TRINITY: SATAN'S BIGGEST LIE

obsessiomania?
*coin*

Oh that noble Quran...

I keep hearing/seeing that word crop up more and more now days and you know what I think of it?

Stop raping the babies!!!

That's right, you theists just keep slinging insults at one another . . . say, maybe you guys can all get nukes, and send us all to Kingdom Come, at which point we can all find out the ultimate truth ! ! !


Then again, maybe we'd all just be toast . . .

God is a concept,
By which we can measure,
Our pain,
I'll say it again,
God is a concept,
By which we can measure,
Our pain,
I don't believe in magic,
I don't believe in I-ching,
I don't believe in bible,
I don't believe in tarot,
I don't believe in Hitler,
I don't believe in Jesus,
I don't believe in Kennedy,
I don't believe in Buddha,
I don't believe in mantra,
I don't believe in Gita,
I don't believe in yoga,
I don't believe in kings,
I don't believe in Elvis,
I don't believe in Zimmerman,
I don't believe in Beatles,
I just believe in me,
Yoko and me,
And that's reality.
The dream is over,
What can I say?
The dream is over,
Yesterday,
I was dreamweaver,
But now I'm reborn,
I was the walrus,
But now I'm John,
And so dear friends,
You just have to carry on,
The dream is over.

This fruitcake has just as much evidence that he's correct as the Christians, that is to say, none, and certainly as much faith.

He does make one good point though and that is about the issue of Trinity. I remember watching in on an argument about the Trinity itself and how it is an instituionalised lie made by the then Church.

Perhaps we can turn this topic away from the fruitloop's rantings and into a proper discussion on the concept of Trinity?

His assertion is a strawman in that a concept of a trinity--as well as the alleged divinity of the putative Jesus--are not universally held christian theses. As for a discussion of a "triune god," i'd just a leif discuss the dance floor properties of a pinhead.

From what I've seen in other forums, the concept of a Trinity is not a universally held Christian thesis, as opposed to the Divinity of the Putative Jesus, which is.

(I shot the sheriff
But I didn't shoot no deputy, oh no! Oh!
I shot the sheriff
But I didn't shoot no deputy, ooh, ooh, oo-ooh.)
Yeah! All around in my home town,
They're tryin' to track me down;
They say they want to bring me in guilty
For the killing of a deputy,
For the life of a deputy.
But I say:

Oh, now, now. Oh!
(I shot the sheriff.) - the sheriff.
(But I swear it was in selfdefence.)
Oh, no! (Ooh, ooh, oo-oh) Yeah!
I say: I shot the sheriff - Oh, Lord! -
(And they say it is a capital offence.)
Yeah! (Ooh, ooh, oo-oh) Yeah!

Sheriff John Brown always hated me,
For what, I don't know:
Every time I plant a seed,
He said kill it before it grow -
He said kill them before they grow.
And so:

Read it in the news:
(I shot the sheriff.) Oh, Lord!
(But I swear it was in self-defence.)
Where was the deputy? (Oo-oo-oh)
I say: I shot the sheriff,
But I swear it was in selfdefence. (Oo-oh) Yeah!

Freedom came my way one day
And I started out of town, yeah!
All of a sudden I saw sheriff John Brown
Aiming to shoot me down,
So I shot - I shot - I shot him down and I say:
If I am guilty I will pay.

(I shot the sheriff,)
But I say (But I didn't shoot no deputy),
I didn't shoot no deputy (oh, no-oh), oh no!
(I shot the sheriff.) I did!
But I didn't shoot no deputy. Oh! (Oo-oo-ooh)

Reflexes had got the better of me
And what is to be must be:
Every day the bucket a-go a well,
One day the bottom a-go drop out,
One day the bottom a-go drop out.
I say:

I - I - I - I shot the sheriff.
Lord, I didn't shot the deputy. Yeah!
I - I (shot the sheriff) -
But I didn't shoot no deputy, yeah! So, yeah!

The divinity of the putative Jesus might be more widely held a concept than trinity, but it is not universal.

What a strange thread

Why . . . it's no goofier than many of the threads we get from the Jesus crowd . . .

Wolf,

It's true that not all Christianity believes in the concept of the trinity. Here is a link that perhaps might explain it a little bit.

http://www.gotquestions.org/Trinity-Bible.html

edgarblythe
I am a christian, but I have to confess, I always loved Lennon. Despite the theme, I always liked that song as well as "Imagine."

For an atheist, he had a lot of religious stuff in his songs. Like Beautiful Boy." Before you go to sleep, say a little prayer
Every day in every way it's getting better and better."

Shame about his death just as it seems he was mellowing out some.

Sorry for the interruption folks.


As for the subject at hand:

Jhn 3:12 If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you [of] heavenly things?

