollar being the world's reserve currency are numbered. That's not Obama's sole doing either but he's certainly part of it.

Radicals in the administration. I'd rather have radicals than Bush/Cheney/Rove et al any day. One person's radical is another's crony.

Exactly JPB. To say the stock market is a 'true' indicator of the success of the economy is laughable (for the reasons you mentioned).

0 Replies

@JPB,

JPB, You've hit on one of the biggest problem for our economy; the value of the dollar is tanking, and it will become a problem in the world marketplace. When people see the US dollar as monopoly money, it's value will sink lower.

That's the perfect precursor for inflation, and I've transferred over 60% of my YTD gains into bonds.

The government cannot keep interest rates at the current levels, because nobody will buy US treasuries to pay for all the government spending now going on.

The way I see it, it's only a matter of time.

Another indicator that I've not seen for awhile is the P/E ratios, an important indicator of how prices are rationally based on earnings. There are still good companies like Apple and Google, but the majority of big companies are still scaling back.

One thing is for certain; the future economy of our country will be leaner with less job opportunities for most workers. Retailers will have to run smart to stay in business, and pay scales will remain somewhat stagnant for a very long time.

Our generation was the last generation that had it so good; this trend in job loss and stagnation in pay and benefits have hit our children very hard. More children are living at home with their parents, and it's going to get worse for some years to come.

0 Replies

@mysteryman,

mysteryman wrote:

Quote:
Also true is the fact that Bush was responsible for the killing of hundreds of thousands of innocent lives (Iraqis)

I think you are exaggerating.
According to this site...http://www.iraqbodycount.org/
the number is between 93,000 and 102,000.

I agree, and Bush likely saved alot of lives, probably more than died, plus the people that died in Iraq were largely due to terrorist insurgents, suicide bombers, and other people that opposed freedom, liberty, and decency. Unfortunately, war causes death, example World War II, but does anyone oppose the idea that Hitler had to be stopped or the world would have suffered far far worse? Similarly, Saddam Hussein had shown himself to be a very bad apple and needed to be stopped for a number of reasons. Congress agreed, so it was not just Bush anyway.

1 Reply

@JPB,

JPB wrote:

okie,

The economy isn't tanking. ....

Lets take this point for starters. The fundamentals of the economy are tanking. The problems that brought us to this point are not being addressed. Obama has done nothing to help the private sector, or at least very little, while his stimulus has stimulated mostly government, which is not a long term fix for the economy. Plus Obama's policies place a damper on all future hopes of the private sector. He has nationalized a couple of car companies, he threatens to destroy medical insurance companies or the entire medical industry, he is a menace to the energy industry due to cap and trade and so forth, and frankly every industry due to tax policy and just an overall adversarial attitude toward business. I could elaborate, but in summary I am very discouraged and pessimistic with Obama in charge.

Quote:

Radicals in the administration. I'd rather have radicals than Bush/Cheney/Rove et al any day. One person's radical is another's crony.

I would take any crony compared to people that admire Chairman Mao. I will take it a step further, based upon what we are learning, I now am pretty convinced that Obama is one of the biggest radicals of the whole bunch. Maybe you like communists more than cronies, but I don't, JPB.

1 Reply

@okie,

Quote:

Lets take this point for starters. The fundamentals of the economy are tanking

the economy is being propped up on our kids charge card, which is going to run out soon. And still we are running above 15% unemployment, retirement reserves have been destroyed, the financial system is a disaster, and state governments are about to hit the wall.......everything is A OK here...

1 Reply

Related Topics

Quick Links

My Account

able2know