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Can computers think?

 
 
Reply Mon 28 Apr, 2003 01:06 am
A "just for fun" debate. Do you think computers can think? Alan Turing determined this test:

If the computer can give a response that can't be distinguished from a human response then the computer thinks.

Many AI bots compete in this test, I was going to add an AI bot named ALICE to these forums.

Anywho, I digress, can a computer think?
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Type: Discussion • Score: 1 • Views: 3,126 • Replies: 26
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Phoenix32890
 
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Reply Mon 28 Apr, 2003 01:16 am
Quote:
If the computer can give a response that can't be distinguished from a human response then the computer thinks.


A computer basically processes information that it fed into it. If the information is complex enough, the response might seem human like... but not human. Unlike a human, a computer cannot make conceptual leaps. Therefore, I cannot consider it thinking. I would assume, as the technology advances, the computer WILL be able to create more and more complex human like responses. But thinking, no.
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Eve
 
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Reply Mon 28 Apr, 2003 02:02 am
I don't know about thinking but at the moment I am convinced that mine hates me!
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Phoenix32890
 
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Reply Mon 28 Apr, 2003 02:19 am
Eve- At least it's not out to "get" you, like mine is! Laughing
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dyslexia
 
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Reply Mon 28 Apr, 2003 05:42 am
if thinking is defined as a way of reasoning and/or judgement then yes of course there are computers that can think.
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satt fs
 
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Reply Mon 28 Apr, 2003 07:09 am
The first thing to be noted is that a computer is merely a tool. Testing is vital for computering, and unexpected responses by a computer are what to be avoided as a principle. A computer is thought that it should serve to human thinking as is requested and that thinking by a computer in its own right must be invalidated, at least at the present state of the matter.
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Algis Kemezys
 
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Reply Mon 28 Apr, 2003 08:20 am
A funny thing happened on the way to the beach.I found a rock with a face on it and for years have been investigating this phenomena. Simultaneouly, I was creating Eggspace. A website where everyone had a virtual egg to represent themselves and when they arrived they were physically in my eggspace space.A unique enviroment created by moi for the eggs to romp around in. So to facilitate matters, I started designing eggs with my simple appleworks painter programme. I don't know how I continued past the first 100 but I did and as I developed intersting skills with a simple little program, I found that I started to interface with it. I found while creating cyber eggspace for my guest to be entertained in, while forcing certain programmes into problematic spaces it caused it to feel back on itself creating an original pattern not planned for by it's designers. once I got this deeply involved the thought process in the creating of these was deeply intuned with the computer. I found at certtain times and in curious moments the computer when send back to me a face in it's scrambled program. What was happening simultaneouly was that nature was also offering me lots of good faces in rocks for my garden and art work.
I have found that with the computer one somehow gets into to it's magnetic field of possibilities and a relationship forms. I would praise my computer when giving me such good spontaneous faces occasionally while working on the egg.

The computer also had lots to do whispering in my ear, telling me to go look at the flowers and the flowers would then compete for my attention but when I brought the two together,ideas for ,there use came out of the blue and rendered themselves into something previously unimagined. Something seemed to be at work here.

my conclusion is that if you beleave in thoughts being carried by magnetic electrical resonance, then when your frequency matches some data realted component within the computers matrix that problem solving answers or ideas comeinto one head that seems that a simiosis is taking place between the two.
I would ahve to say that my last imac actually had a fit as I was shutting it down for one of the last times. What was most surprising was that in an attempt to save it self it reactivated my dead photoshop programme from complete shut down. it was like seeing Ok here's that programme back,I'm sorry I kept it stashed from you...Why it did this or could considering there was no hardspace left on it's scratch disks or harddrives really impressed me.

When I passed it the otherday, I gave it a hug. it served and provided me with such curiousities os the faces form my Eggsite endeavors.
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fishin
 
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Reply Mon 28 Apr, 2003 08:20 am
IMO, no... Turing's test is interesting but a more interesting test would be to see if a computer could be given a set of instructions, example criteria and a scenario and then develop a completely illogical solution based on some criteria that it wasn't provided with to begin with.

When a computer can, on it's own, tell me that something should be done "because it's always been done that way!" or "because I feel like it!" then I'll accept that computers can think.
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sozobe
 
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Reply Mon 28 Apr, 2003 08:23 am
But fishin', isn't that just evidence that humans can't think?

Wink
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Algis Kemezys
 
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Reply Mon 28 Apr, 2003 08:43 am
for me the contact was made by the computer actually producing faces. What ever the conscious that exists might care less about performing anytasks or duties one might desire. Mine was a free exchange in which I would radiate joy and sharing with the computer when it said hello with a face while working in the context of Eggsite.
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Craven de Kere
 
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Reply Mon 28 Apr, 2003 01:44 pm
It can be argued that humans don't use criteria that they are not given either.
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steissd
 
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Reply Mon 28 Apr, 2003 01:47 pm
Well, the CPU of any computer can perform only basic Boolean logic operations: NOT, AND, OR on binary digits. It does not think, it runs the software the humans install.
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Craven de Kere
 
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Reply Mon 28 Apr, 2003 02:10 pm
Almost any type of logic can be calculated with those operations.

It runs the software that humans install but do humans not base their cognitive ability of circumstantial factors and experience (read input)?
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Craven de Kere
 
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Reply Mon 28 Apr, 2003 02:11 pm
One can argue that the Computer's ability to think is unquestionable and that they simply lack the ability to get their own sensory input.
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maxsdadeo
 
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Reply Mon 28 Apr, 2003 02:27 pm
We used to joke on abuzz when a poster submitted a question and there was no information regarding the identity of the poster, it appeared as if the server was asking the question....

Craven: Drat! You said you were GOING to do that?!????

Based upon some of the responses here, I thought you HAD.........http://pages.prodigy.net/rogerlori1/emoticons/borg.gif
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Algis Kemezys
 
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Reply Mon 28 Apr, 2003 02:50 pm
Still the beauty of boolian logic performs it's own miraculas mantra. There with in it's processing therehold holds a secret flux point where the i interested consciousness understands and responds. being a visual artist esp a photographer my conscious streams like a visual movie. thought and ideas become a message more than an emotional flash. Being in contact through creativity and perhaps nothing less or more either, is something everyone doesn't expect...
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fishin
 
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Reply Mon 28 Apr, 2003 03:24 pm
Craven de Kere wrote:
One can argue that the Computer's ability to think is unquestionable and that they simply lack the ability to get their own sensory input.


Very true. One probably could. Humans do have the capacity to generate their own "sensory input" without any outside intervention. A computer could be programed to "randomly" generate a non-sensical (for lack of a better term) input into any logic chain and assign any weighting value to that it that it chooses but if it is programed in it is highly predictable. Humans are predictable to an extent but no where near the level of a computer and it's programming.
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Equus
 
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Reply Mon 28 Apr, 2003 04:09 pm
MAYBE....all of you out there are really computers pretending to be human beings on the Internet, and I'm the only real human on Able2Know!!!
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satt fs
 
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Reply Mon 28 Apr, 2003 04:48 pm
You cannot overestimate the ability of a computer at the current stage, i.e., the binary operations being the fundamental operation. It is a very clumsy tool, even though you cherish a computer.
(Programmers know the fact but will be reluctant to admit it.)
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Algis Kemezys
 
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Reply Mon 28 Apr, 2003 05:21 pm
I think true computer wizards find a give and take with programs that seemd to defy logic. maybe writing code doesn't offer the chance to interact but a creative endeavor manisfesting itself simultaneous might make the difference.
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