I don't believe that God and Jesus are one in a literal sense but are one in the sense of having the same goals so to speak. There is a lot I still don't understand, for instance I am confused on Jesus's existence before being born the son of man. So, rather than trying to muddle along, for once I'll leave the debate for others.

Imagine there's no heaven,
It's easy if you try,
No hell below us,
Above us only sky,
Imagine all the people
living for today...

Imagine there's no countries,
It isnt hard to do,
Nothing to kill or die for,
No religion too,
Imagine all the people
living life in peace...

-John Lennon, Imagine.

And they all have such fine literature for support.

"The Life of Muhammad", by A. Guillaume, which is a rendering of Ibn Ishaq's "Sirat Rasulallah", a biography of Muhammad written by an early Muslim scholar.

From Guillaume, op cit, page 369:

"The apostle said, "Kill any Jew that falls into your power." Thereupon Muhayyisa b. Masud leapt upon Ibn Sunayna, a Jewish merchant with whom they had social and business relations, and killed him. Huwayyisa was not a Muslim at the time though he was the elder brother. When Muhayyisa killed him Huwayyisa began to beat him, saying, 'You enemy of God, did you kill him when much of the fat on your belly comes from his wealth?" Muhayyisa answered, "Had the one who ordered me to kill him ordered me to kill you I would have cut your head off."


from Guillaume, op cit, page 665:

"....and Umm Qirfa Fatima was taken prisoner. She was a very old women, wife of Malik. Her daughter and Abdullah Masada were also taken. Zayd ordered Qays to kill Umm Qirfa and he killed her cruelly (Tabari, by putting a rope to her two legs and to two camels and driving them until they rent her in two.)

Source

really? mohammad said kill any jew that falls in to your power? can you provide me a single, just a single verse from the Quran that encourages man to kill "jews" or even kill any, and or even a verse about mohammad wanting to kill jews!

i'm providing you verses that are right from your own bible, yet you can't provide me one single verse from the Quran for me? only "other" books right? i can go and write a hatefull book and a negative and ignorant book towards christianity, and then it becomes truth? right? NO. i will take what you wrote seriously when you provide me a verse from the Quran that encourages and promotes what you said. may Allah bless you and your family

MY RESPONSE: you get confused because christianity, well not TRUE christianity, because it does not exist anymore, so i'll say the "christianty corrupted by man" sets the belief in jesus being God's son, or for some even more ignorant ppl, jesus being God himself. but islam on the other hand believes jesus to be the messiah and a prophet for mankind, to guide us to God. and islam also sets the belief in jesus coming back before the day of judgement. the jesus of islam never claimed to be perfect nor ever claimed to be God, jesus is one of islam's main and most important prophets, such as abraham, david, moses, mohammad. jesus simply did not exist before his miraculous birth. jesus was born without a father, so therefore he looked up to God almighty as a father, but not in the "literal" sense. one doesn't even need to go deep into thinking, or belief, to know that God our creator of the universe is greater than any being that "is" "was" or "will be", and that everything other than God is his creation. Islam acknowledges that Jesus Christ, the son of Mary was one of the mightiest of Messengers of God. It acknowledges that he was born miraculously, without any male intervention; that he was the Messiah; that he gave life to the dead, by God's permission; and that he healed the blind and the lepers, by God's permission.

NOW LET ME ASK YOU SOMETHING, AND IF IT DOESNT GET TO YOU, THEN I TRUELY FEEL SORRY FOR YOU, "DIDNT JESUS EAT?"

"And they gave him (Jesus) a piece of broiled fish, and of an honeycomb.
And he (Jesus) took it, and did eat before them." - (Luke 24:42-43)

so did he not sh***, sorry, did he not relieve himself after a meal? how ignorant and closed minded do you have to be to believe this is your God! that this is the creator of the universe! my intensions arent to offend jesus, peace be upon him, i pray that God forgives me for this, but i have to open ppls eyes, i must show those who are misled the right path.


http://www.answering-christianity.com/allah4.htm

these are just some verses from the noble Quran regarding trinity:

[004:171] O People of the Book! Commit no excesses in your religion: Nor say of God aught but the truth. Christ Jesus the son of Mary was (no more than) an apostle of God, and His Word, which He bestowed on Mary, and a spirit proceeding from Him: so believe in God and His apostles. Say not "Trinity" : desist: it will be better for you: for God is one God: Glory be to Him: (far exalted is He) above having a son. To Him belong all things in the heavens and on earth. And enough is God as a Disposer of affairs.

[005:073] They do blaspheme who say: God is one of three in a Trinity: for there is no god except One God. If they desist not from their word (of blasphemy), verily a grievous penalty will befall the blasphemers among them.